Father asks kids to list Mother's faults, and emails these to Mother

[Mums38]

Mother and Father are living apart. Father gets kids on Tuesday evenings and alternate weekends.

During the last weekend visit, Father asked kids to write down all the bad points about Mother. Then he emailed that list to mother.

-Can mother now take legal action ?

-If so, what is the charge ?

Thanks

On the top of legal advice and keeping all the information, I’d consider support/counselling for the dcs too.

This⬆️ please do not ignore it, this is dreadful behaviour by their Dad!

I don't think you should ignore it either - it's emotionally abusive for the kids, and for you, and as others have said, potentially start of a pattern of parental alienation.

I think you should write back to him to say that it was very wrong of him to pressure the kids into criticising you, he is emotionally abusing them etc.

And keep a record, if a pattern emerges, you can get legal advice.

Maybe discuss with your youngest's teachers, kids could feel guilty.

I think I'd email back

'I've sent your email to my solicitor who informs me that this constitutes parental alienation on your part and the courts take a very dim view of it. This behaviour is not in the children's best interests and it is difficult to see what rational parent would behave in the way you have just done. In future, if you wish to contact me I suggest you do so through the proper legal channels and via my solicitor. Alternatively, you might wish to speak to your doctor'.

I think it can be a sign of something very vindictive in this man. Children shouldn't be in this position. And a man who does this and thinks it is okay is a problem.

By all means respond but make it very business like. State that's it's wrong to put the children in this position. State that it should not happen again. End.

One day you will be talking to a lawyer and your ex will have children that hate him. I suspect he doesn't like them all that much to do this and that's why you need to put your feelings aside because he wants that emotion from you.

If you divorced because he was in any way emotionally abusive, you are on notice that your children are taking your place.

First email him saying:

'I would like to request that we keep our exchanges respectful and avoid correspondence with the intention of upsetting the other. Please do not send me anything like what was in this email again'

Then :

'I have already asked you before to stop sending me correspondence with the intention of upsetting me. Despite asking this before, you continue to do this and I find it too much- please stop.'

If he does it again consider applying for a non molestation order.

(That's just advice to stop him upsetting you. In terms of what impact you think it's had on the kids you could add in another sentence like

Please can we both agree to speak positively and respectfully about each other to the children. It is to their detriment if they are forced to answer negative questions about the other parent and worrying for them. If you would like to raise an issue about our parenting please put it in writing respectfully to me.'

This is all good evidence for you if he ever goes for more time with them and you need to get a lives with order

Are you sure the email is from the kids and not just the father being an arse?
was it a copy of a photo of your kids writing or was it typed?
If typed i’d say he’s just playing games and it’s his list. I can’t imagine children wanting to write such a list about their own mother, even if their father told them to.

I wouldn't respond to him at all. Speak to a solicitor about parental alienation, it is not acceptable for him to put pressure on the children in this way to criticise their mother. Also, speak to your children and explain that they haven't done anything wrong but that it was wrong of their dad to ask them to do this. Your solicitor can advise you on any steps you may be able to take.

This is parental alienation. You could take the matter to court if you wanted, but it takes a lot for the court to decide a parent shouldn’t have contact and rarely happens. How do the children feel about their time with their dad? Have they said anything about this exercise they did with their father? Given their ages to some extent it’s recognised they can “vote with their feet”.

Didn't want to read and not say anything ..I'm so sorry that happened to you but was happy to read you and your son have a great relationship.

I have no experience in this OP but I pray that you find a solution and your DC are not impacted by their oaf of a father.

That's despicable.
Do you have a CAO?
Do the children willing go to their father? They are all old enough to voice their opinions.
They may well have very conflicting feelings.

When my ex transferred his emotional abuse from me to our son I went back to court to amend the Order. I did seek legal advice but represented myself.

I would not enter into any discussion with him or the children. If the children raise it with you, I would simply acknowledge that you received the email.

He is used them as pawns.

If he does it again consider applying for a non molestation order.

The bar for non-molestation orders is pretty high, it's unlikely this incident would be enough.

Is he very dim?

I would give it to my lawyer. But if you really want to answer go for, "thank you for the written proof of parental alienation and child abuse. I look forward to seeing you in court",

Pretty much this.

It is clear parental alienation.

And you now have it in writing.

Do you fancy changing custody arrangements? That is about you could with it. You can’t claim money from him. Although…perhaps go to court to get him to pay for a family psychologist to help your relationship with children after his attempt at alienation?

Possibly not needed and possibly more damaging to the children but definitely an up yours to the ex.

From my own experience with my parents, i would be very concerned that he’s emotionally abusing your kids and they feel trapped and scared, and are being asked to do things they don’t want to do. I would consult a solicitor for advice as a next step.

Wow. That is really low.

If I were this mum, I would absolutely take this as teaching moment with my kids. Very calmly I’d start with:

“Kids, let’s have a little sit down please. Your father sent me an email listing all the things about me that you don’t like. I’m not the least bit angry with you. I’m your mother and I want you to know that I love you no matter what. Like any human being I am not perfect and I understand there are things I could improve on, so let’s go through this list and talk it through. I want to try and be the best mother I can be.”

And really think about their points and come up with constructive ways of addressing them (if they are reasonable and true).

After that, I’d probably continue with “Right, can someone tell me why your father asked you to come up with this list in the first place? And do we think making such a list was a kind or useful thing to do?”

There’s no getting around the fact that he’s an asshole. But it might be an interesting exercise for the kids to think about whether this was a kind thing to do. I find most children, even from an early age, have a good sense of what is kind and fair and hopefully just by asking some probing questions they will think twice about engaging this kind of activity. Hopefully it will end with them coming to the conclusion that talking about others behind their back in a negative way is not kind and if the kids do have a particular issue with their mum they should bring it up with her directly. I would want my kids to feel safe telling me about anything.

Then, as another user suggested I’d end it with a “let’s say 3 nice things we like/appreciate” about everyone family member. Including the dad. I thought this suggestion was great.

I would then email the dad with the 3 nice things they said about their dad and say. “Thanks for your email. We did a similar exercise here but instead I asked them what good qualities they like about you. Here they are.” And leave it at that. Hopefully he will be ashamed of his behaviour. But if he comes back with anything snide just ignore it. You want to come across as faultless and whiter than white.

In the meantime, I’d definitely keep logs of all these kinds of behaviours. If they stack up you’ll want to share them with your lawyer / other professional.

Absolutely would not be “just ignoring it” why are women constantly being told to ignore things, and to “be the bigger person”. start logging everything he does and I’d be tempted to contact social services and if the school has a welfare officer, I’d contact them too. Would be seriously tempted to stop contact as well.

Don’t email back a joke reply or a tit for tat. If you later need to use this as evidence any response could be weaponised against you. I would keep a journal and evidence at this stage. Then speak to a solicitor when you have more evidence.

This, except last line - no need for that.

but solicitor is best way.

Ignore completely but print and keep as evidence in case of legal action in future.

My ex does this shit to me, even 10 years on. He messaged dd18 just after Christmas with a list of everything I ever did wrong and why I’m such a bad person. He’s very confused as to why she no longer speaks to him. Ds16 is also on the verge of going nc with him. They are both so sick of his shit. I was so traumatised by his behaviour leading up to and after our break up that I didn’t do anything about it when the dcs were younger and I do regret it. Please don’t ignore it. Don’t reply to him, he is waiting for your reply with bated breath and any further interaction about it will end up upsetting you, but do log the behaviour with ss or the school. Maybe speak to women’s aid. This is a form of abuse and they are really helpful and will be able to advise you on what the best course of action is.

I'd speak to the solicitor about this.
Parental alienation is very serious, it happened to our neighbour He was very involved in his children's lives and now hasn't seen them in 6 years. One day they will realise that this is what happened I'm sure, but in the meantime he has lost all this time with his children.

that sounds appalling, for the children,
it does need taking forward