Stay at home mum getting divorced, need advice

[LittleMissMaghribi]

Hi everyone, I am possibly looking at the option of divorcing my husband and first need some advice.

I am a Moroccan national with Moroccan citizenship. I married my husband at the end of 2015 and we had 2 sons whilst I lived in Morocco.

My husband applied for a settlement visa for me which was granted this month and I am now in the UK.

I went to my cousins house rather than go to my husband, and I don't have any income, benefits, or job.

My husband has a job that brings in around £35,000 a year before tax.

He doesn't own a home and has about £15,000 in assets (mainly savings with about £4000 in stocks and shares) and about £10,000 of liabilities (mainly credit card debts), so a networth of about £5,000.

If I divorce him, will he be legally required to pay any of his salary to me during the divorce proceedings, so I can pay my own rent and expenses? And how about after divorce?

He also has a pension of about £20,000 if that makes a difference but is nowhere near retirement age (we are both early thirties).

After divorce, would he be required to share his salary with me and roughly how much do you think he would have to share?

My visa conditions state that I cannot claim benefits, so would not be entitled to government support, and I am not sure about if I would be able to find work. I have a degree in sociology but don't have a lot of work experience.

Since my sons have British nationality, I am looking at changing my visa to a parent visa, since I don't think I can stay on a settlement visa if we divorce. Would I be entitled to benefits?

Does anyone have experience of being the stay at home mum without an income during divorce and were you entitled to some of your husbands salary in the divorce proceedings (before and after), and was it enough to live on without additional income from benefits or work?

Please let me know your experiences in how the finances might work out in such a situation. I am a bit stressed. We are not really getting on at the moment and I need a plan B for how I can live if we can't live together going forwards.

Also, we are not currently living together. I am staying with a relative. Am I better off living with him and does that increase my rights during a divorce if we share a house? in the case of a divorce, if we are renting a property, does it matter who's name is on the rental documents, and would he be the one required to leave or me if he pays the rent, and would he still need to pay the rent for me and our sons even if he moved out?

Please let me know what my rights and responsibilities are.

Thank you for your help.

And what job can the OP get near London that produces a large enough income for a house, council Tax, water, gas, electric, clothes, transport etc and of course childcare!!

The OP should go back because here her and her children face absolute poverty with zero help!

If OP were a white Akrikaaner, with 2 British by descent kids and an English husband, I doubt she'd have had the same "reception" and been told to take the kids back to S.A

My response would have been exactly the same.

This is a woman who brought 2 children to the UK with no money, no job, no home and no prospects of getting any benefits .

Her husband is not interested

And the op looks down her nose at jobs she could actually get.

And seems more interested in gaining revenge that actually looking at her situation.

Op is also under the impression that the world owes her and courts will make her ex hand over 1/2 his salary each week

Oh...and a decently paid job with zero work experience or work history.

When you post can you let me know because I would love to apply for that!!!

Having read most of the thread OP, I think you need to take legal advice very very very quickly.

While you are not entitled to benefits your husband is, by getting custody of your two children, by whatever means, he could, potentially be entitled to a council house, tax credits, child benefits, council tax reductions, housing benefit. Meanwhile your visa gets revoked and you get sent back to Morocco without your children, who are left with a man they don't know.

I hate the way this thread is turning into an (implicit) version of 'let's attack the immigrant for trying to get something for nothing.'
Exactly, very eye opening. If OP was a British woman, or an immigrant from a white-majority, English speaking country, there would have been an outpouring of sympathy, advice to find a shit-hot lawyer, go and check what you are entitled to etc.

At no point the OP said, or even hinted, that she intends claiming benefits. Yet more than half of all recent posts are along the lines: "go home, we TAXPAYERS don't want to support you".

Oh...and a decently paid job with zero work experience or work history.
When you post can you let me know because I would love to apply for that!!!
So you are exactly in the same boat as the OP, with zero work experience or history (presumably, also being a British national), but still were slinging mud at her on the previous page for "not contributing to the society" and "intending to claim every penny available". Charming.

ContraceptionIsMyFriend what makes you say I am about to get issues with the HO?

Marifisa, you said that the home office legally requires him to provide for me whilst we are married. Does that mean that legally at the moment whilst we are married, he should be providing me rent, food etc?

What are the consequences to him if he does not do this, and is there any way to enforce this?

You cannot “enforce” anything on him. He is not legally responsible for you, you are a grown adult and are responsible for yourself. On the other hand, all five of his children are his equal responsibility. You need to talk to him and see if between the two of you, you can afford/ organise some childcare to allow you to work. You seem very entitled but you are now living in a country where women support themselves and you need to get a job.

Also, can people please explain how they are calculating Child Maintenance to be around £200 a month?

I put his details into the following calculator and it's coming out closer to £500 or £600:

www.gov.uk/calculate-your-child-maintenance/y

The options I have selected are as follows:
He will pay for 2 children
Salary is about £720 a week before taxes
He is not in receipt of any benefits

I am not sure what to put in for if he has other children in his household etc so am trying different scenarios but none of them are coming out as £200 a month.

Can you please explain how you made your calculations?

No, littlemiss, my wording was misleading, sorry. What I meant was that the Home Office won't approve a spousal visa unless the sponsor (in this case your husband) can prove that he has enough funds to support you. So the assumption is that he will be supporting you. But there is no way to enforce this legally now that you're here. In fact, if the Home Office learns that you aren't living together, their first move would probably be to revoke the visa (as others have said) and have you deported. They are actively looking for people to deport -- that's the current immigration climate. As people have said to you repeatedly, you're in a very vulnerable position. You really really need some proper legal advice.

He has five children, not two. That will significantly decrease his maintenance to you.

Also, if he was to quit his job so he no longer had income, would he still be obligated to pay everything that is agreed in the divorce or could he effectively dodge paying?

Do you think he is likely to do this?

I think most people said about £400, based on his earning 35k and having 3 other children he probably lives with.

But does it matter? You can't live on that anyway, and there are quite a few ways he can wriggle out of paying, or delaying at least.

And all he has to do is tell the home office you are divorcing and you will be removed anyway.

You said something about your family not expecting to support you your whole life if you return to Morocco. Why are you expecting someone else would support you there? Surely you can work in your home country?

I really don't think the OK is taking on board anything we are trying to tell her. There is no recourse in her situation to the benefit system and the likelihood of her actually getting any child maintenance is slim to none. Op you seem to be fixated on the idea that if you just hang around long enough then someone will pay for your house / bills / living expenses while you sit at home and do nothing. The cold reality is that you aren't entitled to government support and.your children's father won't be giving you a penny. Even if he is ordered to pay child maintenance by the time that cms take into account his living circumstances and three other children You aren't going to be awarded much at all.

You need to get a job and quickly.

Child maintenance is calculated for all his dependent children then split 2/5, 3/5. They have to leave him enough money for rent, utilities, travel to work and food do even men with many kids have to be left with a certain amount of money.

He had obviously lied to you about his lifestyle but I still think unless you attempt to live with him, you will have immigration problems and the worst case scenario is that he fights for the kids to stay here and you are unable to support yourself on a parent visa. Did you intend to leave him straight away though, or was it due to the living arrangements?

fedup21, I don't really know if he will quit his job to avoid paying anything, or if he will try to fight paying something, or if he will just pay what he needs to pay.

I am just looking at different scenarios to see possible outcomes from situation.

My understanding of my situation is a lot clearer from this discussion.

Can someone please advice what options I need to put in for the child maintenence calculator, and what I am likely to get?

Some people are saying I wont get anything, some £200, some £400.

Just need a clear idea on what I might get. If I plan to survive by myself then it's important to know exactly what I can and can't get and what I will need to provide for myself.

@silvercuckoo Very incorrect. I've worked consistently since I was 15. I have a skilled full time job with awesome bonus scheme.
My point was your talking about a mythical extraordinarily paid job that OP can walk into when realistically she wouldn't be a strong candidate at all.

Also the only benefit we qualify for is CB.

It doesn't have to be charming. It has to be realistic. Bottom line how can the OP earn enough money to support herself and her children?

You can not rely on any CM. The system is disgustingly flawed.
Firstly they'll mess you about if he doesn't pay. You could go months without getting a single penny.

How will you support yourself during those months?
Then he could move jobs or quit. And then it starts all over again.

It is not as simple as filling out a form and then the money going into your account.

You can have people on here coming on saying everyone is racist. It's bullshit. No one has been racist. People are genuinely concerned about your children.

You're an adult. Do what you want. Make what mistakes you want I honestly couldn't care.
But your children are at risk and you don't seem to be taking that seriously at all.

Hi OP, in your position I would assume that you will get nothing from him, and look for work accordingly. Then anything you are entitled to/might get would be a bonus. That would be my starting point, and I speak as someone who has a 21 year old whose father has never paid a penny in maintenance.

As others have said, you are educated and articulate and evidently very determined. I would be directing these excellent qualities towards finding a job and assessing how realistic it is for you to stay here.

Some people are saying I wont get anything, some £200, some £400.

Exactly-your situation is extremely complex and depends on different things happening. We are not experts and that is why most of the replies have been telling you to see a lawyer or the CAB.

If he gives up his job or refuses to pay, you will probably get nothing. If he divorces you, you will probably lose your visa and have to leave and get nothing.

Does it matter massively if you’re going to get £0, £200 or £400 a month. If you don’t intend to work and won’t qualify for any benefits, you probably can’t afford to live on any of those amounts.

OP, is your marriage really beyond reconciliation? If you were living with your husband, even in a shared house, it would make things much easier for you both financially and for your legal visa status. Is the problem that you don't wish to live in a shared house? Unfortunately your husband has no choice as he cannot afford anything else in London at least. Many immigrants do initially have to start off in shared accommodation before moving on to better things.

If your relationship is beyond saving, and sadly from your comments it appears that may be the case, then you will have to work very hard if you chose to remain in the UK.

You're still putting the cart before the horse here OP by trying to calculate CMS payments.

You can't get CMS until you're divorced. If you divorce, your spousal visa will be revoked and you will be deported.

So if you want to stay in the UK post-divorce, you need a parent visa. I'm not sure you will be able to get a parent visa as you don't currently have sufficient funds to support yourself and your children have not lived the UK until now. That's why you need to speak to an immigration solicitor who can realistically advise you as to what your options are.

Reconciliation is not beyond hope. I plan to sit down with him soon and try to see what the path forwards is.

But before I do, I need to be completely clear what my legal rights and responsibilities are, which is why this discussion has been very useful to me in helping me explore ideas and figure the different scenarios out.

I will also start job searching and making other preparations for single life.

That way, I am preparing for every eventuality.

Let’s step back a little from the specific situation and discuss broader issues. OP has made a mistake. She has gotten involved with a man who has no money, doesn’t seem overly committed to her or their children. Now these errors have been occurring over a number of years. There is no shame or problem in making errors, we all do as this is human behaviour. Now the secret to success, after you have made an error, is to recognise you made an error and see where you went wrong and ensure you don’t make the same error (or similar) again. Stop looking outwards at other people. Look inwards. You have got a lot of good advice on here. You are in a bad situation, but at the same time you could turn this ship around and make a success of it. You are now in the UK, where you have the possibility of getting a good job. You have two healthy children who have the possibility of getting a very decent free education. You and your children have the possibility of getting (and having) British passports, which have a value. Life can be amazing and you don’t need your husband, you can do this by yourself. In fact, your husband doesn’t sound very bright and, with all the best intentions in the world, he was always going to weigh you down. Who has five children in London with a salary of £35/year? OP you alone can take stock of all the advantages you do have and capitalise on them. Be smart.

OP, I think some people here have been very harsh with you but you really do need to listen to the sensible and kind advice that you've been given. Shouting at the OP to get a job is ignoring all the barriers she has such as no work history, no childcare etc

Your situation here is really precarious.
You are going to massively struggle to earn enough to support you and two children without childcare help and maintenance.

Even if you get the maintenance there is nothing to stop him dicking you about for years. Changing jobs, being self employed etc

You can't stay where you are living so you're going to need a deposit and rent in advance. You'll struggle to get a private rented place with no credit history, references etc

Your husband is clearly an absolute arsehole so you can't rely on him doing anything for you or the kids.

Because of the benefits system and the fucked up priorities of society it's really hard to manage as a single parent on a low income and that's with the top up benefits. You don't even have that buffer.

I totally get your reasons for coming here and I can see that you were probably hoping things would be different when you got here but you've been fed a lie and your life is going to be impossibly hard.

You need to realise that you and you alone can sort this now and you need to make some sensible decisions. Your fixation with getting revenge is distracting and futile. As a PP said, you don't have any power in this situation, I wish you did but you don't.

Sounds like his ex has possibly been as much of a victim of his bullshit as you have so don't blame her. She's probably just trying to do her best by her kids like you are.

I know you don't want to and I have some understanding of the shame you may face by returning home but actually this is still the least shit option for you and your children. Please don't commit them to a childhood of poverty. It's miserable.