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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Stay at home mum getting divorced, need advice

474 replies

LittleMissMaghribi · 29/05/2019 11:12

Hi everyone, I am possibly looking at the option of divorcing my husband and first need some advice.

I am a Moroccan national with Moroccan citizenship. I married my husband at the end of 2015 and we had 2 sons whilst I lived in Morocco.

My husband applied for a settlement visa for me which was granted this month and I am now in the UK.

I went to my cousins house rather than go to my husband, and I don't have any income, benefits, or job.

My husband has a job that brings in around £35,000 a year before tax.

He doesn't own a home and has about £15,000 in assets (mainly savings with about £4000 in stocks and shares) and about £10,000 of liabilities (mainly credit card debts), so a networth of about £5,000.

If I divorce him, will he be legally required to pay any of his salary to me during the divorce proceedings, so I can pay my own rent and expenses? And how about after divorce?

He also has a pension of about £20,000 if that makes a difference but is nowhere near retirement age (we are both early thirties).

After divorce, would he be required to share his salary with me and roughly how much do you think he would have to share?

My visa conditions state that I cannot claim benefits, so would not be entitled to government support, and I am not sure about if I would be able to find work. I have a degree in sociology but don't have a lot of work experience.

Since my sons have British nationality, I am looking at changing my visa to a parent visa, since I don't think I can stay on a settlement visa if we divorce. Would I be entitled to benefits?

Does anyone have experience of being the stay at home mum without an income during divorce and were you entitled to some of your husbands salary in the divorce proceedings (before and after), and was it enough to live on without additional income from benefits or work?

Please let me know your experiences in how the finances might work out in such a situation. I am a bit stressed. We are not really getting on at the moment and I need a plan B for how I can live if we can't live together going forwards.

Also, we are not currently living together. I am staying with a relative. Am I better off living with him and does that increase my rights during a divorce if we share a house? in the case of a divorce, if we are renting a property, does it matter who's name is on the rental documents, and would he be the one required to leave or me if he pays the rent, and would he still need to pay the rent for me and our sons even if he moved out?

Please let me know what my rights and responsibilities are.

Thank you for your help.

OP posts:
PicsInRed · 29/05/2019 17:23

OP, this is the Visa you need.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/application-to-settle-in-uk-form-setdv

You may get some maintenance but, realistically you will need to find work as that is expected in the UK.

People, please, go easy on her. Her kids are British Citizens, they will be coming here one day, wouldn't you prefer they're raised here? The OP has excellent English, a private and University education, if she works she'll do well. All this UK going to the dogs business, there's dogs and dogs. Lots of people want to live and raise their children here for safety and standard of living. Please don't patronize the OP by sneering at the decision she has made to attempt to improve her children's lives. Their marriage may not be our cup of tea, but it WAS a marriage, her children ARE British, and the focus now needs to be on making this work for the kids - which is not found in returning their mother to Morocco.

Mummy0ftwo12 · 29/05/2019 17:35

Hope you can find a job OP, set your sights high

greenwaterbottle · 29/05/2019 18:02

Yea they're married but it's hard to see a marriage of love, nothing that I've read implies love.

magicBrenda · 29/05/2019 18:05

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

TreadingThePrimrosePath · 29/05/2019 18:26

Pics, how is it better for her children to be raised in the UK on or under the poverty line by a homeless single parent with uncertain legal status rather than in a relatively affluent, mc home in Morocco with supportive grandparents?
This isn’t racism, it’s just common sense.

PracticallySpeaking · 29/05/2019 18:43

OP can you go back to Morocco and file for divorce there? If it is a traditional society you may get a judgment that is more in your favour and you may easily get full custody of the children seeing as you have been a SAHM.

Do you think your husband would stop you bringing the children with you if you returned to Morocco?

Please don’t let money be your only consideration because I think it’s highly unlikely you’ll get anything more than £400/month in the UK and you won’t be able to live on that. It sounds like you are in a vulnerable position and risk losing your visa. You absolutely don’t want to end up with no visa to remain in the UK, no job or means to support yourself in the UK - eventually you would have to leave and may have to leave your children behind with their dad in England.

Please read about The Hague Convention on Interntional Child Abduction. Also note that removing children from a parent in the UK (even if you are the other parent) is a criminal offence.

Don’t end up like me - abroad with no job, no access to benefits/social housing because I am a foreign national, a visa that is about to expire and in the middle of a court process that has already lasted a year (and will last at least another year) that means that I cannot bring my child back with me to the UK. The courts will not care that you have no means to continue living in England - you will have to go back to Morocco and leave your children behind.

Some people get out of this predicament by returning to their home country BEFORE initiating divorce proceedings

missminagrindlay · 29/05/2019 19:28

Is it possible your husband could stop you from taking your children from the uk and returning home?

Yes, it is. If they have the same surname as the mother, however, they're usually not asked.

Pics, that is not at all sensible, and I say that was one also considering returning to my native country, although I am now a British national myself and my children were born in the UK and have never lived anywhere else, together with my British husband precisely for that support we cannot get here.

It is NOT a 'better life' here given the OP's circumstances. All the visas in the world mean fighting for them and NO entitlement to public funds. And what there are is UC.

A life as a middle-class Moroccan is NOT better than a poverty stricken existence in the UK by any stretch and any British national has the option of returning as they please. Many chose not to do so, it is not a given they will always want to 'come back'.

REALITY is that a divorce can mean this person's visa is invalid and facing years of struggle to make it so with more time being ineligible to access public funds herself. The man has five children and can wiggle out of paying a penny if he quits his job.

missminagrindlay · 29/05/2019 19:31

I 100% agree, Practically and I am really sorry for your predicament. I know one woman who is literally stuck in the UK due to such an outcome, and fortunately for her, although she is a Kiwi, she has British nationality but she cannot remove the child back to New Zealand, which she really wants to do, until he is old enough to make that decision clear himself or become 16.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2019 20:08

The issue is that, if she returns home, it is highly unlikely the OP will ever be in a position to return to live in the UK. Her children will not be able to live in the UK until they are independent (and no funded university due to residency considerations, so that's 21) - or if they stay with their father and rarely see their mother again.

An affluent middle class existence elsewhere would be, in the short term, preferable, but that is a part of the world which is potentially uncertain and I can see why the OP wants to secure a life for the children in the UK. They will always have the option to return to that life should they prefer it. She has her reasons as do the many thousands of middle class migrants who bring their children to the UK for an education. Telling her to just take the kids home ignores the motivations of so many who know exactly, 1st hand, what they are choosing to leave behind. She doesn't want to go home and she has the legal option to stay with her British Citizen children.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2019 20:11

Also, if Morocco is a signatory to the Hagie Convention, its already too late for her to go back. The children are resident in the UK for that purpose.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2019 20:11

*Hague

churchthecat · 29/05/2019 20:16

Morocco joined The Hague in 2012.

PicsInRed · 29/05/2019 21:04

In that case it's even more important for the OP to assert her rights re:residence, as it's been known for children to be retained/returned via Hague but the non-resident parent to be deported/refused a visa from abroad.

Taking the kids back to Morocco without formally recorded consent could backfire if their father contested it and had the children returned.

fedup21 · 30/05/2019 10:19

Would the family who are currently supporting you, help you with any childcare costs? How close are you?

SoHotADragonRetired · 30/05/2019 10:25

And she lives on what here, Pics? Genuinely? If she ever sees any maintenance it'll be pennies. No benefits. Can't afford childcare. Council won't house. Unless OP's parents in Morocco can afford to support her in this country she literally has nothing whatsoever to live on.

I can't see this dad, a complete stranger to his children who's never lived with them and can't afford to house them, contesting OP's return and wanting 100pc residence.

PicsInRed · 30/05/2019 10:48

Controlling men can surprise you.
He wont necessarily want the wife, but he may well want possession of the children - of course another woman will do the work fo raising them.
Always formally document permission for permanent removal of children from the country.

NorthEndGal · 30/05/2019 10:49

So basically you might get about 300pound a month off him total, if you are really lucky, and of he actually puts hand into pocket.

You need to either get yourself settled with a job, as quick as you can, or get yourself back to Morocco where you have family support.

AnneElliott · 30/05/2019 11:06

Definitely get specialist immigration advice before you start divorce proceedings.

I previously worked for the immigration service (been a while since I left though) and your marriage visa would have been cancelled in the event of a divorce.

If you would prefer to stay here you might need to stay married until you get ILR. But please do take advice.

missminagrindlay · 30/05/2019 11:13

Taking the kids back to Morocco without formally recorded consent could backfire if their father contested it and had the children returned.

Oh, please, this man won't contest this.

Totally stupid to stay here and be in absolutely poverty, no more legal aid, council will not house this person in London, no access to funds for 5 years.

She has nothing to live on and the government has no obligation or inclination to support economic migrants.

silvercuckoo · 30/05/2019 23:57

OP, please don't go back to Morocco with the children without an official consent from the father.
The children can be swiftly returned to the UK under the international child abduction law (and the father will get full legal aid for this), and you, realistically, won't be able to get a visa even to visit them.
I am stuck in the UK myself as I don't have a permission to return to my home country with the children. I feel so trapped, hopeless and alone sometimes.

Original poster
LittleMissMaghribi · 31/05/2019 00:29

I have another question. Could the constant threats of cancelling my visa etc be considered abuse? I have read that threats and coercion are types of abuse? Would he get arrested for this?

OP posts:
BringMeAGinandTonic · 31/05/2019 05:54

Maghribi: you definitely need to keep in mind if you divorce, your husband has to report that to UKVI. You will no longer be eligible to live here on your current visa.

There is a UKvisa subreddit which might be of use. People there might have some ideas as well.

I wish I had more help for you, but that's all I have.

Good luck :)

Asiama · 31/05/2019 07:24

@LittleMissMaghribi I don't know if it would be considered abuse, but even if it was, it wouldn't increase your financial settlement from a divorce, or provide you with access to benefits. People have advised you around child maintenance payments that he would have to pay on his current 35k income - this would disappear if in the highly unlikely event he went to prison, as he would have no income.

over50andfab · 31/05/2019 09:57

I have another question. Could the constant threats of cancelling my visa etc be considered abuse? I have read that threats and coercion are types of abuse? Would he get arrested for this?

What would be the point of that and how would that help? He could simply say you have said you want to divorce him (which you do) and he has said your visa would be cancelled - which it seems legally is what would happen.

fedup21 · 31/05/2019 10:18

I have another question. Could the constant threats of cancelling my visa etc be considered abuse? I have read that threats and coercion are types of abuse? Would he get arrested for this?

What would you hope to achieve by this?

You just seem to be trying to either get as much money as possible out of this man or get him strung up by lawyers or the police.

I do think you need to take responsibility yourself. You have left a lovely lifestyle where you were pampered and not expected to ever have to work and have left Morocco in the expectation that you would marry well and be able to be a SAHM whilst your husband provides for you (despite him already having 3 children he didn’t provide for). You weren’t coerced into this-you state yourself you are educated. It’s sounds like you were assuming you’d be pampered and cosseted over here as well.

This hasn’t worked out the way you wanted after one child, let alone having another with him-so you are now trying to find ways to get him arrested for abuse or best-case scenarios where he’ll be forced to give you spousal maintenance-in a country where this is rarely awarded-and women aren’t often in the Financial situation where they are able to just not work and could afford to be supported.

You do need to take some responsibility for this yourself. You will have to work or go back home. He is right-your Visa will be cancelled. It is neither abuse nor coercion to say it.

Where is he living?