Page 12 | Ex refusing use of the term “step-mum”

Iamadaddoinghisbest · 2024-07-15T08:56:04+00:00

Hi everyone, this is my first post, so really hoping for some helpful responses here… I met my current partner (now wife) 18 months ago and we got married a couple of months ago, around 12 months after getting engaged. we moved in together around 6 months after initially meeting and made sure to integrate my 6yo daughter into the process to make sure she felt able to discuss any concerns and feel included. My daughter stays with us 3 nights per week and is very happy in her home life with us. My ex partner (mother to my daughter) has, since the beginning, expressed continual disapproval of our relationship and at numerous occasions attempted to control how we live in our house: -commenting on where we do our shopping -dictating routines in our house -insisting I don’t choose clothes for my daughter to wear -involving my daughter in communications to me “tell Daddy he never returns the right clothes” etc -constant judgemental behaviour and constant messaging even after (on a number of occasions) telling her I don’t want us to message each-other other than on handover days or in an emergency. -insisting that my wife doesn’t kiss my daughter. Currently she is now insisting that we cannot use the term “step-mum” or any other variant (bonus mum, extra mum etc) that implies the use of the word mother for my wife. My wife and I have never pressured my daughter to use any of these terms and at all points explained she can call her whatever she feels most comfortable with. She wants to say Step-Mum because she has friends who also have step step parents so we have just allowed it. Her mum is insistent that this is forbidden and even told my daughter “just because Daddy & xxx are married doesn’t mean that she is your step mum” and offered no explanation to her. My daughter came to me to discuss this and was clearly confused and upset and now if the opinion that my wife isn’t actually part of the family but just a “friend” of mine. Looking for some opinions on this. My wife is legally my daughters step-mum so I don’t feel she has any right to contest anything here regardless of whether she likes it or not.

adviceneeded1990 · 15/07/2024 14:44

saraclara · 15/07/2024 10:28

You are so desperate for your new wife to have the title stepmother, why is that?

Read this bit again. It's his daughter that wants to use it, her dad isn't pressuring her at all.

My wife and I have never pressured my daughter to use any of these terms and at all points explained she can call her whatever she feels most comfortable with. She wants to say Step-Mum because she has friends who also have step step parents so we have just allowed it.

It's not as though the daughter is going to say 'hello step mother'. She just wants to be able to use the term to refer to her when she talks to her friends, presumably.

Edited

Exactly! The child isn’t going to call her stepmum to her face! To my face my DSD calls me my name or a variant of my name that only she really uses. To other people she calls me her stepmum or stepmummy.

@Iamadaddoinghisbest We also met, moved in, got engaged and got married in a two year period by the way - very happy five years later. Mediation is a good idea to solve the coparenting hiccups but don’t get dragged into the length of the relationship debate.

AncientAndModern1 · 15/07/2024 14:47

Tell your ex that you don’t control what your daughter says at school and won’t be reprimanding her for referring to your wife as her stepmother with her friends (not sure how you’d even know?) but equally agree you won’t push or encourage it. Maybe say some nice things about your ex to your daughter like wow Mummy is so kind to take you to the zoo (even through gritted teeth) or share baby pix of her and her mum if you still have them and say ‘mummy looks lovely doesn’t she?’ and hope it gets back to her so she doesn’t feel so insecure and resentful. If your daughter wants to take stuff like a book or toy from your house to her mum’s, let her even if you won’t get it back. You need to play a long game and pick your battles. So if she moans about you talking to your daughter about organic food, stop talking about it but don’t stop buying it. You have my sympathy, you really do. And yes, maybe it was a bit of a whirlwind romance and marriage for a person with a kid, but that’s done now and it seems the daughter is happy about it which is what really matters.

lightsandtunnels · 15/07/2024 14:47

I don't think you are being unreasonable here OP. As usual, the merry band of MNs (or lots of them) want to give you a pasting for moving on.
The idea someone had in an earlier post that they wouldn't introduce a new partner to their kids for 'several years' is frankly bonkers. Life goes on.

I think mediation would definitely be the way forward for you if you aren't able to move forward positively with your ex regarding this. I'm also thinking some kind of support/counselling for your DD may be a good idea too, especially as she is hearing venom from your ex about this instance with your new wife being her step mum. Your ex is probably feeling very vulnerable at the thought of her DD gaining a new Mum. Understandable really, it's not easy for anyone. I hope you manage to move on. Remember that your DD is the most important (and vulnerable) person in all this of course.

Uselesssil · 15/07/2024 15:00

Iamadaddoinghisbest · 15/07/2024 12:58

Wow thanks @Supersimkin7
I did neither of these things.
She ended the relationship and I share custody almost 50:50.

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@Supersimkin7 Have you actually read any of the OP’s posts? You seem to have made up a bullshit story to suit your own agenda. Why? Are you a victim of a separation that has left you so bitter, that you want to attack a dad who is trying to do his best for his dd? If this was the other way round and it was the mum saying these things instead of the dad, you wouldn’t be attacking her.

@Iamadaddoinghisbest sounds like a father who dearly loves his dd. He has done nothing at all to deserve the attacks you and others have made on him. Yes the speed of the current relationship has been rapid but sometimes you just know that the person you are with is the one.

Flipzandchipz · 15/07/2024 15:03

My god, the level of comprehension from PP’s on this thread is staggeringly low. The OP misunderstood the term OW and clarified this yet the replies from PP’s are just overlooking it. Also OP explained that it is mum who has said DD cannot call his wife step mum and that OP and his wife have never insisted DD use any particular term. Why is that so difficult to comprehend! We might have thoughts on meeting to marrying within 18 months but that’s not the question being asked!!

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 15:09

marcopront · 15/07/2024 13:09

@MrsSunshine2b

I'm annoyed by all the judgy comments you are getting on the speed of your relationship. My husband and I were the exact same, engaged after 3 months, moved in around the same time, married 18 months later. Very happy 7 years on. Your timescales are no-one else's business. When you know, you know.

Either

He didn't know in the first relationship but went ahead and had a child

Or

He knew and the relationship went wrong

Or

"When you know you know " is rubbish

OP obviously didn't know last time, hence why they were unmarried for 13 years.

DH knew, but once your GF is "accidentally" pregnant it seems like a good idea to try to make it work for the sake of the baby, even if the relationship isn't particularly happy. They tried and failed- or rather, he tried, she started a new relationship with one of his friends.

Statistically speaking, the longer you live together prior to marriage, the bigger the likelihood it's going to end in divorce.

CJsGoldfish · 15/07/2024 15:12

At all points I have tried to ensure my daughter’s needs have been considered first
After all, DD is the centre of this, and her happiness should come before anything else
When you 'integrated' your dd into your very, very new relationship, I'm not sure it wasn't your needs that were being considered first 🙄

I'm generally a "kids are resiliant and take their cues from us" kinda parent but 'taking their cues from us' can also be misused if one is manipulatively inclined.
I also think that what goes on in the 'other' house, is pretty much up to that parent. This though? Feels off. That you can say those things about your daughters needs and happiness but do the opposite just makes me wonder about your 'version' of the situation.

letsgoooo · 15/07/2024 15:20

Elizo · 15/07/2024 11:20

Agh! Having been a child of step parents I actually rarely used the term. It was more mum's partner/ dad's wife and their first name in person. For the sake of your daughter who is in the unfortunate position of being stuck in the middle I would just go along with it. If you insist she uses the term she'll get it in the neck from her mum. Over time those experiences have a big psychological impact. It's unreasonable but who cares really. When your DS is older she can make her own mind up

The issue with this is that calling the new wife 'dad's wife' doesn't give the child an opportunity to own a personal relationship or label with her. It suggests the woman is only a relationship of the dad's

When a child is young and will presumably be having a long term relationship with the new partner they need to be able to own their own relationship and this comes either a label.

Its vital for the child

Pictureperfect9 · 15/07/2024 15:22

letsgoooo · 15/07/2024 15:20

The issue with this is that calling the new wife 'dad's wife' doesn't give the child an opportunity to own a personal relationship or label with her. It suggests the woman is only a relationship of the dad's

When a child is young and will presumably be having a long term relationship with the new partner they need to be able to own their own relationship and this comes either a label.

Its vital for the child

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Exactly!

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 15:22

CJsGoldfish · 15/07/2024 15:12

At all points I have tried to ensure my daughter’s needs have been considered first
After all, DD is the centre of this, and her happiness should come before anything else
When you 'integrated' your dd into your very, very new relationship, I'm not sure it wasn't your needs that were being considered first 🙄

I'm generally a "kids are resiliant and take their cues from us" kinda parent but 'taking their cues from us' can also be misused if one is manipulatively inclined.
I also think that what goes on in the 'other' house, is pretty much up to that parent. This though? Feels off. That you can say those things about your daughters needs and happiness but do the opposite just makes me wonder about your 'version' of the situation.

How is 4 months "very, very new" to a small child? The child was 4 at the time, 4 months was 1/12 of her entire life. That's like 2 years for a 24 yo. At 6 and after 18 months, she can probably barely remember a time before SM- my 4 yo definitely only has very vague recollections of anything that happened over a year ago.

Idk what kind of relationships people on MN have been in, maybe you're talking about going on a once a week date, or a long distance relationship, rather than the type where you get to know each other and spend time together every day from the start. It's really not rocket science when you're old enough to know all the green and red flags and what makes you happy in a relationship to work out that you've met the right person.

ImNotGivingAwayMyShot · 15/07/2024 15:54

789C · 15/07/2024 13:15

I think there are some ways to make things better. Try understanding your ex wife's position.
Your ex wife is your child's mother. Just because you have chosen your new wife, does not mean that your ex has also chosen her or approves of her being around your daughter. She tolerates it. Your daughter is young and impressionable. Your wife probably feels that the title of stepmother should be earned. It involves trust, consistency, respect and longevity. Just because "legally" that's her title, it does not mean your child's mother has to accept it, or that she "trusts" your wife to actually fulfill that role. It can cause a lot of anxiety for your ex, handing your child over to a stranger, and that's what your wife is to your ex.
The instructions your wife gives needs to be followed to the letter ( as long as they are not intrusive, arbitrary or controlling). Your new wife can help to ensure that happens so that trust can begin to be built up. Also your wife is not your daughter's mother and should understand that whilst she may care for your daughter it is you and her mother who have to agree and work together to bring about solutions that work for everyone.
Talk to your ex with empathy and respect her concerns ( even if to you, they aren't rational/ important) because they are important to her. She may not want your daughter overly attached to your wife until she herself is certain of who your wife is and whether she is someone she can truly trust to ensure the wellbeing of her child.
Time is required and patience. As your daughter grows up, she will assert her own position, children love people who love them, and your daughter will be the one who will likely persuade your ex of your wife's character etc. So be patient and time will ease the awkwardness etc. No point arguing over the title of stepmum. Just tell your ex wife to explain to your daughter exactly why she is opposed to this title. It's really your ex wife's issue. You just want your daughter to be happy.x

My goodness, I'm assuming you're a first wife?

What if the Mum had a new partner? (she was emotionally cheating so had zero care about her DD going through a family breaking up), would that be allowed?

The OP is married, factually she is the step mum and the DD refers to her as such which is completely normal. The DD is confused and upset because of her mother, not because of the OP or his wife.

She is a grown woman and even after instigating the breakdown of their family, she is now upsetting her own child and you think the ex should be pandered to?

Elizo · 15/07/2024 16:08

Pictureperfect9 · 15/07/2024 15:22

Exactly!

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It didn’t work like that in my experience. My mum’s partner was in our family from when I was 4. We were extremely close. I used his name and referred to him as my mum’s partner…

saraclara · 15/07/2024 16:12

ImNotGivingAwayMyShot · 15/07/2024 15:54

My goodness, I'm assuming you're a first wife?

What if the Mum had a new partner? (she was emotionally cheating so had zero care about her DD going through a family breaking up), would that be allowed?

The OP is married, factually she is the step mum and the DD refers to her as such which is completely normal. The DD is confused and upset because of her mother, not because of the OP or his wife.

She is a grown woman and even after instigating the breakdown of their family, she is now upsetting her own child and you think the ex should be pandered to?

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I'm reading @789C 's post and changing all the sexes. Can you imagine that advice ever appearing on Mumsnet with reference to a controlling male ex? 😅

KirstenBlest · 15/07/2024 16:12

@MrsSunshine2b , it's a long time for a 4 year old but as far as relationships go, it's a short time.

4-yr olds don't have the same concept of time as an adult.

GrumpyPanda · 15/07/2024 16:37

TheShellBeach · 15/07/2024 10:35

Is your new wife the OW?

If not, why did you and your ex-wife split up?

FFS.

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 16:40

789C · 15/07/2024 13:15

I think there are some ways to make things better. Try understanding your ex wife's position.
Your ex wife is your child's mother. Just because you have chosen your new wife, does not mean that your ex has also chosen her or approves of her being around your daughter. She tolerates it. Your daughter is young and impressionable. Your wife probably feels that the title of stepmother should be earned. It involves trust, consistency, respect and longevity. Just because "legally" that's her title, it does not mean your child's mother has to accept it, or that she "trusts" your wife to actually fulfill that role. It can cause a lot of anxiety for your ex, handing your child over to a stranger, and that's what your wife is to your ex.
The instructions your wife gives needs to be followed to the letter ( as long as they are not intrusive, arbitrary or controlling). Your new wife can help to ensure that happens so that trust can begin to be built up. Also your wife is not your daughter's mother and should understand that whilst she may care for your daughter it is you and her mother who have to agree and work together to bring about solutions that work for everyone.
Talk to your ex with empathy and respect her concerns ( even if to you, they aren't rational/ important) because they are important to her. She may not want your daughter overly attached to your wife until she herself is certain of who your wife is and whether she is someone she can truly trust to ensure the wellbeing of her child.
Time is required and patience. As your daughter grows up, she will assert her own position, children love people who love them, and your daughter will be the one who will likely persuade your ex of your wife's character etc. So be patient and time will ease the awkwardness etc. No point arguing over the title of stepmum. Just tell your ex wife to explain to your daughter exactly why she is opposed to this title. It's really your ex wife's issue. You just want your daughter to be happy.x

Should the ex wife also follow his instructions to the letter when his daughter is with her?

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 16:41

KirstenBlest · 15/07/2024 16:12

@MrsSunshine2b , it's a long time for a 4 year old but as far as relationships go, it's a short time.

4-yr olds don't have the same concept of time as an adult.

I think that's very subjective. I don't think 4 months is very new, if it's a serious relationship.

Reugny · 15/07/2024 16:45

lightsandtunnels · 15/07/2024 14:47

I don't think you are being unreasonable here OP. As usual, the merry band of MNs (or lots of them) want to give you a pasting for moving on.
The idea someone had in an earlier post that they wouldn't introduce a new partner to their kids for 'several years' is frankly bonkers. Life goes on.

I think mediation would definitely be the way forward for you if you aren't able to move forward positively with your ex regarding this. I'm also thinking some kind of support/counselling for your DD may be a good idea too, especially as she is hearing venom from your ex about this instance with your new wife being her step mum. Your ex is probably feeling very vulnerable at the thought of her DD gaining a new Mum. Understandable really, it's not easy for anyone. I hope you manage to move on. Remember that your DD is the most important (and vulnerable) person in all this of course.

She isn't gaining a new mum though.

She only has one mum.

What she is gaining is another adult who will hopefully support her and she will have a good life long relationship with.

Reugny · 15/07/2024 16:49

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 15:09

OP obviously didn't know last time, hence why they were unmarried for 13 years.

DH knew, but once your GF is "accidentally" pregnant it seems like a good idea to try to make it work for the sake of the baby, even if the relationship isn't particularly happy. They tried and failed- or rather, he tried, she started a new relationship with one of his friends.

Statistically speaking, the longer you live together prior to marriage, the bigger the likelihood it's going to end in divorce.

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You missed the part where the OP alluded to his ex having a lot of savings and him being on UC.

Some people, whether a man or woman, won't marry someone if there is a massive discrepancy in assets and will likely be so going forward due to job choice.

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 16:56

Reugny · 15/07/2024 16:49

You missed the part where the OP alluded to his ex having a lot of savings and him being on UC.

Some people, whether a man or woman, won't marry someone if there is a massive discrepancy in assets and will likely be so going forward due to job choice.

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Whatever the reasons, both of them didn't want to be married to each other and OP clearly doesn't oppose marriage in principle. I'd have married DH whether he'd had not a penny to his name or been a millionaire.

ImNotGivingAwayMyShot · 15/07/2024 16:59

saraclara · 15/07/2024 16:12

I'm reading @789C 's post and changing all the sexes. Can you imagine that advice ever appearing on Mumsnet with reference to a controlling male ex? 😅

Edited

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Even innocent men usually get a lot of shit thrown at them on here...there would most certainly be a huge outcry if the roles were reversed in this situation!

KirstenBlest · 15/07/2024 17:11

Imagine the outcry if OP was female and had married a man within 18 months.

Ksqordssvimy · 15/07/2024 17:28

People I feel sorry for: your ex, your wife, your daughter.
People I don't feel sorry for: you

MrsSunshine2b · 15/07/2024 17:44

Ksqordssvimy · 15/07/2024 17:28

People I feel sorry for: your ex, your wife, your daughter.
People I don't feel sorry for: you

What, because he has the audacity to be a man on Mumsnet? If this was a woman dealing with a controlling ex, she wouldn't be getting anything like this hate.

arethereanyleftatall · 15/07/2024 17:50

On any male op threads there are always posters who rush to dismiss any negativity towards the op as being driven by misandry. I don't disagree that there are misandrists on here, (there's bound to be, their experience of shit men will have often brought them to mumsnet in the first place) but there are equal numbers of handmaidens who will rush to a man's defence, absolutely regardless.