Irish posters - "having a paddy"

[BarbaraHoward]

Irish posters - can I canvas your opinions on the use of "having a paddy" to mean "having a tantrum"? I've been having a bit of back and forth (well, plenty of forth not much back in truth) with MNHQ over the past day or two and I want to check that I'm not going against the majority view here.

IMO, the phrase is awful, and plainly anti Irish. I know most people using it aren't doing so to slag Irish people off, but the phrase is still awful IMO.

I've been here a long time, and reported the phrase more than I can remember. Usually, it's just deleted right away. Raising it on a thread always derails it as people just go on the offensive.

I reported it yesterday and got the immediate email that it was being checked out, but the post stayed up for hours despite a follow up email, another post and a thread in Site Stuff. It was then edited rather than deleted, which I thought was the norm for offensive language. I reported another use this morning and it's still up.

What are your views? Is this a fight worth having with MNHQ or am I out of step with the majority of Irish posters on here?

Thanks :)

Surely no one can be that obtuse to think Ireland is Independent of Britain? Edit NOT independent
That’s scary .
Does no one have an atlas or globe 🌍 any more?
The Irish Sea is a pretty formidable border.

Just skimmed the thread, but couldn't see reference to:

This old man, he played one
He played nick nack on my thumb
With a nick-nack paddywhack
Give the dog a bone
This old man came rolling home

Etc

I still sing this with my music groups without giving it a thought! What does it mean? Should I stop?

I've used it many times, but had no idea it meant paddy in the sense of Irish. It just never occurred to me.

'some Irish people aren't offended by it' and 'it is offensive to Irish people' are two different statements.

The former doesn't negate the latter. Using 'Paddy' to refer to Irish people in general is based in colonial stereotyping of 'inferior' natives, so there is an element of objective, factual offensiveness in its origin, it's not just personal opinion.

People can say they aren't offended by it, that's fine, but it doesn't change the facts about the contentious origins of the term 'paddy' which are objectively offensive.

Are you for real?
You do know the history right? The sea did not deter the occupying forces.

Yes exactly, that's my view too.

Oh I know!
I just think it's horrible, referring to people who are proud of their Irish heritage, as lesser than.
I mean something to be mocked over.

From Northern Ireland, lived in England 25 plus years. Not heard in NI. We'd have said "bold" or tantrum. It is offensive as is paddywhack and Irish Twin.
Similar to @MarieDeGournay I was very taken back by someone at university saying "that's a bit Irish" about something that was silly/stupid. She'd had a DF in British Army in Belfast so I thought it came with an edge.

See also Paddy Irishman jokes. Not funny.

TOM Adams as I remembered half way through preparing the cats' dinners.

This one. Would the people lecturing us on not being offended by offensive language really be happy seeing this in the bookshop?

I know, shocks me every time. It became especially noticeable with the Brexit vote. Too many British colleagues/acquaintances were confused that it was possible for Ireland to still stay in the EU ("don't they have to leave with the rest of Britain?"). Others vaguely realise that Ireland is a different country but still didn't see us as a sovereign nation on the same level as, say, Spain. They think we use British pounds, or get subsidies from the UK government, or have the British royal family. Very strange.

These old terms - people probably don’t give much thought to the slang words.
Years ago amongst certain horse people the term “sp*zzing out” was used in relation to horses.

Eg A young, fresh TB saw a leaf 🍃 and “sp*zzed out , setting the others off”

I thought as a child that “sp*zzing out” was something horses did- ( suddenly snorting and throwing their heads up while leaping about in the field-)It was only when an adult said not to use it as it related to people with Cerebral Palsy that it made sense.

The only place I've ever heard it is on MN.
Doesn't offend me.

If you said they had a meltdown instead of 'throwing a Paddy' then a different crowd would come at you and say that it's offensive to use the term if you're not referring to someone with autism.

I'm ND and that doesn't bother me either, sometimes NT people/children do have meltdowns.

The most offensive thing to me is when English people try to claim we're British...and then worse again when corrected rather than accept it and acknowledge it they will say 'well you are part of the British isles' because they still want to try to claim ownership in some way.

Same the way they try to claim that all of our famous sportspeople/actors etc are British. I don't believe that it's ignorance, I think it's done on purpose, I don't believe for a second that British (born and reared) journalists/news readers etc can be so ignorant to not know which countries make up Britain or the UK.

No carry on. No-one has complained.

That’s genuinely shocking .
Pre Decimal Euro Ireland had the beautiful coins with the Irish Draught, Greyhound, Hare and Harp.

I did really really enjoy seeing the DUP referred to as "the Irish unionists" though.

Irish born and bred here and not offended by either “having a paddy” or “beyond the pale”. Why should I be?

I also don’t understand why Irish people get bent out of shape about English people not knowing the ins and outs of Irish history. It’s a different country! Most English people don’t know much about colonial India or Africa either - it’s not personal.

Words can lose their meaning and offensiveness over time. I really don't like "queer" because I am a certain age and I remember it being spat at people with venom. But it's used widely by the very people it used to insult.

I cannot get worked up about "having a paddy", regardless of its origin or past wrongs committed against the Irish.

I did idly wonder, when post-slavery reparations were all over the news a few weeks ago, whether the Irish government should sue over the potato famine...

@PomegranateKernals this a good article on it https://kinneybrothers.com/blog/blog/2020/01/03/fun-facts-38-paddywhack/

It's a word which originally had a different meaning but has come to be associated with something else.

Exactly, it's a different country! I think expecting people to know what's their country and what isn't is a pretty low bar. I know France isn't part of Ireland. British people should know Ireland isn't part of the UK.

I also don’t understand why Irish people get bent out of shape about English people not knowing the ins and outs of Irish history. It’s a different country!

Not all English people know that though. Including UK MPs.

@kkloo · Today 18:02

The only place I've ever heard it is on MN.
Doesn't offend me.

I have heard a neighbour (mid 40s) say it. Said to her mum on the phone last week 'Lucy was paddying earlier!' (Meaning throwing a paddy.) I don't hear people say it much though.

I also hear some people (mostly 50+) talk about the local corner shop, and they call it the P**i shop. That surprises me. I genuinely would never say that. As I say, I don't say 'throw a paddy' either ... (Even though the Irish people I know aren't offended by it.) Just in case someone overhears me and is offended.

The privilege of choosing not to know anything about the countries that England invaded, mismanaged, asset-stripped, divided, is ultimately bad for England because it leaves the country's promoters not understanding why they are viewed with scepticism if not with outright distrust in so many parts of the world.

Paddywhack or Paddy Whack is an offensive term coined in the early 19th century for a stereotyped violent Irish character. Kinney brothers might find that fun, I don't.

'Paddywhackery' is a word used to describe Hibernophobic language.

I did do Irish history at school, for the plain and simple reason that it was part of the United Kingdom. So consequently the history was shared.

I love the word sassenach, though it is supposed to be derisive isn't it?

Afraid you're going to have to clarify that one, because I'm sure you don't mean what I think you mean. 🤔