Gender Critical in Ireland Part 3

[VaddaABeetch]

I’m watching RTE news. They mentioned the Garda representatives organisation are concerned about Gender Identity in the workplace. It’s been brought in without consultation & without training.

the Garda Commissioner has said that Garda may be disciplined for misgendering.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

Im voting no to both, essentially as a protest vote against the increasing removal of the word woman from documentation. On an insufferably ‘woke’ training course recently, the trainer (woman 🙄) couldn’t remind us enough of the importance of using ‘people who menstruate’ to avoid triggering trans men and NBs. Apparently peri and post menopausal people don’t exist.
Also the lies being told about voting yes: my instinct is always to do the exact opposite of what Roderic O’Gorman wants.
Could anyone point me in the direction of any reports , newspaper articles etc that explain why the recommendations of the Citizens Assembly were not followed and who came up with the alternatives? Thanks 🙏

Estelle Birdy on Twitter:
"‘No woman has ever said, “Roderic, you’ve got this €20 million going a-begging, do you know what’s really busting our ovaries? The outdated language in Article 41.2”’

With thanks to PatKennyNT for hosting my and fergusfinlay [feminist]’s robust discussion about the upcoming proposed removal of the words ‘woman’ and ‘mothers’ and our clear economic protection from the Irish Constitution on newstalk. We need more dissenting feminist voices in the media. rtenews RTE_PrimeTime rteliveline IrishTimes
In all honesty, it was an honour and a pleasure to meet Fergus and to hear his arguments for removing women and mothers from the Constitution. I and the feminists (the female kind) of the ProtestSilenced just happen to disagree with Fergus. It’s good to debate. And, charmingly, Fergus pre-ordered my book this morning. Admittedly, BEFORE we had our robust discussion. I will be expecting Fergus at the launch and definitely at the after party. Dance it out, Fergus. That’s my motto.
#VoteNoNo #SilencedProtest #KeepMnaInTheLaw"
(above a great image post by Women's Space Ireland.)

I didn't hear the piece, but Fergus Finlay has become a very strange individual in recent years, judging from his columns in the Examiner.

This "conversation," between Karen Kiernan of One Family and Senator Rónán Mullen is also worth a read:

RTÉ Upfront: Referendum campaigners debate amendments via WhatsApp

To misquote Albert Reynolds, that's the men for you.

Oi!

I wonder what the outcome would have been if Rodders had been as interested in the integration part of his portfolio as he is in the get women to pretend that people can change sex bit?

Despite Fergus Finley repeatedly claiming to be a feminist he came across as so patronising to women and kept talking over Estelle.

Fergus just because you say you're a feminist that doesn't make you one. He's been strange for years.

When all this is over....can we start a campaign to preserve the meanings of words. And for politicians and media yo use language to reveal not conceal.

For example O Gorman seems to be minister for oddly juxtaposed abstract nouns. Or something.

The rationale for the yes yes vote and what concrete benefits it’s going to bring to families and carers is so unclear. They just keep wheeling out the same case studies and things that happened years ago. Why not add in fathers? Why remove women and mothers? I’m glad Ronan Mullen called out the gender identity politics likely involved.

Strangely enough, I do remember quite a few years ago there was a concerted effort to make language clear and understandable. I seem to remember it being in the context of work, so it would have been something about business language or documentation or something. It's annoying that I can't quite remember the details.

But that seems so far removed from all this shite...

Edited to say I think I found it - The Plain English Campaign -
https://www.plainenglish.co.uk/about-us.html

I highly doubt many of our government documents these days would be up to standard.

Yes I remember the Plain English campaign @Farmageddon . Of course its proponents were written off as crusty old reactionaries. Like people who believe in boring biology.

Bit of a hobby horse of mine I'm afraid. I hate the renaming of Irish places. My English friend calls it 'Essexication'. I think of it as the Abolition of Meaning. But I digress....

I am campaigning for No amongst everyone I know - surprisingly, I thought it would be a difficult slog but most women I know (all middle aged feminists) are No. The only disappointment is that when I share items, they criticise the alignment with anti abortion campaigners and anti immigration campaigners. I have pointed out to them that the purity spiral (thank you MN for that phrase) will get us nowhere.

However, I would like to reach more undecided people - does anyone know if there is an active campaign and how to get involved? Thanks.

does anyone know if there is an active campaign and how to get involved?

The Countess is one group campaigning for No-No.

https://thecountess.ie/
https://twitter.com/TheCountessie/
A recent speech by founder & CEO Laoise de Brún BL:

Sandra Adams' speech at that same march and rally held by The Countess. Not the attendance they deserved, given the LWS numbers. More events are planned, I heard.

<a class="break-all" href="https://archive.is/2024.02.09-060816/www.irishtimes.com/politics/2024/02/09/yes-campaign-in-the-lead-but-signs-referendum-campaign-likely-to-tighten/" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.is/2024.02.09-060816/www.irishtimes.com/politics/2024/02/09/yes-campaign-in-the-lead-but-signs-referendum-campaign-likely-to-tighten/

Better informed voters are voting no …

Guys

To the more educated if this referendum wins, will the financial security for women through CB be affected.

That was designed to ensure could feed their children and only mothers could collect. (I am aware fathers do get it) but as a whole it is more likely to be women?

Is that safety net gone?

That’s a very good point. My concern is that no one is able to answer these kinds of questions. It’s hard to predict the outcome of constitutional changes.

That's it, what are the unseen consequences, that will manifest down the road and it's too late.

No one (including government) has the granular details and how this fluffy wording will impact when challenged in court.

And let's be honest it will be challenged if there is potential financial gain

It's interesting about the information thing. I've seen a lot of de yute saying that they see the kinds of awful old people lining up to vote no, so they need no more info to vote yes.

That's the problem @StephanieSuperpowers . And lots of young people just can't relate to motherhood and its attendant problems , fatherhood either for that matter. I was the same at that age , it was a big 💤 as far as we were concerned.

I'm guilty of ageism myself and I'm old. There was a group of ppl picketing my TDs clinic during Repeal. So I decided to give them both barrels - still raging about Savita. But as I got closer I could see there was just a handful of frail elderly ppl , average age about 85 it seemed. Ah shur the poor ould divils I thought ' they won't even live long enough to vote '. But shortly thereafter I did meet a young articulate pro lifer who had a stall set up in Killarney. Can't be too complacent , ever.

Imagine if Roddy x co wrote an amendment saying ' Henceforth all women will live their best lives consisting of education , travel , artistic pursuits, romance and untold wealth. Don't worry about children, they will in future be produced by the Sí at Brú na Boinne and allocated by the Sorting Hat'

I think that would fly. Bit of consumerism, bit of libfem , bit of new agey pixie dust.

Voting No & No. This government want these changes so badly they're bringing it to a referendum. It can't be for the good of the Irish people. They cannot be trusted.

A very bad sign when Rodric O'Gorman threatened the NGO's to push for a yes yes vote or they'd have their funding cut.

Have you a link?

@3timeslucky

https://www.irishtimes.com/politics/2024/01/01/progressive-organisations-must-explain-any-decision-not-to-support-referendum-says-minister/

https://gript.ie/shocker-ngos-will-now-support-the-ministers-referendum/

Couple of links from the Irish Times & Gript above @3timeslucky . Shocking & very sinister.

Abhannmor Imagine if Roddy x co wrote an amendment saying ' Henceforth all women will live their best lives consisting of education , travel , artistic pursuits, romance and untold wealth. Don't worry about children, they will in future be produced by the Sí at Brú na Boinne and allocated by the Sorting Hat'

Brilliant, Abhannmor! Please rewrite our entire constitution😊

Only problem: so all babies would be qualified to play Gaelic for Meath? Mightn't that result in one team dominating Sam ....no, sorry, forget I ever mentioned that.

Thanks. I’d seen those but didn’t remember a direct threat to NGO funding so I thought I’d missed something and he’d gone further. He’s bang out of order either way.