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If you didn't get the jab, would you consider having it now?

1000 replies

AreYouVeryAnti · 25/01/2023 23:49

You'd better be quick if you're healthy and under 50...

"The Telegraph understands the Government is also preparing to wind down the open offer of the first two doses over the coming months. The move will mean unvaccinated healthy under-50s will soon not be able to get a Covid jab unless one is recommended by a medical professional."

OP posts:
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MeetPi · 06/02/2023 03:38

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 03:18

@MeetPi Wow, posted at the same time!
More flat earth stuff!
Why is there such a desire to make everything binary - that everyone who believes one thing must believe lots of other things as well?
Questions about the vaccine do not automatically mean that someone thinks the earth is flat or that 5g is some brain fryer or something, it just means they are questioning the actions of a massive multinational that wants to make money and hasn't got the shiniest of reputations over the years.

Let's just wait and see what happens eh? Rather than just shutting things down as they are developing, you never know, we might all learn something new?

Anderson is somewhat of an extremist, though, and does hold a variety of views that support that (re: immigration, fiscal policy, crime). Have you looked at her Twitter feed? You're right to suggest we shouldn't make things binary, but neither should consider them with a narrowed lens. If you consider the wider political picture of Anderson, you'll see only headline extremism.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 03:58

@MeetPi It's pretty extreme yourself saying someone who is fighting for the good of the people she represents and basically everyone as headline extremism!
Perhaps you have the narrowed lens and should open your mind a little?

MeetPi · 06/02/2023 04:14

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 03:58

@MeetPi It's pretty extreme yourself saying someone who is fighting for the good of the people she represents and basically everyone as headline extremism!
Perhaps you have the narrowed lens and should open your mind a little?

Did you have a read of her Twitter?

You do understand that, in politics, views fall within a spectrum. There is extreme-left (hard socialism like communism) and on the other end the extreme-right (conservatism like fascism). The middle is generally centrist. It is not extreme or offensive to label to politician such as Anderson extreme-right. That is simply what she is. It isn't reflective of her effectiveness.

MinkyGreen · 06/02/2023 06:45

@HelpfulMonkey

Is it just that you don’t realise the political persuasions of your sources - or that you do actually support their agenda?

Christine Anderson is part of a far-right party called the AfD:

A German court has ruled that the far-right Alternative for Germany (AfD) can be classified as a suspected threat to democracy, paving the way for the domestic intelligence agency to spy on the opposition party.

The administrative court in Cologne however found that there were “sufficient indications of anti-constitutional goals within the AfD”, it said in a statement.

As a result, the BfV is allowed to officially classify the anti-Islam, anti-immigrant party as a “suspected case of right-wing extremism”.

The court also criticised the extremist leanings of the AfD’s youth wing, saying along with former “Wing” supporters these members believed that the “German people should be kept ethnically intact and ‘outsiders’ should be excluded as far as possible”.

“This goes against the Basic Law,” the court said, referring to Germany’s constitution.

Yes, there is a correlation between vaccine hesitancy and far right extremists - but it’s not for particularly pleasant reasons.

CrunchyCarrot · 06/02/2023 07:06

@henlee @HelpfulMonkey

Found another speech by Christine Anderson.

twitter.com/pbhushan1/status/1454262872175874055?lang=en

She has said in another very recent interview (where she was willingly introduced as 'far right' - I won't link to because of the site it's on), that she believes the EU is under the thumb on the WHO and WEF, and not just the EU but all Western democracies are in lockstep to these 'globalist agendas'. She believes Covid came out of a lab, she thinks it was deliberately released in order to fulfill the global agenda (hence the comments about 'breaking people' via lockdowns, etc. She often refers to #FakeElites.

A lot of what I can find she says isn't very original on her part, I have to say.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 09:22

Thanks for all this research into her, you all seem quite focused on discrediting her now which is interesting.
Perhaps she is right in this case, who knows, she certainly seems to want to help people and fight for information to come out, which can only be a good thing.
Hopefully people on here might have a look at what she has to say in this context rather than being put off by a big smear campaign.
Look at the art and not the artist and all that!

All your explanations are also very simplistic and talking down to me, which is a very strange tack to take.

I will certainly be following what she reveals about the covid vaccine, it doesn't matter what party someone is from when they are investigating a multinational corporation, only the facts which come out, surely you can see that?

There is only the truth, it doesn't matter if it was a cleaner or a taxi driver who discovers information, if it is true it is still true. To put all this effort into discredit someone because you don't like what they are currently saying about the vaccine speaks volumes about your willingness to defend the status quo rather than having an open mind for the possibility that something might not be quite right, there could be side effects down the line we don't know about (god forbid) and someone will have to make those public and I personally don't mind if they are a smurf, so long as that information is accurate.

People could (and do) look at the backgrounds of Edward Snowdown and Chelsea Manning to try and discredit them, but they did amazing work brining really bad things to light. I don't want there to be something wrong with the vaccine but if there is then it is important that people know about it rather than putting their heads in the sand and going to great lengths to suppress that information.

In a way it's sad to see you all desperately trying to stop anyone looking into this because if they are right you will all be on the wrong side of history as they say, which would be a shame and I do hope you will all apologise if that's the case.

Have a nice day anyway, I see you have all been up late / early putting effort into this which I really applaud the dedication to your cause, but hopefully people will also be able to make their own minds up about this very fast moving issue, that is very hard to discuss with what's been going on online - do you all know about the "Twitter files" where it's all come out that pfizer executives were using their influence to get posts removed from twitter that were entirely accurate and factually correct, but were in a way critical of the vaccine, often by highly respected doctors as well? If you like I will start a new thread with that information in, I didn't want to as it might worry people but it would be interesting to see what people think about this kind of censorship of the truth.
That's really dark, dystopian stuff and if you aren'to aware of it you should look into it, it's really dodgy stuff...

MeetPi · 06/02/2023 09:56

@HelpfulMonkey

Have a nice day anyway, I see you have all been up late / early putting effort into this which I really applaud the dedication to your cause

Are you aware of time zones? Not everyone lives in Britain or Europe.

It's okay for people to have different political views, BTW. What we are attempting to get you to see is that is rare for one view to occur in a vacuum. They are part of a package. So, Anderson is an extreme-right politician and she will generally say the exact same things as other extreme-right politicians - the party line. This occurs on the Left, too.

And, yes, I'm aware of the 'Twitter Files' - but as far as I'm aware, nothing too frightening has been uncovered there. I know Conservatives love suggesting their posts were constantly removed from Twitter, and still do, but usually that's because the posts were violating terms to start with.

CrunchyCarrot · 06/02/2023 10:43

@HelpfulMonkey I do agree that we shouldn't look at issues as totally black and white.

I will certainly be following what she reveals about the covid vaccine

Well, I won't be following her in particular, I will be following the scientific community and literature, because research is coming in on a daily basis.

In a way it's sad to see you all desperately trying to stop anyone looking into this because if they are right you will all be on the wrong side of history as they say, which would be a shame and I do hope you will all apologise if that's the case.

I hope scientists ARE looking into all the claims and counterclaims! Absolutely. Just as I hope that people with Long Covid will get the investigations and help they need (considering how ME/CFS sufferers have been so badly treated). If there are problems with the vaccines or their components then I want to know, but I also want to see robust data on this. To my mind, SARS-CoV-2 is a nasty virus and can have some very deleterious effects on people's health, and not just short term. I think over time (and this is still very early on in research on this virus) we will discover far more about how it does this. Some of us are doubtless more susceptible to damage from it than others. We need to understand this. It will take time to discover what we need to know.

I see you have all been up late / early putting effort into this which I really applaud the dedication to your cause

I'm only up in the night because of poor health, not any kind of dedication! Bizarrely (or perhaps not) since I had Covid a few months ago my sleep went to hell (again) when I'd gotten back into a good routine previously.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 10:45

@MeetPi Not sure if you are reading the same things - censorship of the truth coming from well respected professionals by corporations is definitely frightening.

Thank you for 'your attempts to get me to see things', but they are not required, you obviously have very firmly held beliefs, which is fine but I prefer to just look at facts and reality rather than hang on to dogma and personal bias.

Interesting you talk about violating terms - they may have been violating terms but what if those terms were wrong in the first place? You seem to have a very limited world view and not understand the media at all

MeetPi · 06/02/2023 11:20

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 10:45

@MeetPi Not sure if you are reading the same things - censorship of the truth coming from well respected professionals by corporations is definitely frightening.

Thank you for 'your attempts to get me to see things', but they are not required, you obviously have very firmly held beliefs, which is fine but I prefer to just look at facts and reality rather than hang on to dogma and personal bias.

Interesting you talk about violating terms - they may have been violating terms but what if those terms were wrong in the first place? You seem to have a very limited world view and not understand the media at all

The terms were those every Twitter user agreed to when they joined. So whether they were "wrong" or not (strange word to use) is irrelevant. The terms clearly set out what behaviours we're not acceptable. Most people (and I'm guilty of this) don't read Terms and Conditions, do they?

I understand media just fine, thanks. I wouldn't start getting into "you seem to have a limited world view, etc." as there's plenty I could say to you there, but I'm kinder than most.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 11:24

@MeetPi I am very glad you are so kind and educated then!
Thank you for showing mercy and not getting into nasty online bullying!

However you do seem to support censorship of anything you don't like as using any way possible to suppress the free flow of information which is a bit worrying.

If you don't mind me asking, why are you so dedicated to your 'side' of this situation? It's obviously you have a very firmly held position and a less than open mind and so I am curious as to why that is?

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 18:33

Who do people have to apologise to if they end up on the wrong side of history?

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 19:36

@sunglassesonthetable what an interesting question.
If you do loads of harm (even unknowingly) then it's best to make up for it isn't it?
If you cause harm and know you are doing it then that's really bad, but most people are good and not just out for money or to hurt people.

Do you think horrible people who do nasty things to other people shouldn't apologise?
That's a really odd stance to take?

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 19:41

Sorry I think I misread your question or don't really understand it?

Also I hope you are doing OK, I know people post of forums and stuff when they have lots of things going on and online behaviour can be a vent for real life so it's OK if you are taking out stuff from real life on here if you have loads going on, it's a hard world and I don't judge you for your put downs

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 19:44

*question.
If you do loads of harm (even unknowingly) then it's best to make up for it isn't it?
If you cause harm and know you are doing it then that's really bad, but most people are good and not just out for money or to hurt people.

Do you think horrible people who do nasty things to other people shouldn't apologise?
That's a really odd stance to take?*

it's not my stance.

I said who not why?

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 19:45

Also I hope you are doing OK, I know people post of forums and stuff when they have lots of things going on and online behaviour can be a vent for real life so it's OK if you are taking out stuff from real life on here if you have loads going on, it's a hard world and I don't judge you for your put downs

I'm afraid i do judge you.

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 19:46

And that was almost a masterclass in the veiled put down.

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 19:48

In a way it's sad to see you all desperately trying to stop anyone looking into this because if they are right you will all be on the wrong side of history as they say, which would be a shame and I do hope you will all apologise if that's the case.

I was referring to this.

Who should be apologised to? It's something you said.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 20:04

Does it matter?
Are you picking a fight?
I just have no interest in conflict, why are you keeping this going while saying let it go? It's real bonkers behaviour?!

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 20:08

I have no idea what is going on here but it seems really toxic.
Wishing you all the best.

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 20:08

excuse me?

I just who we should apologise to?
Your quote.

HelpfulMonkey · 06/02/2023 20:12

"I just who we should apologise to?

is words in a line that doesn't mean anything?
Are you OK?

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 20:18

Before you start asking me if "I'm ok"
you said ( direct quote )

In a way it's sad to see you all desperately trying to stop anyone looking into this because if they are right you will all be on the wrong side of history as they say, which would be a shame and I do hope you will all apologise if that's the case

And so I asked the obvious question,

who do we have to apologise to?

You're shouting all this other stuff like you've lost the plot 🤷‍♀️ but basically just answer the question.

Crikeyalmighty · 06/02/2023 20:21

@CrunchyCarrot I totally agree with your points- I'm not in the business of wanting to prove 'I'm right' or 'I'm wrong' - I've been unwell since covid and 4th vaccine(which were very close as tested positive a couple of days post vaccine) - my ill health could be a covid after effect, could be a vaccine effect - could be totally coincidental but I won't be having anymore jabs- it's vital that extensive research and evaluation continues to help those who have developed fibromyalgia/CF/king covid/ heart issues etc. we need to try and get to the bottom of why some people are more vulnerable than others. I don't quite get the point of those desparate to try and find some conspiracy etc - maybe they could redirect their wrath towards the people that allowed this virus to get in the system-

sunglassesonthetable · 06/02/2023 20:39

Yes CrunchyCarrot agree very much with your last post.

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