Boris refused to rule out lockdown

[Puppylucky]

Boris Johnson refused to deny that he would consider lockdown again if the Covid Pandemic took an unexpected turn and now the papers are full of lockdown headlines again. Will we ever move beyond this?

I wouldn't comply with another one, nor would most people.

@Antarcticant

I don’t think lateral flow tests are picking up the new variants.

I've got it at the moment, so most likely Omicron, and had a positive LFT. I'm sneezing and coughing, and my nose is like a waterfall. Quite shocking to think it would be perfectly legal for me to wander round town spreading it to all and sundry including vulnerable people (obviously I am going nowhere further than my sofa!).

Why is it shocking? It's never been illegal to go out with any other virus.

@User748956

Right now there are people who go out to work and people who don’t. People who are busy and people who aren’t. Not sure why you would make that a lockdown specific thing unless you were implying that most people who weren’t going to an office, were at home baking banana bread.

A lot of people on furlough were baking banana bread or similar, sitting in the sun and banging on about Rishi for PM

Oh fuck off with this. People on furlough were worried about keeping their jobs.

@mmmmmmghturep

Would people refuse lockdown if a new variant or virus was particularly deadly for children

As a childfree by choice woman who always got stuck with the shit shifts in the past and it was never reciprocated i really wouldnt like to say.

I reckon it's fair to say your employers might be asking you to do a whole lot more of them in that scenario...

I dont currently work but yes they likely would. It would cause huge resentment.

@mmmmmmghturep

I dont currently work but yes they likely would. It would cause huge resentment.

That's true, and could be a significant problem in itself.

A lot of people on furlough were baking banana bread or similar, sitting in the sun and banging on about Rishi for PM

Well there was fuck all else to do when everything is shut and you're told your job is going. There was also the small matter of quite a few of us having to organise funerals of loved ones during lockdown. So yeah happy days.

@TheKeatingFive

What he said was reasonable enough.

However people are being naive when they speculate about deadlier strains and lockdowns. I cannot see essential workers happily popping out to work in a situation where they'd be genuinely risking their lives. So it wouldn't be another lockdown we'd be facing, but the prospect of societal collapse.

The circs that facilitated the lockdowns we've had were very unique. I doubt a similar situation could ever come to pass.

A government imposed lockdown might not be needed for a scary enough variant, but it's not a binary situation with only two options of 'omicron' and 'a variant so scary it causes societal collapse'. There are lots of possibilities in between. No one can rule out temporary stay at home orders in the future.

Some people seem to want to push the idea that lockdowns are somehow done to benefit the people who wfh while putting those who go out at risk. This isn't something like a hurricane though, it's an infectious disease. The danger to the essential workers who work outside their homes is worse the more people they are forced to meet. With a new infectious disease, the more people stay at home during the worst of it, the safer it is for those workers who do have to go out.

There are lots of possibilities in between.

In theory, yes.

However, the window of 'scary enough for compliance' (given that the bar will be much higher after last time) but 'not sufficiently scary that essential workers won't play ball' (because they probably won't all be quite so willing again, even if it's not a big threat to them, let's face it), strikes me as pretty small, if it exists at all.

I think we need to reflect on the fact that the circs of March 2020/Jan 2021 were very serendipitous from the POV of lockdowns being viable. I honestly can't see that again

Nobody actually thinks it's a binary choice between Omicron and full societal collapse, though. There's a tendency for some people who disagree with arguments that lockdown won't happen again to default to the sort of variant that would get us to that stage, 10% mortality rates and the like, but that isn't the same thing. They make that argument precisely because they've not realised that the scenarios they present would lead to significant disorder.

The salient point however is that while there are lots of possibilities in between, the space where Tory MPs could allow a PM to implement and fund lockdown plus the public not respond with scornful laughter doesn't overlap much with people being willing to carry on doing essential work and behaving. Because it would actually have to get pretty bad for a lockdown to be tolerated and paid for. And we're already seeing some issues with essential worker shortages already, despite the relative wildness of Omicron.

It's all very well saying we can't rule out the possibility of lockdown in the future, but nobody has yet come up with a set of circumstances that would allow all the necessary planks to be in place either.

@Puppylucky

Boris Johnson refused to deny that he would consider lockdown again if the Covid Pandemic took an unexpected turn and now the papers are full of lockdown headlines again. Will we ever move beyond this?

Of course he wouldn't "rule it out". What would be the point of boxing himself in like that? If you asked him whether he ever planned to use nuclear weapons he'd answer in the same way!

It's weird how some people interpret "not ruling something out" with "we're eager to do so as soon as we have an opportunity".

It was just an interview, of course he isn't going to say yes or no, like most things

And now the fines have made the possibility of further significant restrictions during this pandemic even more remote...

Yep that horse has bolted now - cannot see any UK Government try lockdown again for a long time.

People will care even less about getting fined if they have the money, there is no shame, you just pay up and move on, like the government do. Lockdown is for the poor.

@User843976

People will care even less about getting fined if they have the money, there is no shame, you just pay up and move on, like the government do. Lockdown is for the poor.

Same for speeding fines, parking tickets and unauthorised school absences - anything that is a fixed penalty notice.

Speeding fines are a little bit different as you can get a ban when they tot up but anything that is just a fine and goes no further, not sure about school absences, only affects the poor, probably why the government used the fine system for lockdown breaches so they can do as they want

Of course he can't rule out that it may be needed.

I think after he's proved he doesn't actually think people should follow those rules getting compliance maybe something else entirely!

@User843976 - I used to think that about speeding fines, but there are thousands of people still driving with 12 Points - money talks.

@itsgettingweird

Of course he can't rule out that it may be needed.

I think after he's proved he doesn't actually think people should follow those rules getting compliance maybe something else entirely!

Yeah the link between the two is that even if Johnson does think lockdown is needed, it also has to be politically possible. There's more to it than what he thinks. We saw in December that he apparently wanted more restrictions but knew he couldn't carry the Cabinet and parliamentary party, so it didn't happen. And now his ability to enforce anything like that has been eroded even further.

It goes wider than just the ones at the parties too. All the other Tory MPs who've justified it have also placed themselves in a position where they can't tell other people not to have social gatherings again. Just imagine what the response from the public would be.

It also all feeds into the idea that they didn't really think lockdown was that good an idea, or they'd have observed it too. Very hard to come back from that sort of trust erosion.

I wasnt affected by the horrendous things some have been through like not being able to go to a funeral or giving birth alone. But the psychological abuse dished out by the Government and sorry but its a fact ( some of the NHS on social media) and on the Covid board on here was disgusting. The "look them in the eyes" crap Abusive. Being TOLD that visiting my TWO relatives in their home on Christmas Day 2020 was basically the same as going to an all night rave was ridiculous and abusive. All emotional blackmail. Its really made me realise how many coercively controlling abusers walk amongst us. It has also caused a major shift in my personal life which i cant talk about on here. Going through this many of us wernt even allowed the space to talk about it on here. Were called Covid deniers and got deleted. Im double vaxxed. But some people confused Covid denial with anti lockdown and conflated the two deliberately. Lets hope no one decides to put their head above the parapet and remind certain quarters of this should MN enter any future partnership with any mental health organisation.

I loathe Boris but IMO Hancock was worse. He was really getting off on the power and the abuse. His smirking at the press conferences made me feel sick. His "dont blow it now" comments while all the while his aide was blowing him. He absolutely loved the power and shifting the blame back on to the public for a VIRUS. Mind you they all love to shift the blame. Ive never hated any public figure as much as i hate Hancock.

www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/4530884-Hepatitis-outbreak-in-children?