Crazy shi*t people say about Covid and vaccines

[zafferana]

Tradesman comes to my house once a year and I've got to know him moderately well over the years as we always chat about holidays and our kids and stuff like that. Yesterday though I told him we're going away at half term and he told me the following:

*he knows a bloke who works for AstraZeneca who told him that he'd never get the vaccine and that he shouldn't either and that anyone who did was mad;

*he also knows someone who can get him an NHS vaccine pass for £500 and if he gets desperate enough for a holiday that's what he's going to do;

*he thinks it's very suspicious that the govt were encouraging everyone to get vaccinated and wonders why they did that;

*that he had a bad flu in December and was in bed for 10 days with it, but he didn't lose his taste and smell and never had a cough, so it definitely wasn't Covid, but he didn't test, because it was flu and he's had flu before, so he knows what it feels like and that's definitely what it was;

*that he's hoping that next year all the restrictions around the un-vaccinated will be lifted as he's pinning his hopes on finally being able to go skiing again in 2023.

This is a guy who LOVES to go skiing with his mates, who told me about a miserable UK glamping holiday he and his family had in the pouring rain last summer and how shit it was, yet he's prepared to keep doing that rather than get vaccinated. I wished him good luck. He asked me not to tell him about any holidays I'm going on 🤣🤣🤣

@HunterHearstHelmsley

he knows a bloke who works for AstraZeneca who told him that he'd never get the vaccine and that he shouldn't either and that anyone who did was mad

I genuinely know someone who works for them. She says not to get the jab. She's an anti vaxxer. God knows why she has that job!

I know someone who says they won't have the jab as they want the government to have their info. Whilst having loads of NHS treatment for an ongoing issue. They can't see the link.

To counter that, i know two people who work for AZ. Both are fully vaxxed. Both are not nuts.

Social media has really done a number on some people

This is true, though it cuts both ways and also applies to the ridiculous scare stories the net has pawned

There's a much longer version of this somewhere - I'll try to find it - but here are just a few to be going on with: www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-trending-53640964

Here we go; worldwide version this time
Depressing just how many there are ...

factcheck.afp.com/covid-19-real-images-wrong-context

Years ago 5% of the UK population could not follow the plot of Dixon of Dock Green so it's hardly surprising there is a section of the population that can't think straight about Covid, vaccines, etc. We may have to accept that some people are (to borrow a Catholic phrase) invincibly ignorant despite state education. And if course there are those who manipulate them for political gain.

I would say the level of misinformation regarding severity of COVID is far far lower than that of misinformation that minimises/denies it or surrounding vaccination.

Given the very high vaccination rates in most places, this seems improbable.

Well, apparently the covid vaccine doesn’t work and neither does the wearing of masks.

Are there up to date scientific figures that show what the death toll would be now without vaccinations (and masks)?

@MillieMoonbeam

Well, apparently the covid vaccine doesn’t work and neither does the wearing of masks.

Are there up to date scientific figures that show what the death toll would be now without vaccinations (and masks)?

These projections are just for the US, but the ratios should be similarly in other countries with comparable vaccination rates.

www.commonwealthfund.org/publications/issue-briefs/2021/dec/us-covid-19-vaccination-program-one-year-how-many-deaths-and

the fans were flamed by a recent discovery of a new more virulent, highly transmissble strain of HIV in Europe.

Link please.

I read BBC and The Guardian every day. Seen nothing about it. (Different for gonorhea (sp?) though). I used to work for an aids organisation so like to be up on the news.

O and anything died within 28 days if a positive test dhed of something else but anyone who died within 28 days of vaccibe was killed by the vaccine.

Anyone who. died vaccine

he knows a bloke who works for AstraZeneca who told him that he'd never get the vaccine and that he shouldn't either and that anyone who did was mad;

Entirely possible. There must be a lot of people who work for them; it's quite likely some feel like this.

he also knows someone who can get him an NHS vaccine pass for £500 and if he gets desperate enough for a holiday that's what he's going to do;

I'm not experienced in this, but I'd be amazed if you couldn't get fake vaccine passports.

he thinks it's very suspicious that the govt were encouraging everyone to get vaccinated and wonders why they did that;

I don't think it's weird to be uneasy about the amount of government pressure to get everyone vaccinated ASAP - the UK isn't too bad on this front but countries such as Austria are really quite scary. I'm very uneasy about it, as I value bodily autonomy.

that he had a bad flu in December and was in bed for 10 days with it, but he didn't lose his taste and smell and never had a cough, so it definitely wasn't Covid, but he didn't test, because it was flu and he's had flu before, so he knows what it feels like and that's definitely what it was;

Who knows? Does it matter at this point?

that he's hoping that next year all the restrictions around the un-vaccinated will be lifted as he's pinning his hopes on finally being able to go skiing again in 2023.

It's possible. We'll see, won't we. Otherwise he's always got the option of that fake vax pass!

A family acquaintance spent a lot of the pandemic posting stuff on social media about how it was all made up, how governments were joining together to dupe us, how the vaccines were to control us, how lateral flow tests were a scam, how his natural immunity from drinking spring water would protect him etc. Some quite weird stuff. Then it suddenly stopped and I found out why.

He died of Covid in November.

@zafferana

Tradesman comes to my house once a year and I've got to know him moderately well over the years as we always chat about holidays and our kids and stuff like that. Yesterday though I told him we're going away at half term and he told me the following:

*he knows a bloke who works for AstraZeneca who told him that he'd never get the vaccine and that he shouldn't either and that anyone who did was mad;

*he also knows someone who can get him an NHS vaccine pass for £500 and if he gets desperate enough for a holiday that's what he's going to do;

*he thinks it's very suspicious that the govt were encouraging everyone to get vaccinated and wonders why they did that;

*that he had a bad flu in December and was in bed for 10 days with it, but he didn't lose his taste and smell and never had a cough, so it definitely wasn't Covid, but he didn't test, because it was flu and he's had flu before, so he knows what it feels like and that's definitely what it was;

*that he's hoping that next year all the restrictions around the un-vaccinated will be lifted as he's pinning his hopes on finally being able to go skiing again in 2023.

This is a guy who LOVES to go skiing with his mates, who told me about a miserable UK glamping holiday he and his family had in the pouring rain last summer and how shit it was, yet he's prepared to keep doing that rather than get vaccinated. I wished him good luck. He asked me not to tell him about any holidays I'm going on 🤣🤣🤣

I have dealt with some bat shit crazy comments from the start of the pandemic and have started to turn the tables. When someone tells me that the government are going to ‘switch all the vaxxed off’ I reply with ‘hmmm that doesn’t really make any sense, what if in actual fact the vaccine is the antidote so when the government switch on their la la land machine all the unvaccinated are dust, I mean why would the government want to eradicate those that are compliant?’ You should see the cogs turning 😂😂

@ollyollyoxenfree

So I was speaking in a more general sense *@nojudgementhere*, in terms of scientific censorship, however I appreciate my post was worded appallingly Regarding vaccination, credible scientists pretty much unanimously agree with the current guidance in the UK of it being recommended for all over 12s.

I was referring to the idea if a scientist has an argument against the "mainstream" (be it HRT, a vitamin for some health condition, vaccination of a certain group), if it is evidence based, then their views are generally respected and add to the current state of evidence.

When you do see someone who's views are not taken seriously, or their paper is retracted or they are deplatformed or whatever, it's easy to think "oh it's because he's going against government/big pharma", but in reality it is because they are talking nonsense not based in any kind of robust evidence.

Your point regarding arguments against the mainstream is interesting as it highlights a difference in attitude and approach that this pandemic seems to have sparked within the scientific community. With other areas there seems to be room for alternative viewpoints and evidence to be put forward without the aggressive/fearful/scornful responses that any alternative view of Covid seems to provoke. Why do you think this is?

I've always (probably naively!) seen Science and Medicine as a search for answers, but to find answers surely you need to be asking questions, and in such a toxic and politicised atmosphere this is being made extremely difficult. This shutting down of debate also has the unintended consequence of making anybody already hesitant even more distrustful, which is obviously not helpful. Going on to brand them as consiparcy theorists or irredemably thick is only going to push them even further away, so threads like this one probably help to compound the problem.

Mine is kind if the other way round. Plumber showed up with a full WW2 style gas mask on and then wondered why I wouldn’t let him in with it on! Sorry, if I can’t see any of your face and can’t hear you, it aint happening.

Yesterday, from two different people,
"Now that Covid is over..."
"We're coming out of Covid now and can get back to normal..."

Whilst the majority of people I spend time with are fully vaccinated, people seem to nit understand the severity of what a pandemic is, and the long-reaching implications.

I've always (probably naively!) seen Science and Medicine as a search for answers, but to find answers surely you need to be asking questions, and in such a toxic and politicised atmosphere this is being made extremely difficult. This shutting down of debate also has the unintended consequence of making anybody already hesitant even more distrustful, which is obviously not helpful. Going on to brand them as consiparcy theorists or irredemably thick is only going to push them even further away, so threads like this one probably help to compound the problem.

It's not sensible or reasonable to think that you (general) are in a position to cherry pick what medical advice you think you should take when you have no scientific background.

@FourChimneys

A family acquaintance spent a lot of the pandemic posting stuff on social media about how it was all made up, how governments were joining together to dupe us, how the vaccines were to control us, how lateral flow tests were a scam, how his natural immunity from drinking spring water would protect him etc. Some quite weird stuff. Then it suddenly stopped and I found out why.

He died of Covid in November.

I hear that the Darwin Awards have had an unusually high level of applicants in the last year.

A health care professional told me that the vaccine causes infertility and that since January last year ICU is full of vaccinated young people hospitalised after getting it - apparently an ICU nurse told him this. When I pointed out that young people weren’t even offered the vaccine until June of that year in my country he was undeterred.

The echo chamber algorithms create on social media and Google are dangerous. They started as helpful. Now they are literally costing lives and causing riots.

@Itsnotover

I've always (probably naively!) seen Science and Medicine as a search for answers, but to find answers surely you need to be asking questions, and in such a toxic and politicised atmosphere this is being made extremely difficult. This shutting down of debate also has the unintended consequence of making anybody already hesitant even more distrustful, which is obviously not helpful. Going on to brand them as consiparcy theorists or irredemably thick is only going to push them even further away, so threads like this one probably help to compound the problem.

It's not sensible or reasonable to think that you (general) are in a position to cherry pick what medical advice you think you should take when you have no scientific background.

Is it OK for scientists/doctors to do this then or do you have issues with anybody daring to question the official narrative?

It's not that I object to people questioning narratives. But

It's quite arrogant to assume you know better than epidemiologists who have dedicated their life's work to something.

With other areas there seems to be room for alternative viewpoints and evidence to be put forward without the aggressive/fearful/scornful responses that any alternative view of Covid seems to provoke. Why do you think this is?

This is what I've asked time and again, and as with the other glaring example of climate change there's rarely an answer
IME the best you'll get is "you're not an expert", which while true seems to ignore an awful lot of issues around messaging, funding and all the rest

In general I've no objection to scientific consensus in theory, but I like to know what's going on beyond just the headlines

With other areas there seems to be room for alternative viewpoints and evidence to be put forward without the aggressive/fearful/scornful responses that any alternative view of Covid seems to provoke. Why do you think this is?

Maybe because Covid has caused unprecedented disruption to everyone's lives. Not even just in the UK but throughout the world.