Deaths from Covid alone in 2020 = 9,400

[Whydidimarryhim]

There has been a freedom of information release from the Office of National Statistics (ONS) - Jan 7th 22
There data show that total deaths from Covid in 2020 - this is the number of deaths from adults who had NO underlying issues ie heart disease/diabetes etc - the total No is 9400.
From Jan 2021 to Sept 2021 the total deaths from Covid alone - was 0-64 age range = 2225 and 65+ 5746. All this is for England and Wales
This information is on utube from Dr John Campbell - He has been covering Covid since late 2019.
What is interesting is that this info hasn’t been on the news.

@Blubells

Well, as the mum of an immunosuppressed child, I was very pleased when masks were reasonably introduced.

Do the benefits of masks, especially the ones worn by schoolchildren, in terms of reduced transmission really outweigh the costs - in terms of difficulty understanding (not just for the hard of hearing), seeing facial expressions, steamed up glasses etc?

If the benefits do not outweigh the costs then masks should not be enforced for all

I think, when we have literally millions of cases in the community, then yes they do. Especially in the middle of winter, which as various posters have been pointing out in recent days, is peak respiratory season.

I also think masks should not be enforced for all. Genuine exemptions are reasonable. Although my teen who has asthma, eczema and likely ASD seems very comfortable wearing a FFP2 despite I guess grounds for exemptions (and I realise not all people with ASD etc experience things in the same way).

I think being in school with a mask is a lot better at this stage than being at home. Also better than being taught 2 or 3 classes together in a hall.

@herecomesthsun We didn't have to pretend there wasn't a pandemic but nothing will justify some decisions I saw on what was acceptable. The chilling thing is the people I talked to about it just look at me in silence or said this is what we have to do in the name of Covid. Moral compass chucked in the bin. Do you think it is acceptable that someone struggling to communicate is only offered an end of life zoom appt ? Guess what that person is still alive 14 mths later because some people said this is wrong. Unlike the souless majority.
I saw a person who volunteers for the vulnerable, cancer patients and the like. He tried to say on a local FB hospital page what he was witnessing in the name of "Covid" he got shouted down, called a Covid denier and people baying for him to be banned off the page and FB. Terrifying and certainly has left a lot of us feeling very detached from society around us .
So much more I could say. I hope one day a lot comes to light and people feel ashamed.

Actually I was arguing the case for patients to be allowed visitors for End of Life on my ward, took it to the Medical Director and got permission for visits in April 2020.

That's perfectly compatible with the other things I've said here.

I think being in school with a mask is a lot better at this stage than being at home.

Yes, assuming that the masks are actually stopping transmission - the evidence of which is controversial.

Scientific consensus is on the side of masks, and the south east asian countries using them in schools - and in society generally - have generally done quite well with cases and outcomes. There's better evidence than the small recent study that suggested a benefit but was too small to do the full stats.

Obviously, things need to be arranged so that teaching is clear etc, and questions can be asked.

I’m glad we recognise the downsides of masks in classrooms.

And that it will be individual choice now

Not everyone will be pleased but higher grade masks are an option

I'm not sure what point you're trying to make, OP? Are you suggesting that the lives of all of the people who did have underlying conditions were somehow less important?

My DSis is CEV due to an underlying condition that is fully managed. Nobody would have any idea that she is CEV unless she chose to tell them. She holds down a very demanding full time job which makes a positive difference to society, and lives a completely normal life - raising her dc, seeing friends, exercising, pursuing interests etc. Why should the loss of a life like hers be reported on differently from that of someone with no underlying conditions.

Genuine question - what's the difference in your mind?

and who cares about vulnerable children eh?

How long do you want all school children to wear masks?

Until we are out of the "peak respiratory season". March -ish

Why should the loss of a life like hers be reported on differently from that of someone with no underlying conditions.

Because it's interesting and important to understand how covid is affecting people differently.

@herecomesthsun

Until we are out of the "peak respiratory season". March -ish

Do individual outcomes change by season for children? Ie if you are vulnerable are you more likely to have worse outcome in winter than summer

I did Google to see and was reminded of the summer RSV situation which was due to pushing back infections

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-57908561.amp

The winter season is more about capacity isn’t it

@Blubells

Why should the loss of a life like hers be reported on differently from that of someone with no underlying conditions.

Because it's interesting and important to understand how covid is affecting people differently.

But if that were the case, it would be necessary to provide a breakdown of all of the different types of underlying conditions - not just "no underlying conditions" vs "with underlying conditions". Otherwise it's meaningless.

But if that were the case, it would be necessary to provide a breakdown of all of the different types of underlying conditions - not just "no underlying conditions" vs "with underlying conditions".

Of course - I'm assuming that scientists and doctors have access to that data!

For the rest of us it's reassuring to know that Covid is, in general, not very harmful if you're young and healthy.

Probably 50% of the country have an underlying condition of some sort though
Be it obesity , diebetes , asthma etc

Probably 50% of the country have an underlying condition of some sort though
Be it obesity , diebetes , asthma etc

Then it's no wonder the UK has fared relatively worse.

@Blubells

But if that were the case, it would be necessary to provide a breakdown of all of the different types of underlying conditions - not just "no underlying conditions" vs "with underlying conditions".

Of course - I'm assuming that scientists and doctors have access to that data!

For the rest of us it's reassuring to know that Covid is, in general, not very harmful if you're young and healthy.

It might indeedbe reassuring to those who are fortunate enough to be young and healthy, but unfortunately it sends the message to those who do have underlying conditions that their lives do not matter as much. And typically, it is used as an argument to get rid of all restrictions so that all of those healthy young people can get on with their lives as normal without having to worry about the many millions who are not quite so fortunate.

If it was purely about reassuring people, fine. Usually, I find that there is another agenda going on.

I'm not worried about covid for myself. I'm triple boosted and I only had it mildly when I caught it. I just don't buy into the narrative that suggests that the lives of "healthy young people" are the only ones that really count.

@Blubells i think that would apply in many countries , underlying conditions can be many things and not things that are life threatening and uk / europe have very similar numbers when you take in to account per capita

I think I read somewhere that the majority of underlying conditions are categorises as other. I think it was 70% at onr point. Other includes things like eczema or broken bones which is totally unrelated to COVID.
This makes the data meaningless.
Hell I reckon on that basis I have 6 underlying conditions.

@Blubells also people can have an underlying condition that they do not know about , heart conditions etc some people have no symptoms until something happens
Plus its always been quite clear that for the vast majority of healthy people covid will be a mild disease ,but there are always exceptions
Theres no denying that its killed a lot of people prematurely worldwide

@Sunnyd71 yes I remember reading something like this
Maybe they should list all the underlying conditions they include might shock a few on here who think they are healthy

28% UK adults are obese

an additional 36% are overweight

8 million people have asthma

4 million have diabetes

1 in 3 adults has high blood pressure

and so on

The data doesn’t mean everything but it’s not meaningless.

@Blubells

*Probably 50% of the country have an underlying condition of some sort though Be it obesity , diebetes , asthma etc*

Then it's no wonder the UK has fared relatively worse.

Yes if you look at Japan’s figures for obesity they are far lower

If you were to line up countries based on travel levels including tourism / age / border control reality / demographics including weight you’d not be far off with guessing which countries would be worst hit.

And privacy laws in that list

Probably others