A 2-week 'circuit breaker' could be coming after Christmas

[dancingstars]

Reported by The Times and The Guardian which means another NYE stuck indoors...

most pubs near me dont even have outdoors seating and its going to get colder this week whose going to bother

@CentrifugalBumblePuppy

I love it when people say that they’ll just ignore another lockdown.

I’m happy to send you photos of our chronically sick, fully vaccinated, CEV friend who is in critical care right now, on continuous oxygen, with debate going on if he’ll be fit enough to leave for Christmas, or if ICU is the best next step in his treatment.

He’s late 40s, good fitness & clean diet, non smoker, caught Covid whilst at work, just born with a dodgy ticker.

But it’s ok, you just go on being bloody minded idiots.

Our friend has been in hospital for a week so far. That’s a week that someone could be using that bed for anything other than covid. But someone happened to walk into his work for a meeting, refused to masks because ‘it’s my right not to!’ And boom. Another NHS bed filled.

This pandemic has taught me a couple of things.

1. That some people are so obsessed with themselves & their ‘rights’ (or more likely wants not needs or rights) that they are happy to steamroll over the needs of other folk to get what they want;

2. That there are many, many fewer folk that are working their cojones off to ensure that we all keep safe, fed and healthy, and they’re at breaking point right now with the attitude of the first group;

3. That critical thinking & following the science is an anathema to a large proportion of the public, who would rather bitch about, “Well, Boris told us that we wouldn’t need restrictions anymore!” rather than “Oh blimey, there’s a new more transmissible variant, how can we help protect ourselves and others?”.

Look, no one wants to lockdown. Everyone wants the freedom of 2 years ago. But the playing field has changed; this is a pandemic with not only the potential to kill, it can overwhelm our (underfunded & less in patient beds due to Tory policy) NHS.

That is the sad reality.

Now, who wants to see my friend’s selfies with all the tubes & wires?

I'll send you a picture of our friend who had survived depression and turned his life around. Oh right I can't because he killed himself in the first lockdown. We need to be realistic, we have convinced ourselves that no matter how I'll we get medicine will save us the truth is sometimes it can't

@Puzzledandpissedoff

oh please you think it’s fine to follow rules by someone who sets them and breaks them repeatedly and keep their job?

Looking at the number in government who've been caught out - and that's just the ones we know about - I suspect the problem would be finding someone who didn't

Then there is my argument that we decide for ourselves what is ‘safe’ and what isn’t because looks nobody else is .

@Maddymorphosis

Yeah those bloody selfish people, not wanting to lose their job or home which lockdowns can result in, how dare they

This.

I'm sick to death of people acting like it's just a minor inconvenience. I'm willing to bet all those people crying "selfish" aren't at risk of losing their jobs.

@MarshaBradyo

MN is rife with it at the moment which must mean certain organisations and bodies are desperate to sway public perception away from prioritising lives and health over ‘freedoms’.

Wishful thinking on your part I’d say.

You feel like you are in the minority because you are. You are on the extreme end of wanting to be in lockdown for a long time and you are blind to the harms they bring.

I don’t know why because they are so obvious to nearly everyone else

On the MN Covid threads I probably am in the minority. Like I said, a lot of people have vested interests in swaying perceptions, wouldn’t you agree, Marsha?

I also don’t want us to be in lockdown, and I believe you already know as a fellow Covid thread devotee, I’ve been advocating for mitigation’s to prevent lockdown- Face masks and certain venues having limits etc all so we could avoid this mess we’re about to find ourselves in.

The harms lockdowns bring are unfortunately outweighed by the harms they prevent simply because they're always a last resort after we’ve dilly dallied over mitigation’s to prevent them in the first place.

I said a few months ago when Sajid Javid announced no more lockdowns ever again, that we will reach a stage where the country will be calling out for it. I think we’re almost at that point- there’s a lot of people concerned right now. Look at the mask compliance, it’s far greater than most of us expected because people care starting to understand the gravity of our situation.

Because I regularly say we’ll end up in lockdown doesn’t mean I’m actually sat burning theatre tickets as an offering to the Lockdown deities whilst chanting ‘Furlough Work from home!’ In an effort to make it come true.

It’s because I can see how we’re screwing up our chances to avoid one.

We have observed every covid rule to date. After the Downing Street debacles of last Christmas preceded by Cummings, Handcock and Ferguson, I shall not be complying again. The Government has lost its moral authority.

Neither Ferguson nor Cummngs have ever been part of the government. The No.10 parties fiasco was almost entirely down to this country's incompetent civil service.

@CentrifugalBumblePuppy

I love it when people say that they’ll just ignore another lockdown.

I’m happy to send you photos of our chronically sick, fully vaccinated, CEV friend who is in critical care right now, on continuous oxygen, with debate going on if he’ll be fit enough to leave for Christmas, or if ICU is the best next step in his treatment.

He’s late 40s, good fitness & clean diet, non smoker, caught Covid whilst at work, just born with a dodgy ticker.

But it’s ok, you just go on being bloody minded idiots.

Our friend has been in hospital for a week so far. That’s a week that someone could be using that bed for anything other than covid. But someone happened to walk into his work for a meeting, refused to masks because ‘it’s my right not to!’ And boom. Another NHS bed filled.

This pandemic has taught me a couple of things.

1. That some people are so obsessed with themselves & their ‘rights’ (or more likely wants not needs or rights) that they are happy to steamroll over the needs of other folk to get what they want;

2. That there are many, many fewer folk that are working their cojones off to ensure that we all keep safe, fed and healthy, and they’re at breaking point right now with the attitude of the first group;

3. That critical thinking & following the science is an anathema to a large proportion of the public, who would rather bitch about, “Well, Boris told us that we wouldn’t need restrictions anymore!” rather than “Oh blimey, there’s a new more transmissible variant, how can we help protect ourselves and others?”.

Look, no one wants to lockdown. Everyone wants the freedom of 2 years ago. But the playing field has changed; this is a pandemic with not only the potential to kill, it can overwhelm our (underfunded & less in patient beds due to Tory policy) NHS.

That is the sad reality.

Now, who wants to see my friend’s selfies with all the tubes & wires?

Sorry we are way passed that now , you really believe that if we all stay home and have lockdown we will save these fit never been ill before 40 year olds?. Poor derek draper is shocking but even his wife and family agree what happened to him was extreme . We can’t and won’t keep locking down to protect these few it’s not possible and not to mention all the sacrifices financial / mentally etc . Even saying it’s selfish is water off a ducks back now as past caring .

@Florianus

We have observed every covid rule to date. After the Downing Street debacles of last Christmas preceded by Cummings, Handcock and Ferguson, I shall not be complying again. The Government has lost its moral authority.

Neither Ferguson nor Cummngs have ever been part of the government. The No.10 parties fiasco was almost entirely down to this country's incompetent civil service.

Someone got the 'lines to take' from Tory HQ

Like I said, a lot of people have vested interests in swaying perceptions, wouldn’t you agree

Most of us are just saying what we want to happen, it’s no more than that. Certainly not bot / organisation level as suggested in pp.

And it is not selfish which was also used as the oft used accusation.

@Florianus

We have observed every covid rule to date. After the Downing Street debacles of last Christmas preceded by Cummings, Handcock and Ferguson, I shall not be complying again. The Government has lost its moral authority.

Neither Ferguson nor Cummngs have ever been part of the government. The No.10 parties fiasco was almost entirely down to this country's incompetent civil service.

Yes but what did Boris do ? Sweet fanny Adam’s . Meantime he was instructing the police to fine people sitting on benches or meeting a friend for coffee and a walk .

I agree wiseone

From BBC

In England, modelling indicates that hospital admissions could peak at at least 3,000 a day without intervention measures beyond the Plan B rules currently in place, Sage advisers say in the leaked minutes.
The highest seven day average recorded last January reached just over 3,700 hospital admissions a day.
…,

So the worse case scenario from Sage is that if we do nothing, hospital admissions might be nearly as bad as they were last January - when we had far tighter restrictions than now. Did the nhs collapse then?

I did not know this but apparently the declining cases in Gauteng province are linked to the fact that many migrant workers leave the city, previous Beta wave also dropped in the same pattern? twitter.com/Tuliodna/status/1471910894527516688

I was really hoping it was declining there.

@gettingolderandgrumpy I agree with you totally
If I'm selfish for wanting to pay my bills and to have my son in education then so be it . I make no apologies

We can’t and won’t keep locking down to protect these few it’s not possible and not to mention all the sacrifices financial / mentally etc

Lockdown was never about protecting the minority of people who are particularly vulnerable to covid.

Alec, that’s the best case scenario if we do nothing, not the worst.

A circuit breakers just kicks it down the road, what's the point? Surely low level restrictions over a longer period are more effective than harsh ones for a short time.

Maths not your strong point, huh?

It started with Thatcher "there's no such thing as society" and decades of hollowing out our civic society and here we are. Everyone for himself and the devil takes the hindmost.

[quote TameDucksAtChatsworth]@Watapalava

If Mystic meg had a crystal ball and told you that "letting it rip" would cost the life of your loved one and health problems for another, would you still be as ballsy?

Or is it only fine if that happens to someone else?[/quote]
By the same token, do you think it's fine if endless lockdowns cost the life of your loved one and mental and physical health problems for several others? Or is okay, so long as they didn't catch Covid?

Yes but what did Boris do ?

I've got no idea if he even knew about the various parties. He doesn't live in No.10 which is a vast complex of rooms (you'd never guess from the narrow frontage, but it was formed from two large townhouses plus a huge mansion at the back). Some years ago it was said that 170 people worked in No,10 - probably more nowadays.

@vera99

It started with Thatcher "there's no such thing as society" and decades of hollowing out our civic society and here we are. Everyone for himself and the devil takes the hindmost.

What are you thinking of, when you say "everyone for himself"?

I think that the majority of people in favour of lockdown are entirely out for themselves, however much they dress it up as "protecting the NHS" and "saving lives".

They would be a bit less keen to do it if it affected them materially, emotionally or health-wise.

It would help if people could accept that the NHS is no longer fit for purpose. Health ought to be a cross-party issue. I am not talking about the individuals who do sterling service in the name of nursing/doctoring: I'm talking about the system itself.

Just wish we had some idea what the endgame is. Previously lockdowns etc were justified as we were waiting for vaccines and treatments. What are we waiting for now? What is being offered except an endless cycle of more or less restriction?

@Florianus

Yes but what did Boris do ?

I've got no idea if he even knew about the various parties. He doesn't live in No.10 which is a vast complex of rooms (you'd never guess from the narrow frontage, but it was formed from two large townhouses plus a huge mansion at the back). Some years ago it was said that 170 people worked in No,10 - probably more nowadays.

I think he knew about the one in his flat and the quiz he was photographed at

In China which I in no way support they are shaking down some of their super-rich coughs up or you die, got to jail get found out for corruption and the Party gets money to help fund the ongoing regime. Here folk like Bezos and Branston fly up in their billions toy rockets and laugh at us whilst hollowing out our societies and happy to see us scrapping amongst ourselves about who is most deserving of the scraps on the table.

I think that the majority of people in favour of lockdown are entirely out for themselves, however much they dress it up as "protecting the NHS" and "saving lives"

This makes no sense, of course those who see themselves as part of a society think protecting the society as being in their own interests, but it does protect the NHS and save lives.