To think we soon won’t be isolating even when we have covid.

[Grida]

If covid is spreading as rapidly as it seems to be, surely people who have tested positive but who don’t have symptoms/aren’t feeling ill will have to carry on working. The country will stop functioning otherwise.

@HailAdrian

And anyone who is clinically vulnerable will know that every year when you get your flu jab there’s a chance that you might get it anyway and end up dead or seriously unwell, or the strain of flu might change and evade the vaccine. It’s just something you learn to live with and accept as someone who is clinically vulnerable to stuff like that. Covid will end up being the same. It has to or we are all fucked.

Some people just don't want this. Covid is their lives now and essentially how they spend their spare time, reading about it, talking about it, thinking about it. Don't know what they'll do when it no longer dominates the news.

I think there is some truth in this. I think a lot of the people who are obsessed with the pandemic are people who’ve never really been unwell in their lives, never experienced disability or mortality as something that could / can / will affect them. So covid is this big scary thing that has become all-encompassing. Whereas for lots of disabled and vulnerable people, like myself, we live with the real threat of our own mortality facing us at any time and it’s something you just learn to put to one side, you have to in order to keep a grip on the “now” of your life.

@Blossomtoes

There will always be a few - a very small few - who will die of the flu or covid despite having a jab. We cannot destroy everyone’s lives because of this.

22,000 flu deaths in 2017/18. Nobody raised an eyebrow.

Precisely this.

You would have been deemed mental 2 years ago, if you suggested people try not to spread their germs and stay off work, if they have flu symptoms (so not to infect others who could die if it and any other virus)

You would have been known as ‘Mad Michelle’

Literally no one would bat an eyelid at the thought of 20,000 deaths of flu each year (or there abouts, every year) in fact, most people wouldn’t even know about it….

I can’t wait for the day when we don’t even have to test let alone isolate, we just treat it like any other virus and crack on.

@Bagelsandbrie

I couldn't agree with you more.

Every time I read things where it says "the CEV must be terrified, we must do more", I do wonder what they think we are doing every day.

@Duopuss81

Exactly. 22,000 vs 150,000. Basic maths no?? That’s why no one gives a shit about flu!

That was before we had vaccines though!

@Duopuss81

Exactly. 22,000 vs 150,000. Basic maths no?? That’s why no one gives a shit about flu!

We hadn’t had 150,000 covid deaths when 22,000 died from flu, had we? Nobody cared. 104 people have died from or with omicron - why such a massive over reaction?

It is a total lie that nobody raised an eyebrow at 22,000 deaths from flu in 2017/8. That is when they flu jab was deemed to have failed. There was a lot of coverage about it.
And all in all there were 50,000 extra deaths than expected this year.
I suspect a lot of people don't read serious news analysis, because this was widely talked about at the time and there was a lot of concern at the beginning of flu season.
This is the level of deaths you get from flu without an effective vaccine and no mitigations, so you can see it is far less deadly than covid.

And being honest, shielding social media groups are full of ill people scared of covid and doing what they can to protect themselves.
Only on MN do I see so called vulnerable people saying I don't care if I get it and die, as long as kids can do what they want.

I know people generally don't give a fuck about disabled people, that has been obvious for a very long time. So please don't try and pretend you do now. You don't care if vulnerable people die of covid. Even if all you had to do to prevent it was wear a mask in certain places during the winter every year.
Its why I no longer volunteer to work with other peoples kids and never will again. The vast majority of people don't give a fuck about me, so I return the favour now.

It is a total lie that nobody raised an eyebrow at 22,000 deaths from flu in 2017/8. That is when they flu jab was deemed to have failed. There was a lot of coverage about it.

We didn’t do anything though, did we? The shops and pubs stayed open, nobody shielded or worked from home. There was never a suggestion that we do anything other than carry on.

I think there is some truth in this. I think a lot of the people who are obsessed with the pandemic are people who’ve never really been unwell in their lives, never experienced disability or mortality as something that could / can / will affect them. So covid is this big scary thing that has become all-encompassing. Whereas for lots of disabled and vulnerable people, like myself, we live with the real threat of our own mortality facing us at any time and it’s something you just learn to put to one side, you have to in order to keep a grip on the “now” of your life.

My dm was very ill and initially afraid of covid (understandably) but she was a lot more relaxed after being vaccinated. I've always been laid back about catching it, from my point of view it was something that was inevitable.

I do think a lot of people who think lockdown is the answer every time rates increase are people who don't have to go out to work or don't work full stop and don't necessarily have very full lives which is why they won't let go easily.

No we didnt do anything. Because generally nobody gives a fuck about disabled and elderly people. If they did social care would not be the disgrace it is.
We locked down to make sure the NHS isn't overwhelmed and that all your children would still get treatment if they had an accident or an allergic reaction for example.
It has never been about disabled or elderly people.

There is no right answer here. It’s a huge balance and I don’t think anyone, doctor, politician, teacher or whatever can say what the best thing to do is.

We also have to look at the impact of lockdowns and isolating on vulnerable children. What is going on behind closed doors for these children? Domestic violence and others things we know goes up in lockdown. Poverty, lack of food, child abuse, social services stretched beyond belief. Children missing education.

Equally, ‘the vulnerable’ adults should be protected. But actually, lockdowns don’t just protect them, they protect (from a physical health point of view, not mental!) others too, at least in the short term.

It is really, really hard and no one has the answer. We are now pretty much two years on and although we have a vaccine, the numbers are worse than ever.

No idea what will happen, but I don’t believe that in ten years time, we’ll still be testing and isolating for this as a matter of course.

Covid has shown that the populations at partner wants to be babied. They struggle to extrapolate the reality from the numbers: they struggle to think beyond the headlines. We are testing way more people than we’re tested previously, is it any surprise that more cases are being found.

Everyday we hear, ‘oh but there’s just not enough data on omicron’, the same thing was said three weeks ago. What that really means is that there is just not enough concerning data on omicron. Which means precisely that it’s not a concerning variant.

When you hear the scare stories about not enough people in essential services, you have to ask why are asymptomatic people being made to isolate. It’s madness. When you get told ‘oh but the NHS will be overrun’. Yes that’s because beds are taken up by people who cannot be discharged for other reasons. The virus is not the problem, it’s the fact that you very incompetent govt official is hiding behind Covid. Not much different to banks not answering your phone ‘because of Covid’.

It’s as though there is a desire among people to want to be terrified over this, rather than look argue picture and think for yourself. Because when the govt is locking you down, you feel protected and safe. It’s really quite sad that such vast swathes of the population have been irrationally taken in by this.

Look you are all just arguing you want to carry on as normal because you don't care about anyone else except you and your own family. Just own it and stop making up bullshit excuses.

I don’t believe that in ten years time, we’ll still be testing and isolating for this as a matter of course.

We won’t be doing it in ten months, let alone ten years. Tolerance is wearing thin now. Unless a catastrophically lethal variant emerges, of course but viruses tend to grow milder as killing their hosts leads to their own extinction.

I'm behind you OP.

Covid isn't a concern for me: statistically - I'm youngish, no health conditions that I know of, triple vaccinated and had Covid.

But the restrictions? And the threat of a positive test? They are really screwing up my life. I'm not quite there yet, but I am really close to just ignoring mild symptoms and not testing.

@aliceca

And being honest, shielding social media groups are full of ill people scared of covid and doing what they can to protect themselves. Only on MN do I see so called vulnerable people saying I don't care if I get it and die, as long as kids can do what they want.

I know people generally don't give a fuck about disabled people, that has been obvious for a very long time. So please don't try and pretend you do now. You don't care if vulnerable people die of covid. Even if all you had to do to prevent it was wear a mask in certain places during the winter every year.
Its why I no longer volunteer to work with other peoples kids and never will again. The vast majority of people don't give a fuck about me, so I return the favour now.

But if you’re the sort of anxious person who joins health groups then you’re likely to be the sort of person who is in a panic about it and shields - whereas many here are here because they enjoy general debate and “happen” to be in the vulnerable groups. It’s more representative of the general population.

No one is saying they don’t care if they get it and die. Rather that if we are saying the vaccines work, and we have to trust the data that they do, then most are unlikely to be seriously unwell; even those that are vulnerable.

@aliceca

Look you are all just arguing you want to carry on as normal because you don't care about anyone else except you and your own family. Just own it and stop making up bullshit excuses.

Nailed it. Going out and going on holiday are literally more important to some people than other people’s lives

@aliceca

Look you are all just arguing you want to carry on as normal because you don't care about anyone else except you and your own family. Just own it and stop making up bullshit excuses.

Bit simplistic isn't it?

I don't have school aged children but am absolutely firm in my opinion that there must be no mass closures of schools, if only to try and reduce the number of Arthur Laninjo-Hughes scenarios playing out. Poor little soul.

He wasn't my own family

Nobody wants a full lockdown, school closures etc ever again but there is something in between that and “let’s all just get back to normal it’s only a cold” which is what so many people here are saying. It’s not that difficult to wear a mask and have to socially distance or isolate from time to time to protect others. Have the people saying we should all just stop worrying actually experienced a covid bereavement in their family or know someone who’s health has been shattered by the virus? I doubt it.

Yes we will have to do this otherwise I don’t think our economy will survive, and it’s not fair on those people who are waiting for important healthcare, surgeries etr to keep having to miss important appointments and surgeries. And we have the vaccination to help stop people getting seriously ill, plus we have that new medicine being rolled out by the NHS for those that have covid and are vulnerable. The downside of no longer isolating when you have covid is that quite a lot of people will be calling sick but this may only be for 2 or 3 days when they are feeling rough, instead of 10 days isolation.

@Bagelsandbrie totally wrong, I have no health anxiety. I joined a shielding group at the beginning of the pandemic to get information about the shielding programme as the government information was so shite.
And no this is not about lockdowns. I have always thought a lockdown means government policy has failed. But basic mitigations would save lives and prevent lockdowns.
Basic mitigations will disappear though by next year never to return until the next virus. And these will happen more often than in the past as we are encroaching too much on rainforest and exotic animals by cutting down trees on the edge of rainforest to graze livestock and grow palm oil. So it will happen again.
But being totally honest, don't ask me to give a fuck about your kids ever again when you don't give a fuck about elderly and disabled people. I have sacrificed my time in the past for kids who are not my own. Never again.

We should keep mask wearing and hand gel up for the foreseeable through.

Going out and going on holiday are literally more important to some people than other people’s lives

That is the majority of people isn't it. Or are you telling me that you gave up every single 'luxury' all the time pre covid to send money to save every life that could through poverty, disease etc.

We are all selfish and selfless in different ways.

I never expected society to stop when my DM was dieing. I certainly wouldn't expect people to lose their jobs/businesses or pleasures in life to keep me alive.

Hand gel achieves precisely nothing, so I wouldn't worry about that one.