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Original poster

Independent sage: circuit breaker lockdown needed now

551 replies

XmasGoose · 15/12/2021 18:01

I see Independent Sage have said that an immediate circuit breaker lockdown is needed to protect the NHS.

This would involve a total ban on household mixing, all bars, restaurants and indoor venues closing and schools shutting early for Christmas.

Is this needed now to protect the NHS and save lives? Personally I wouldn’t comply with another lockdown.

twitter.com/chrischirp/status/1471160024005324804?s=21

OP posts:
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herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:35

The Wales/ NI ones were late too, weren't they? (not that I have much knowledge of MI sorry)

I think the idea is to get in early and then the effect is equivalent to multiple more weeks of lockdown, later on.

Probably doesn't help if there are lots of people crossing the borders from England, which had different measures, either.

It might work in the right circumstances - as I said, not sure we have the right circumstances now.

If we do have more measures, I suspect they will again be forced by extreme circumstances and the need to flatten the curve, rather than a more proactive move.

RobinPenguins · 15/12/2021 22:35

@herecomesthsun

We haven't tried a circuitbreaker in England.

I'm not arguing for one now - there doesn't seem to be an easy answer to the situation we're in.

Getting boosters and voluntarily avoiding indoor crowded situations seems reasonable, which is what the scientists were saying tonight.

If we are going to have so many thousands of cases, a lot of society will shut down anyway, whether it's mandated or not.

We haven't tried a circuitbreaker in England.

What was lockdown 2 in November 2020? Granted that was 4 not 2 weeks but it was the same principle (and also didn’t work in the medium/longer term).

Againstmachine · 15/12/2021 22:35

For the people who say we haven't tried a circuit breaker in England, November was pretty much that and it didn't work.

TheKeatingFive · 15/12/2021 22:36

what exactly has ‘worked well’ so far?

Did I say anything had?

Though now that you ask ...

A full scale, lengthy lockdown, with a shit scared population, unfatigued and blissfully unaware of the costs of said lockdown (LD 1)

The initial vaccine rollout (for a number of months)

The first isn't replicable.

Let's hope the second can be achieved to some degree with the booster rollout.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:36

No, it was a lockdown, and it was 2 months late

TheKeatingFive · 15/12/2021 22:38

The Wales/ NI ones were late too, weren't they? (not that I have much knowledge of MI sorry)

I'm not sure why you're concluding they were 'late' and this isn't.

The infection numbers now are many, many multiples of what they were then.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:40

Actually the vaccines and boosters are still working pretty well at reducing numbers of deaths. I'm still very thankful we have those.

And the "3 Cs" measures do work.

Medical masks help a lot.

We haven't really got the hang of the full Japanese/ South Korean approach to managing respiratory disease, but I'm very impressed with the response of the people round where I live. People are very careful, and that is so admirable when these are behaviour patterns not in our culture.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:40

@TheKeatingFive

The Wales/ NI ones were late too, weren't they? (not that I have much knowledge of MI sorry)

I'm not sure why you're concluding they were 'late' and this isn't.

The infection numbers now are many, many multiples of what they were then.

Okay so I'm not saying that we need a circuitbreaker right now.

I do think we haven't really tried that approach properly yet, right?

RobinPenguins · 15/12/2021 22:41

@herecomesthsun

No, it was a lockdown, and it was 2 months late
And this isn’t too late?
Thewiseoneincognito · 15/12/2021 22:41

Stealth Lockdown has begun already, only this time no furlough so the financial impact will be a catastrophe.

uk.yahoo.com/news/10-days-christmas-britons-putting-121939109.html

EllaPaella · 15/12/2021 22:41

@CheesecakeAddict

To protect the NHS what we actually need to do is fund it properly, pay HCPs a competitive salary and take their work life balance seriously so it becomes somewhere people want to work. It doesn't matter how many vaccines we get, this extra burden will always be too much for what was already a stretched thin service in the first place.
Absolutely Well said 🙌
Againstmachine · 15/12/2021 22:41

I’m quite impressed Whitty has the strength of character to have stayed in that job. I’m glad he has but what a horrible couple of years he must have had.

He hasn't got strength of character he hasn't critised the government for various different things.

If he had strength of character he would have said something.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:42

The wave looks pretty well under way, that is why I am saying that a circuitbreaker isn't necessarily what we should be doing now.

If we had a lockdown now, I don't think it would be a circuitbreaker.

I'm not saying I have an answer (wish I had one!)

TheKeatingFive · 15/12/2021 22:43

Medical masks help a lot

A big push on the vulnerable / close contacts of the vulnerable wearing these might be a good strategy.

Againstmachine · 15/12/2021 22:44

No, it was a lockdown, and it was 2 months late

So are circuit breaks pointless or lockdowns pointless, they are pretty much same thing apart from length of time.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:44

Well we all have a version of the medical grade masks. (fingers crossed)

Bizawit · 15/12/2021 22:44

I'm done with "saving the NHS". If it wasn't in such a shit state and manifestly so unfit for purpose, it wouldn't need such regular "saving". Why can't there be an honest conversation about this?

100% this.

As for “independent sage”- Luckily they are irrelevant and no one has to give a flying toss what they have to say.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:45

@Againstmachine

No, it was a lockdown, and it was 2 months late

So are circuit breaks pointless or lockdowns pointless, they are pretty much same thing apart from length of time.

I think if the timing was early enough it would make a big difference.

This is the difficult thing, because if it worked people would then say, "We didn't need to do that..."

Againstmachine · 15/12/2021 22:47

So the circuit break made no difference then.

Starcup · 15/12/2021 22:47

People have done what they can. They won’t comply end of.

Bring in covid passports for everything I say, before they decide on a national lockdown.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:48

@Againstmachine

So the circuit break made no difference then.
Grin there wasn't a circuit break
MarshaBradyo · 15/12/2021 22:48

Why would a two week lockdown do anything apart from delay fast rise until directly after?

What is the thing this so called circuit breaker does

Againstmachine · 15/12/2021 22:49

there wasn't a circuit break

So there was a lockdown which is pretty much same thing.

herecomesthsun · 15/12/2021 22:50

naw

MarshaBradyo · 15/12/2021 22:51

What’s the difference Confused

Four weeks v two but the two will work better because it has a different name