Around 30,000 unvaccinated care staff will not be allowed to work from today.

[CalamariGames]

www.thesun.co.uk/health/16698590/care-home-staff-lose-job-unvaccinated/

This seems really concerning. I personally am in favour of the vaccination and I think care home staff should be vaccinated but this seems like a massive shortage of staff to compensate for in an industry that is already having difficulty with recruitment. What is the government doing to ensure vulnerable patients are getting the care they need?

@Ryannah

Personally I’m happy to see any punishment for selfish antivaxxers. If carers don’t trust in modern medicine and won’t protect their vulnerable patients then they shouldn’t be working in the care sector. All their colleagues have been jabbed and so have the people they care for, they’re just being selfish and ridiculous.

I honestly can't believe I now live in a country where people spout absolute bile like this, and others agree with it.

Brilliant. So now there will be even more hospital beds being taken up by otherwise well people because there are even fewer social care staff to discharge them into the care of.

Slow handicap.

I know it's awful

Ryannah

Personally I’m happy to see any punishment for selfish antivaxxers. If carers don’t trust in modern medicine and won’t protect their vulnerable patients then they shouldn’t be working in the care sector. All their colleagues have been jabbed and so have the people they care for, they’re just being selfish and ridiculous.

I honestly can't believe I now live in a country where people spout absolute bile like this, and others agree with it.

I agree QueenofKattegat

It's just trolling now. I've got stuff to do on Twitter..

It's a very underpaid and Unvalued career. Carers should be given a raise, not sacked.

I do wish all the carers the best of luck in finding a job that pays them well and respects them.

@Pippi1970

Hasn't there been a lot of education about this already? Cash incentives - people were up in arms when this was suggested in the past

I’d be happy for the government to offer cash incentives or bonuses to those care staff who are already vaccinated or to persuade those who aren’t.

That would probably make a big difference I think.

The thing is if you work in healthcare, with vulnerable, often immunocompromised people, it’s essential to do as much as you can to protect them.

When we first qualified (nhs) we had to be up do date with all of our vaccines as part of our employment contract. This is no different.

@vera99

“ roll up your sleeves and volunteer to help”

Help with what exactly?

Better pay and not sacking them might help?

Why would better pay encourage them to have a vaccine? It’s not like they’re only being offered it due to their job. The entire population is being encouraged to have it.

There was a care home manager on TV last week. They are part of a group and the management had organised for public health doctors and scientist to come into the homes to do talks on how vaccines work and present the scientific data on covid vaccines.

He said they wanted to make sure anyone giving up their career was doing in based on latest scientific evidence.
In his home they'd had 10 unvaccinated staff before the talks and now they only have 2.

@Amberflames

Better pay and not sacking them might help?

Why would better pay encourage them to have a vaccine? It’s not like they’re only being offered it due to their job. The entire population is being encouraged to have it.

I didn't say anything about getting them to have a vaccine

@CovidCorvid

“Why on Earth should people be forced to have a drug which has been proven to kill people?”

1. The drug (vaccine) has not been proven to kill people. You can’t write something like that without backing it up with evidence. Covid itself has killed far more people.

1. No one is being forced to have the vaccine. It is entirely optional. Like with anything in life, there are consequences to decisions we make. In this case, if people decide against getting the vaccine they will no longer be able to work in care or be patient facing in the nhs. They are free to look for other jobs elsewhere. Many other countries are doing the same, it’s not just the uk.

1. I personally feel encouragement to take the vaccine should have been the first option. Bonuses or cash incentives or similar would have been my choice. These would need to be given to all vaccinated care staff for fairness. It would probably be more cost effective to do this than a massive recruitment drive once they leave.

[quote Lollolloll]@CovidCorvid

“Why on Earth should people be forced to have a drug which has been proven to kill people?”

1. The drug (vaccine) has not been proven to kill people. You can’t write something like that without backing it up with evidence. Covid itself has killed far more people.

1. No one is being forced to have the vaccine. It is entirely optional. Like with anything in life, there are consequences to decisions we make. In this case, if people decide against getting the vaccine they will no longer be able to work in care or be patient facing in the nhs. They are free to look for other jobs elsewhere. Many other countries are doing the same, it’s not just the uk.

1. I personally feel encouragement to take the vaccine should have been the first option. Bonuses or cash incentives or similar would have been my choice. These would need to be given to all vaccinated care staff for fairness. It would probably be more cost effective to do this than a massive recruitment drive once they leave.[/quote]

@lollolloll don't get me wrong I'm very pro vaccine. But the vaccine has caused the deaths of some people. There's been numerous cases reported in the media and its why there was a reluctance by the medical people to agree to it for under 18s. It was felt that their personal benefit didn't outweigh the risk.

I agree nobody is being forced to have it and that decisions have consequences. But I disagree with the consequences. Nobody should have their employment terms and conditions changed like this.

I think people need to see the bigger picture of what effect on the elderly and vulnerable this decision will have due to staff leaving and vacancies being impossible to fill. I mean they might be at less risk of Covid but at more risk of neglect, pressure sores, being left wet, etc.

I wish everyone would choose to have it but I think it's wrong to sack people who don't. I hope ex staff take legal advice. Maybe down the line they'll get massive compensation pay outs which the govt will have to pay.

The govt own website says 1645 deaths in the last year in the UK have been linked to the vaccine though the majority of those cases haven't been fully investigated (why not) so could be an over estimation. But they are cases where medical staff thought there could be a link.

And while I agree Covid has killed more... For a healthy 18yo care worker the risk from Covid is minimal as well. 🤷‍♀️

@CovidCorvid can you link to these ‘numerous cases’ ? I don’t think you can post without linking your credible sources... And that’s not why there was a reluctance by medical professionals to not allow under 18s to have the vaccine. Please do your research before spouting nonsense. Most anti-vaxxers start their sentences with ‘don’t get me wrong I’m very pro-vaccine.

Bonuses or cash incentives or similar would have been my choice.

Really? You would give a cash incentive for something that over 80% of the population have gladly taken for free?

If I’m an anti vaxxer why have I had three shots? 🤷‍♀️

I tell everyone to have the vaccine. But I also respect people’s choices not to.

blog.ons.gov.uk/2021/10/04/how-many-people-have-died-as-a-result-of-a-covid-19-vaccine/

[quote Trixiefirecracker]@CovidCorvid can you link to these ‘numerous cases’ ? I don’t think you can post without linking your credible sources... And that’s not why there was a reluctance by medical professionals to not allow under 18s to have the vaccine. Please do your research before spouting nonsense. Most anti-vaxxers start their sentences with ‘don’t get me wrong I’m very pro-vaccine.[/quote]
At this time, JCVI is of the view that the health benefits of universal vaccination in children and young people below the age of 18 years do not outweigh the potential risks.

I don’t think I’m spouting nonsense at all. Just because you disagree with something dp doesn’t mean it’s nonsense. That quote above again is from a govt website. There was most definitely a reluctance from experts to agree to vaccines for under 18s due to it being felt the risks didn’t outweigh the benefits.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-vaccination-of-children-and-young-people-aged-12-to-17-years-jcvi-statement/jvci-statement-on-covid-19-vaccination-of-children-and-young-people-aged-12-to-17-years-15-july-2021

[quote Trixiefirecracker]@CovidCorvid can you link to these ‘numerous cases’ ? I don’t think you can post without linking your credible sources... And that’s not why there was a reluctance by medical professionals to not allow under 18s to have the vaccine. Please do your research before spouting nonsense. Most anti-vaxxers start their sentences with ‘don’t get me wrong I’m very pro-vaccine.[/quote]
As @CovidCorvid's link shows, It's 9 (deaths suspected to have been caused by the vaccine)

4 in England, 4 in Scotland and 1 in N. Ireland. Only the Scottish and N. Irish one thus far have been categorically classed as deaths caused by adverse reaction to the vaccine.

Those numbers may rise, and the English ones may be found to be vaccine related.

1645 deaths have been reported as happening after the vaccine but the ONS says (as of October) and are still in the Coroner's/PF's hands. The ONS also points out it's likely to be an exaggeration to suggest these deaths were all caused by the vaccine.

Obviously it's a jolly good job that the JCVI had to pass the decision making to the actual medical experts (CMOs) given especially that sociologist lecturer member Dingwall was re-tweeting anti-vax and Hart stuff!

There continues to be a lot of confusion about the power (and indeed scientific knowledge, of the JCVI) Fortunately, the Chief Medical Officers have the final say.

@CovidCorvid

And while I agree Covid has killed more... For a healthy 18yo care worker the risk from Covid is minimal as well. 🤷‍♀️

Yeah, the problem being it's not minimal to their clients.

At this time, JCVI is of the view that the health benefits of universal vaccination in children and young people below the age of 18 years do not outweigh the potential risks.

I don’t think I’m spouting nonsense at all. Just because you disagree with something dp doesn’t mean it’s nonsense. That quote above again is from a govt website. There was most definitely a reluctance from experts to agree to vaccines for under 18s due to it being felt the risks didn’t outweigh the benefits.

How is this relevant @CovidCorvid? You're trying to back up your point that carers shouldn't need to be vaccinated by saying the JCVI didn't originally recommend vaccination for

If you look at this another way

If the carers did not have the jabs, the death rate for the residents shot up and if it is CV19 related, there would howls of anger, and rightly so

There would be demand for all carers to be jabbed, which would be a tad late for the elderly residents who did not make it

Dammed if you do, dammed if you don’t