Mandatory vaccination

[amsadandconfused]

So I am not anti vac and have had my two doses and booster booked for next week. I do genuinely understand why a lot of my work colleagues are reluctant..Drs ,nurses ,carers etc . They are young people in their 20s/30s who are scared about the long term side effects ie infertility,blood disorders ..it’s very easy for people who are not in a job involving health care to be so critical of these lovely people .
Yes hepatitis B jab is mandatory for some but the hep jab has had many years of trials.
Can I ask everyone reading my post if you would be 100% happy if their 20 something children had this vaccine?

[quote MauraandLaura]@Kitkat151 I think the question should actually be -

'can you hand on heart you would give up your job for your belief over body autonomy?'

Because that's what it boils down to.The prospect of losing your job/home/career isn't a choice - its blackmail.[/quote]
Nah it’s a choice.... every time

@Tealightsandd

It's very concerning to think that there are people working with the most vulnerable who are refusing to get vaccinated.

Totally unsuited to the job.

Well past time to value such a vital role. Pay well, offer decent working conditions - and then employ safe caring carers.

My daughter is a nurse on a dementia ward and has not been vaccinated. The same ward she has worked on all through the pandemic. She is NOT a walking disease and should not be treated as such.

We are constantly told the vaccine protects against covid. If the narrative now tells us that those who have been vaccinated must be protected from the unvaccinated then this confirms the vaccines DON'T work.

When it comes to public health we’re all just a number. It’s not about personal choice or bodily autonomy really.

We need immunity at a population level to protect the CEV and to vastly lessen the impact of the disease for everyone else.

The vaccine isn’t perfect but it mitigates against the worst effects and reduces viral load in terms of transition.

There are so many of us vaccinated now that even if something awful happens to us all down the line, we all pretty fucked anyway.

There’s not much more to it than that.

That’s way too nuanced for some people though.

@Whyevencare will you DD be getting the vaccine? Or leaving her job in April?

[quote Kitkat151]@Whyevencare will you DD be getting the vaccine? Or leaving her job in April?[/quote]
We're in Scotland so it hasn't been announced here, yet. She's getting pressured at work though.

Ah ok....I’m a nurse.....there’s only one other I work with who is unvaccinated ( 36 with 2 kids).... she is leaving it until March then will get the jab last minute.....she hasn’t ( to my knowledge )has any pressure up to now....certainly not from management....obviously come April it will be different.

@VerveClique

When it comes to public health we’re all just a number. It’s not about personal choice or bodily autonomy really.

We need immunity at a population level to protect the CEV and to vastly lessen the impact of the disease for everyone else.

The vaccine isn’t perfect but it mitigates against the worst effects and reduces viral load in terms of transition.

There are so many of us vaccinated now that even if something awful happens to us all down the line, we all pretty fucked anyway.

There’s not much more to it than that.

That’s way too nuanced for some people though.

This.

Also as has been explained before, some of the more vulnerable aren't as well protected by vaccines as are the rest of us. They rely on other people around them to take all sensible decent precautions.

There was billions for the failed test and trace.

We are frequently told that we're a rich country - the 5th largest economy in the world.

We need to better fund valuable jobs.

Pay well and provide good working conditions - and employ the people most suited to the job. Suitability includes being happy to take the life and health saving vaccine.

@Arrowheart
My immune system has done me just fine for 47 years so will trust my instinct. Never had flu, chest infections,ear infections etc so must be doing alright.

I work in a very large hospital in my nearest city and we had an email sent out today to say that 18% of the staff (didn’t break it down into specific roles) are not vaccinated.

Is the hospital seriously going to sack 18% of its workforce? How on earth do the government think do a hospital is going to function with a fifth of its staff numbers being fired overnight?

The irony is that they’re happy for all these unvaccinated staff to work through the winter when things are going to be awful, but come Spring, when things are most likely going to improve again, they’re all going to be sacked because of the risk they apparently pose.

The whole thing is madness.

It’s blackmail and frightening that it’s being allowed to go ahead.

To be honest though, I don’t think the proposal will go ahead as between now and April the people in power are going to realise what a stupid idea it is.

@DontWantTheRivalry

I work in a very large hospital in my nearest city and we had an email sent out today to say that 18% of the staff (didn’t break it down into specific roles) are not vaccinated.

Is the hospital seriously going to sack 18% of its workforce? How on earth do the government think do a hospital is going to function with a fifth of its staff numbers being fired overnight?

The irony is that they’re happy for all these unvaccinated staff to work through the winter when things are going to be awful, but come Spring, when things are most likely going to improve again, they’re all going to be sacked because of the risk they apparently pose.

The whole thing is madness.

It’s blackmail and frightening that it’s being allowed to go ahead.

To be honest though, I don’t think the proposal will go ahead as between now and April the people in power are going to realise what a stupid idea it is.

It will go ahead and 17.99% of those people will be vaccinated before April....they have a choice ( even if it’s Hobsons] and most will choose to remain in a job with a good pension and benefits.

[quote user1471543683]@Arrowheart
My immune system has done me just fine for 47 years so will trust my instinct. Never had flu, chest infections,ear infections etc so must be doing alright. [/quote]
That’s almost word for word what an ex-colleague of mine said. He caught coronavirus, almost died, and has been left with major breathing problems and clear loss of cognitive function.

It's worked just fine with other countries around the world. We might as well lose the British exceptionalism just this once.

Which countries? The ones all over Europe with vaccine passports, mask mandates and rising cases?

Rising cases but

a) lower hospitalisations and deaths

and

b) taking action to tackle the rising cases.

Mitigation.

Vaccine mandates to protect our most vulnerable - care home residents, being one such mitigation.

@Platax
I know only one person who has died with Covid 19 on his death certificate. He was double vaccinated!

@FromEden

The most common reported side effect in vaers is disruption or changes to menstruation. They are only just beginning to investigate this now, it wasn't part of the studies. So I don't think anyone can say there no effects on fertility in some people.

This. I know plenty of Women who have had their periods affected after the vaccine.

Many women have had their periods affected by Covid infection.

Covid infection has also been associated with ED in men.

@bumbleymummy

Which countries? The ones all over Europe with vaccine passports, mask mandates and rising cases?

I think your confusing this with them being the ones who haven't started booster campaigns yet

Tea lights and

“Also as has been explained before, some of the more vulnerable aren't as well protected by vaccines as are the rest of us. They rely on other people around them to take all sensible decent precautions“

Absolutely this. To those saying we’ll if the unvaccinated are a risk to the vaccinated, it clearly doesn’t work: honestly, you know that’s just nonsense. For the huge majority, vaccinations work extremely well.

For the extremely old and frail or those vulnerable for other medical reasons, there’s no guarantee. For example, people in care homes or hospitals. That’s been known by anyone who’s cared to look into it since before the first public jab was administered.

Not exactly rocket science, is it? If you have no interest in protecting the frail elderly or otherwise vulnerable, work somewhere else.

Look now people spoke about mandatory vaccination in regards to those unvaccinated. Frightening that they were treated so poorly and were made to feel as though their choice someone had any effect on those who chose to get vaccinated. Seeing how we turned on one another in these days really shows how quickly mass psychosis can take over rational thinking and consideration for one another.

Posters get frustrated with those saying things about vaccination that are not true (e.g., they cause infertility, they cause cancer) @statementstate because is really harmful to population health.

There's more examples of this in your latest post - yes a person's decision to get vaccinated or not has impacts beyond their own health. This is how vaccines work, and it isn't nullified just because coronavirus vaccine efficacy is not 100%.

At the time mandates were being proposed in the UK, there was good evidence that vaccination both signficantly prevented infecion (and if you are not infected you cannot transmit), and that it reduced the liklihood of onward transmission in the case of breakthrough infections.

Increasing vaccination rate was critical on all sorts of outcomes, which is why various countries took measures to increase uptake. I disagre with mandates for the general population, and was pleased when a negative test alternative was suggested.

"Mass psychosis" is a term coined by various people who are making a career out of being an "anti-vaxxer" (see Malhotra for example, who is now charging $20,000 to appear at speaking events), and is pretty offensive to those genuinely suffering from psychosis or schizophrenia.

yes a person's decision to get vaccinated or not has impacts beyond their own health. This is how vaccines work, and it isn't nullified just because coronavirus vaccine efficacy is not 100%

How does whether someone gets vaccinated or not impact others?

I can only think of some argument about strain on the health service, yet the IFR is the same as the flu, it disproportionately impacts old people….so for people below 65, maybe 60, even that argument doesn’t hold

@Biochemist how so? How do the unvaccinated affect the vaccinated?

Mass psychosis is what we’re seeing when individuals refuse to acknowledge those injured by vaccines. Safe and effective vaccines cannot hurt anyone that is was in drummed into our heads. Therefore anyone for whom have been hurt, well, they must be imagining things, or it must be something else causing it.

An interesting post to see, more than a year on from the mass exodus of carers and NHS staff.