Vaccines to be compulsory for front line medical staff

[bumbleymummy]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-59215282

The covid vaccine, but not the flu vaccine. Although, I suppose the door has been opened for that one now too. They’re being given until spring. I wonder if there will be a massive walk out before winter. If you thought you were going to lose your job come spring, why would you work your ass off all winter? This could majorly backfire.

It will be fine everyone, stop worrying. The Gov will make an exemption for vaccinated EU health workers to come here, and make up the shortfall that way.

[quote Hmumoftw0]@bumbleymummy just like they brought in vaccine passports? Boris will scrap it in March, its just to push the few that will have it to save their career into doing so! [/quote]
I’ve been hoping they’d back track on care workers but they haven’t yet and they deadline is Thursday :(

I still can't see how this would work if people refuse though

Going through the disciplinary procedure then being sacked? How?

@Haffiana

It will be fine everyone, stop worrying. The Gov will make an exemption for vaccinated EU health workers to come here, and make up the shortfall that way.

Quite!

[quote Hmumoftw0]@RachC2021 but why? It doesn't stop them giving you covid, if anything it masks their symptoms and helps the spread, especially in children 12+ my niece is vaccinated she's 14 she still brought it home to her nan, who is also vaccinated and she was very unwell but my niece had 0 symptoms more than likely because she had the vaccine. [/quote]
It helps to reduce the spread. I know it’s not a guarantee. But if someone working on a chemo unit isn’t willing to help reduce the spread of Covid-19, what else aren’t they taking seriously?

Regular testing also reduces spread. Why would you object to that as an alternative?

@xxxGirlCrushxxx

I still can't see how this would work if people refuse though

Going through the disciplinary procedure then being sacked? How?

In social care, because it's law as of Thursday, the providers aren't allowed to employ someone that is deployed in a care home with elderly/vulnerable people without a covid vaccination, in the same way they're not allowed to employ someone without a DBS certificate. They stand to face the concequences of breaking that law if they do. While I'm not sure what exactly they are, they will be seen as not meeting the national standards and therefore failing in their duty of care.

"Going through the disciplinary procedure then being sacked? How?"

Same as a disciplinary for anything else. Are there any employment lawyers on this thread who could clarify. Would you be regarded as having resigned if you don't comply by the date? Or would this be regarded as gross misconduct and treated accordingly. I can't think of any other way your employment could be terminated otherwise (without a long delay of 1st/2nd/3rd warnings etc)

It's only the care home owners that lose out anyway because they can't make as much money if they haven't got the workers, carers will get other jobs

If you're cheering this, remember it is likely to extend to more and more workplace settings and cover boosters too. There could be, down the line, a booster that you want to sit out for some reason or other. Are you happy to lose your job to make your own decision about it?

@Coldpressed

If you're cheering this, remember it is likely to extend to more and more workplace settings and cover boosters too. There could be, down the line, a booster that you want to sit out for some reason or other. Are you happy to lose your job to make your own decision about it?

If my job involves dealing with vulnerable people, yes. Currently it doesn't. But I am taking on a job soon where I will be training elderly people, and I will be boosted up the wazoo for that one.

I probably won't get the booster, I haven't decided yet but don't work anyway

Fair enough MareofBeasttown.

What if your job didn't involve working closely with people at all, or even if you worked outdoors? Italy and Victoria in Australia are setting a precedent for universal employment mandates for all sectors

I don't agree with mandatory vaccinations, I think we should work with people to understand why they don't want a vaccine and try to help them overcome the issues if they've been misinformed etc.

BUT I do think 90% of those saying they'll quit wont. What will they do? They can't work in care homes, they can't work in asthetics etc as someone suggested because those people will need to be vaccinated too! And yes NHS pay isn't amazing, but the pension, mat leave etc is.

I think expecting that the vaccine will be extended to outdoor workers seems a bit of an overreach in the UK, given we can't even agree that the NHS should get it. I don't think this is the thin end of the wedge; I think it is necessary.

@Backasecondtime

It's only the care home owners that lose out anyway because they can't make as much money if they haven't got the workers, carers will get other jobs

It really isn't. Current providers just run shifts short staffed and the fully vaccinated and therefore staff left get to do more work and the service users get worse care, while getting paid and paying the same respectively. In places where they have to drop beds because of lack of staffing then people aren't getting the care full stop because they can't get in. It's system wide and has been teetering on a knife edge for years staffing wise, this is pushing it over the edge. Same applies to the NHS.

@MareofBeasttown

I think expecting that the vaccine will be extended to outdoor workers seems a bit of an overreach in the UK, given we can't even agree that the NHS should get it. I don't think this is the thin end of the wedge; I think it is necessary.

I hope you're right about that but I bet the people of Victoria didn't expect it to be mandated for outdoor workers either. We all seem to be headed in the same direction at different speeds.

@Coldpressed

If you're cheering this, remember it is likely to extend to more and more workplace settings and cover boosters too. There could be, down the line, a booster that you want to sit out for some reason or other. Are you happy to lose your job to make your own decision about it?

Absolutely happy with it. No problem at all.

@Backasecondtime

It's only the care home owners that lose out anyway because they can't make as much money if they haven't got the workers, carers will get other jobs

I think the elderly will lose out when there's no care homes to go to. Spaces are in short supply already. You might end up looking after your elderly relatives 24/7 doing personal care.

Perhaps the UK MPs might all set an example with vaccination, mask wearing and living on a nurse's salary without external consultancies nor channeling public funds through second homes and employing family...

@Topseyt

What about if you had a worrying/lingering reaction to one of the boosters and weren't willing to have any more but couldn't secure an exemption?

I haven't got any elderly relatives to worry about looking after, thank goodness but others will probably have to look after their relatives if there aveeno places,

Loads of jobs around at the bottom now so they won't be queuing to take over the care home jobs and the folk leaving will no doubt get better-paid jobs with less hassle. So that will mean vulnerable old folk left unattended uncleaned for hours on end and for exactly what ultimately? The power of the jab is in the recipient preventing hospitalisation and death not in stopping transmission. That much is clear now and what a slap in the face for workers who were in the front line of a novel virus whilst others cowered in their homes and panic buyed and washed their shopping.

No, all my relatives are dead so I don't have that problem. But a lot of people will have that problem. Or even worse what about the elderly with no relatives to look after them?

Indeed Zahawi made a telling comment about how the state should be limited in what it can and should do. The Asian culture of the family looking after their parents at home may be the model we are moving towards - either by accident or design.