Is it just me or is this board getting a bit quieter?

[bumbleymummy]

That’s a good sign, right? :)

I should say though that I only really see that attitude on MN

But ‘I’m bored of it now’ posts are a response to the question asked in the OP!

@TheGrumpyGoat

And it can be quite othering sometimes, of the people being positioned as different and better by posters using them to make arguments

As someone who is technically a non Brit but lives here, it’s really weird seeing people going on about how British are the absolute worst, more selfish, more moany than anyone else. It makes them seem really self absorbed and arrogant in a way. Like they can’t just be mediocre like everyone else, they have to be the absolute worst. It’s really interesting to see.

Like the other people being talked about are a prop. Of course they're better than us because they must be, the Other is so much more selfless than us, no need to actually speak to them about it or see any shades of grey. I am British but of immigrant background and it's disconcerting.

@TheKeatingFive

I mean… how do you know they’re not moaning?

Exactly

But I think a lot of posters find it more comforting if they can attribute the fallout to human error in the U.K.

'If only' the government weren't so incompetent. 'If only' the Brits weren't so selfish. Rather than just acknowledge that sometimes nature causes us devastation that we struggle to deal with.

That line of thinking only works if we can position others as having reacted in a 'superior' fashion.

Now I'm not saying the U.K. government didn't make enormous errors (though it also got some things right, which is often underplayed). But this idea that the people in the U.K. are somehow uniquely selfish, stupid, uncaring, etc, is obviously bollocks.

We have had an actual inquiry (from the Health and Social Care Committee and the Science and Technology Committee, and MPs from all parties) that says the UK's early response was the worst public health failure ever.

Do you think that the people writing this report " found it more comforting [to] attribute the fallout to human error in the U.K."?

I really don't think it is just people moaning, and the government really did get a lot of things very wrong.

Also, quite a lot of corruption, cronyism etc.

Kate Bingham was good though yes, and the early vaccine roll out from the NHS went well.

@ExceptionalAssurance yes, when I see people say things like ‘the Spanish don’t moan, the Spanish just get on with things, the Spanish are x, y and z’ I just think wtf? Have you actually spoken to any of us? Got our views on it? Read our press?

By the way, there are lots of investigations into the Spanish handling of the pandemic too. The government were also guilty of releasing the elderly untested into care homes. The lockdown has been ruled by the courts as being unlawful. Other court cases are still ongoing.

the government really did get a lot of things very wrong.

I'm not actually disagreeing with that. However, there's a tendency to present the U.K. government as much, much worse than anywhere else (not true), downplaying anything positive they achieved and presenting U.K. population as somehow lacking compared to the rest of the world.

I agree and have an issue with the constant negativity re U.K., but in particular re people here.

The selfish / ‘exceptionalism’ stance some take.

That’s what I see at the true ‘British exceptionalism’… the fact that loads of you seem to think you’re the absolute worst in the world. Truth is, you’re generally just mediocre like the rest of us! Some things are done well, some not.

Yep! A reverse case maybe where everything is the worst

We get it from some o/s too though which compounds ig

I don't think anyone here said that we are "the worst in the world"?

I mean, worst at what?

The Inquiry apparently said the early pandemic response was the worst public health failure ever (according to the BBC, I haven't read the report) but presumably that pertains to previous UK public health management?

I think mediocre would be a charitable way to describe the current government to be honest.

It’s an all prevailing attitude on here @herecomesthsun. Not just relating to Covid, but has certainly got worse since.
The public health response in Spain has also been considered an abject failure, particularly regarding care homes. The lockdown in which children couldn’t leave their homes has been ruled unlawful.
Yes, the British government is dire. So are many others.

The Inquiry apparently said the early pandemic response was the worst public health failure ever (according to the BBC, I haven't read the report) but presumably that pertains to previous UK public health management?

I expect that would be true of a huge number of countries though. Covid was an enormous challenge that we weren't properly prepared for. That's true of most nations really.

I'm inclined to agree with the posts upthread that suggested the biggest failures are historical. Letting the health service get to the state it was in. Failing to prepare for an event like this.

You should probably read the report though @herecomesthsun, it’s quite interesting. The Spanish one is too.

The amount of cases in my DS class it would seem we are doing nothing about Covid in the UK too. Apart from the 10'days isolating with test and trace phoning you constantly to check on you. I mean as if you going to tell them you're going out or even answer when your in a nightclub.

@TheGrumpyGoat

You should probably read the report though *@herecomesthsun*, it’s quite interesting. The Spanish one is too.

Is there an English language version of the Spanish report? My Spanish is pretty much at the asking for directions and reading menus level so I doubt I'd manage!

Is there an English language version of the Spanish report? My Spanish is pretty much at the asking for directions and reading menus level so I doubt I'd manage!

I’ll have a look!

lol I have been learning Spanish on Duo Lingo but would also need a translation!

Thanks thegrumpygoat!

I’d be interested to see how much Cummings stuff got into report.

He kept going on about ‘group think’ in his interview which I see has resurfaced

twitter.com/macharightnow/status/1448223215378120715?s=20

Public health failed and the population at large have suffered for it. This report just ensures that lockdown will be the default rather than decent healthcare.

Excellent manipulation and opportunism from Hunt and Cummings.

@RedToothBrush

This still needs to play out over time.

We don't know what the long term effect of wearing masks has for immunity for other things.

We can't compare with other countries, because our health service has other pressures and our economy has other pressures - because we've fucked up things that others haven't.

We have higher levels of inequality than anywhere else in Europe. And higher levels of poor health as a result of obesity. And all the other health related issues associated with that. We have less doctors and nurses per head than other places.

We've had more and longer lockdowns than most places in Europe.

It basically means our capacity to cope with covid is significantly less than other places.

In terms of behaviour compliance has dropped (often out of necessity through poverty). We have incoming financial bombs dropping all over the place.

Elsewhere in Europe was never going to have the problems the UK had, because our underlying conditions mean that a lot of people couldn't stay home and have a massive distrust of our government.

We were always going to be more fucked because we are fat and poor and didn't have enough slack in the system.

shrug

Our response to covid isn't the problem. Its all the bits that go before responding to things thats the issue.

For example: Whats the difference between a country with class sizes of 20 who aren't rich, but also aren't dreadfully poor and a country with class sizes of 30 so of whom are really well off and others who only get fed cos a footballer campaigned for them to get lunch?

Think about it.

I firmly do not think the problem at this stage lies with mitigation issues, but institutionalised level to do with how our society as a whole functions.

No amount of mask wearing or covid passports is going to provide an adequate solution to compare with how other European countries are performing in terms of cases and deaths at this point.

The UK went into the pandemic like an elderly limping overweight pirate. Not a fit, healthly well fed and trained new recruit to the officer ranks of the army.

What we see now, is merely the legacy of how we fucked ourselves up the arse over the last 30 - 40 years.

Best post on this thread 👏🏻 👑

unherd.com/thepost/the-question-the-covid-report-failed-to-answer/