Is it just me or is this board getting a bit quieter?

[bumbleymummy]

That’s a good sign, right? :)

The responses from some on here are exactly why the reports today describe our approach as one of the worst public health failures. It won't change at this point.

The responses show that people will twist and use anything to put down people in U.K.

It will never change.

@MarshaBradyo

People use them as an argument to say see majority want it

At same time as calling everyone selfish / exceptionalists

It’s all bollocks just to keep having a go at people

You're putting words into my mouth. I haven't called anyone selfish.

Plenty on your side having a very big go at people.

Ironically, I'm one of the only fuckers still wearing a mask religiously. DS wears a mask indoors in public places when not in school.

I wish people would wear them more often.

However I don't think this is the problem. And realistically, you have a population of unvaccinated children mixing (particularly primary age), whom covid has to pass through or you have to close the schools when it comes to Delta.

(And you will never get away from the poverty and government trust issues.)

Closing the schools seems the less popular idea...

I'm so done with the batshitness of it all and doing my own thing and just getting on with things as best I can.

And realistically, I don't know that there is a lot more than can be done at this point. Not without greater harm.

Its also a realisation that the R is hovering at or around 1.

Then precautions need to be taken! In a dynamical system fluctuating around a critical threshold, all you need is one miniscule change for things to blow up.

I have to say I'm rather surprised that someone who spends a sizeable amount of time on the Covid board didn't know about this.

I've never made out that I'm some kind of global covid measures expert. Sorry to disappoint.

And of course you haven't been around in the last little while to educate us all!

@MarshaBradyo

The responses show that people will twist and use anything to put down people in U.K.

It will never change.

Commenting on government policy isn't a statement on the general public.

'Put people down' is an interesting choice of words, when discussing a 'let the bodies rip' policy. Saving lives and heath is the very opposite of putting people down.

@herecomesthsun

So I looked it up [smile}

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthandwellbeing/bulletins/coronavirusandthesocialimpactsongreatbritain/8october2021

1.Main points
Throughout the period of 22 September to 3 October 2021, based on adults in Great Britain:

Most adults (85%) felt that wearing a face covering was either very important or important as a measure to slow the spread of coronavirus (COVID-19); at the same time 86% of adults reported they wore a face covering when outside their home in the past seven days

Most adults (85%) felt that socially distancing from others not in their household was either very important or important

Just over half of adults (55%) reported that they avoided physical contact with others outside their home in the past seven day

There are reductions of a few per cent here and there though

And yet,..

Look at this

@TheKeatingFive

Are medical grade masks mandatory in Germany? In what circs?

I believe someone who lives there posted that they are.

I think there is a realisation that at this point (not previously when people were unvaccinated) that the consequences of restrictions are as harmful, if not more harmful than covid itself.

Yes, also I think more people have just forgotten about much of it, tbh. Personally I was against lockdown after lockdown because I knew the cure was going to be worse than the disease and the hysteria in the media was clear from day one. There's much more important things we need to be focusing on now like improving kids mental health instead of Covid case numbers.

There's much more important things we need to be focusing on now like improving kids mental health instead of Covid case numbers.

That would require resolving the public health housing and homelessness emergency. Insecure housing is a major cause of mental poor health on both adults and children. It would be great if the emergency was dealt with. Boost the economy - get social housing built. Construction jobs, plus reduced homelessness and housing benefit bill.

I'll end tonight on a positive note.

We have the booster programme, and the NHS has bought monoclonal antibodies - to be used on those who don't mount a good immune response to the vaccines and the especially vulnerable. No treatment is a miracle but they have had very promising results.

There's also - for the future - the new antiviral developed by Merck.

Night all.

@NandJ

Its also a realisation that the R is hovering at or around 1.

Then precautions need to be taken! In a dynamical system fluctuating around a critical threshold, all you need is one miniscule change for things to blow up.

You know WHY they aren't?

Because all the modellers are seeing there is a ceiling to cases possible due to vaccination/natural immunity/boosters and everything happening currently is staying below that level. So things are under control. Thats kind of the point.

We know there is waning and thats also being factored in.

There basically is a situation where we are not nor are likely to see exponential growth again. Thats why there is no need to reintroduce stricter restrictions in any wide spread manner.

There are localised problems - particularly within schools atm. There is a significant issue with this where I am this week. There are more cases per 100,000 here than there have ever been throughout the pandemic. I also know this is almost all connected with large outbreaks at schools. The vast majority of cases are in children and their immediate households.

Realistically, the only option at that point is to close the schools concerned for a couple of weeks. Thats just not going to happen.

In the meantime, kids are going to school with classmates who have siblings who are currently covid positive - meaning its only a matter of time before they also get Delta (cos of the statistics on household transmission rates) and spread it to their class mates.

And everyone is going 'bring back masks' and 'look at Europe' for some bonkers reason rather than looking at the pattern of spread and location of clusters in the UK.

If people were arguing with understanding how this is Oct 2021 not Oct 2020 and deliberately not referencing how things are different a year on, I might be interested in what they have to say.

But they aren't. So its a frikkin' pointless conversation.

Good night.

@Tealightsandd

There's much more important things we need to be focusing on now like improving kids mental health instead of Covid case numbers.

That would require resolving the public health housing and homelessness emergency. Insecure housing is a major cause of mental poor health on both adults and children. It would be great if the emergency was dealt with. Boost the economy - get social housing built. Construction jobs, plus reduced homelessness and housing benefit bill.

OH LOOK THE COVID SQUIRREL.

The covid squirrel is useful. It stops you looking at the chronic problems the UK has. Easy to just focus on covid and forget the underlying issues that made it harder to the uk to begin with and how that always meant we'd be more fucked than other places in Western Europe.

I don't think exponential growth will happen either.

However, slow growth with infection of previously shielding / very elderly people + flu/ RSV could also result in a lot of deaths + NHS problems.

Let's hope that doesn't happen.

Usefully, a lot of the mitigations for covid also would likely prevent flu/ RSV.

Driven out? The board has become quiet because the covid minimisers are now the majority.

This. Why are you all here, blathering on about it being all over, if it's all over?

No one has said it’s over.

No matter how many times people say this.

But we move to a different stage. It’s not that hard to get.

Oh, would you seriously like me to pluck out every minimising statement on this thread alone?! Here's one I found in less than ten seconds:

Covid seems to have largely downgraded to nearer being a bad cold.

Do what you want it’s your time to waste.

It means bog all though. There’s more than enough extreme statements on both ends to keep you busy.

@MarshaBradyo

No one has said it’s over.

No matter how many times people say this.

But we move to a different stage. It’s not that hard to get.

Exactly. It's far from over but it seems that fewer people on MN want to pick over it relentlessly day after day like it was a month or two ago.

My time to waste! I would say it is your time to waste, given the plethora of posts from you on this board. Keep shifting the goalposts, though, it is excellent exercise.

@herecomesthsun

I don't think exponential growth will happen either.

However, slow growth with infection of previously shielding / very elderly people + flu/ RSV could also result in a lot of deaths + NHS problems.

Let's hope that doesn't happen.

Usefully, a lot of the mitigations for covid also would likely prevent flu/ RSV.

So what are you going to do?

Ultimately the current issue relates to a pool of unvaccinated people in a crowded area with farcical policies over isolation when Delta's household transmission in the unvaccinated is all but certain.

Until there is enough immunity in this population you are going to have this problem.

You either put in restrictions in this area - which doesn't solve the issue of a large unvaccinated population being vulnerable to getting covid and it spreading like wildfire when you do eventually remove these mitigations. Or you vaccinate. And 1) certainly for under 12s there isn't a clinical argument for this and there isn't an under 12s vaccination programme in Europe that I'm aware of. 2) uptake of vaccinations in 12 - 16year olds and young adults really isn't great as it is and I can see it being even lower for under 12s 3)Trying to make vaccinations for under 12s mandatory would lead to other social issues and conflicts which aren't necessarily in children's interests (eg removal from school permanently)

Whatever. As I say if you want to sift through bolding go for it I’m not interested. Up to you

It's coming on two years now of living with covid. After two years it's not the first though when you wake up or the last though when you go to bed.

Two years is a long time to be terrified. I am honestly gob smacked that people are saying life has completely gone back to normal pre covid. It hasnt for me by a long shot. First time inside two schools since pre covid this week. I see people in masks every day. There are places I can not access without a mask every week. I cannot easily access my gp and have gone back in the gp surgery in the last month and only as they suspected something fatal.

Everything about covid is part of my daily life. I dont think about it as it's become as routine as drinking tea. I hardly notice it but like hell is it back to normal. Normal has gone.

Maybe it will resurge or maybe it wont but as I said a few months ago, I can not unsee my son having confirmed covid while we was all free to go about normal life and dh demanded back at work. I just can not feel terrified by a virus we undoubtedly had on our clothe etc that we was encouraged or forced to mix with. I can not go back from seeing that. It was deadly then. Its deadly today. So will be no different if we possibly peak in winter. It's the same virus whatever the rules are. But it was fine in September so whatever comes next are just words to me. Rule change. The science of the virus does not so I'm going to struggle to get scared again.

Then why shouldn't we follow Germany and make medical grade masks mandatory

Then they had better be free. I notice there are a few of my fellow lefties who arent too bothered about poorer ppl having yet another thing they would have to pay for when they come up with these bright ideas.

YY @TheKeatingFive Like Weight Watchers did (WW)