All 12-15s to be offered single dose of Pfizer, CMOs decide

[bagofconkers]

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-coronavirus-vaccines-to-be-offered-to-children-aged-12-to-15-chief-medical-officers-decide-12402855

@HarebrightCedarmoon

The JCVI were not saying the vaccination was unsafe.

No but they said that it wasn’t recommended on health grounds for children .

I just don’t understand why.

The health benefits are marginal at best.

It won’t stop them getting Covid or transmitting it. It ‘might’ reduce it but the evidence is unproven on that so far, even amongst adults.

They’re not at risk of hospitalisation or death from covid.

The rest of the community are vaccinated.

The removal of the bubble system means the impact on of covid on their education has been hugely reduced.

Does one dose even do anything?!

@HarebrightCedarmoon and they equally didn’t say it was ‘safe’. From a medical perspective there isn’t enough info on risks and given how low risk this age group is, it’s pretty clear that (medically) the risks outweigh the benefits.

My kids are not getting this vaccine. (And yes, they have every other childhood recommended vaccine).

@Comedycook

I thought the JCVI weren't recommending the vaccine for majority of children or have I missed something? I absolutely won't be allowing my children to have it.

The JCVI is a think tank that is made up of scientists, economists etc (the discredited member kicked off a few weeks ago wasn't a scientist and held very strange ideas about Covid) Now, as ever, their recommendations have been handed over to expert, all scientists for the final decision.

I feel so uneasy about this. What if they have already had Covid which has been proven to protect better than the vaccine. Both mine have had Covid with absolutely no problems at all except a slight headache for a day.I am not rushing into this and I’ll be waiting till at least next summer when we have more data. To be able to travel is important to our family which would be the only reason we would consider but if they only get one that wouldn’t be enough for most countries making me even more reluctant.

Dd won’t be encouraged to have it, it’s too new and it’s m not deciding what does and does not go into her body.
She’s 11 but turns 12 soon
If she wants one it’s her choice but I’ll be sure to let her know all the risks.

@Geamhradh no one is an ‘expert’ in this domain. The vaccine is so new. Data is still being compiled. So little is known. What’s happening is guesswork, and a wing and a prayer.
But if you’re happy based on these so called ‘experts’ getting the younger generations injected with something with zero data on longer term implications? Go for it.

it’s pretty clear that (medically) the risks outweigh the benefits.

That’s the opposite of what the JCVI said. They said that the health benefits of the vaccine outweigh the risks by a small margin but not enough to recommend on just those grounds and that they weren’t qualified to comment on other benefits such as reduced disruption to education. They told the govt to consult with the CMOs on those additional benefits.

So they did and the CMOs have recommended rollout based on a bigger picture than the JCVI considered.

It's a start. Good news.

My 12 year old is taller than many adults and a healthy weight for her height. I don't feel there is any more risk for her with this vaccine than there was for anyone else in the family. Perhaps if she was a tiny little thing I'd feel otherwise.

I'm far more worried about her education being disrupted when lots of teachers and children become ill with covid, and the ongoing mental health effects on her of this pandemic, than the risks posed by this vaccine.

@Comedycook

I thought the JCVI weren't recommending the vaccine for majority of children or have I missed something? I absolutely won't be allowing my children to have it.

They're not. The CMOs are basing it on other factors eg economy; disruption to education. They think DC's MH is more impacted by being at home. Personally our DC's MH has been more adversely affected by being in a school with sky high Covid figures. I'm not sure taking a vaccine that does not stop them catching Covid or spreading it and potentially creates other health risks will help their MH either. I'm not an anti-vaxxer. All our vaccines are up-to-date but let's not pretend this is about health when there is quite clearly a distinction between the medical advice (not to vaccinate children) and the recent decision.

Our boy won't be getting it. We don't want him to have it and he doesn't want it anyway. Good news for parents who do want their child to have it.

I'm surprised at the govt going against JCVI advice, I do wonder if any child does have adverse effects will it be hushed up?

This is a really well laid out infographic from the bbc to understand the risks and benefits

@beckypv

This is a really well laid out infographic from the bbc to understand the risks and benefits

This is good to get understanding for one dose

I can understand why some are saying they won’t, but I’m glad the choice is there for those who want to. I feel undecided but have a few months anyway before 12

They aren’t going against JCVI advice. JCVI just look at one part of the picture and their view was from a medical POV there are slight benefits but not enough to recommend it on that alone When looked at with other data such as impact of covid on education/mental well-being etc the overall decision is that it’s right for it to be offered to 12-16 year olds.

I’m really pleased to hear this. Covid doesn’t just affect kids with underlying conditions. I have a completely healthy son, no underlying conditions who went through covid, Mis-c and complications for a year. Yes that’s rare, but it shows that you can’t just assume your kids will brush it off and be fine because they’re “healthy”.

Also, the risk of myocarditis is higher after covid than after after the vaccine (something a lot of people seem to have misunderstood). The cases of myocarditis after the vaccine seem to be mild, and clear up in a week or so. My son’s heart issues after covid are still there, over a year after he caught it. Easy choice in my view!

Having said that, if people don’t want to get their kids vaccinated (and their kids are happy with that) that’s fine, but I hope they make that choice fully informed - not after having read whatever nonsense on mumsnet or Facebook. Talk to your Gp if you’re worried. Look at peer reviewed papers, not videos on YouTube.

They're saying the vaccine will be rolled out through the already established schools vaccination programme, but my DD has already said she wants me with her if she has it (we and she are still on the fence) because she's terrified of needles. I wonder if we'll be able to apply for one at a local centre like we did for ourselves as adults, rather than her have it done at school?

@HairyFloppins

Good news but most countries don't consider children fully vaccinated with only one dose.

This is a medical / educational decision. I think its wise and prudent option given the risk/benefit to this age group.

International travel falls into political issues and that needs diplomats / ministers not scientists to sort out.

Write to Dominic Raab.
(Cos he does seem to know a lot about holidays rather than doing his actual job).

But yeah, its only solving half the ongoing issue for 12 - 15 year olds.

Interesting. Just watching the press conference now I was all up for them to get the vaccine but husband was against it. Neither of my teens want it as they feel it is too new. So from what I can grasp medically the risks don't really outweigh the benefits enough but if you put the mental health of children and school disruptions it is advised. So it is really health benefits vs social and education benefits.

The removal of the bubble system means the impact on of covid on their education has been hugely reduced.

This is why I'm feeling really conflicted about it now. Going back this term has shown that schools can operate as normal and cases aren't spiralling in the wider community despite concerns, at least in England. It feels like locking the stable after the horse has bolted. It really feels like jabbing our kids now is for a social benefit, not a health one.

@trumpisagit
while exposing children to harms, known and unknown.

The problem is, we don’t know the long term harms of covid either.

Here’s Fauci’s take on that:
He also said follow-up exams have revealed many young patients who have recovered from the coronavirus have developed heart conditions.

They “have a substantially high proportion of cardiovascular abnormalities, evidence of myocarditis by MRI and PET scans, evidence of emerging cardiomyopathies," Fauci said.
www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/health/2020/08/18/fauci-warns-of--troublesome--long-term-effects-of-covid-19-in-young-people

And more complications here:
Over the past year and a half, investigators around the world have documented a wide range of symptoms in the blood, heart, kidney, gut, brain, and many other parts of the body. Some studies suggest that nearly a third of all COVID patients experience such symptoms—and this proportion rises to more than two-thirds of those who are critically ill
www.the-scientist.com/features/sars-cov-2-s-wide-ranging-effects-on-the-body-69109

As a family we have decided against vaccinating eldest dc (younger aren't eligible anyway). We're happy with our collective decision.
I'm glad that others are able to decide to go ahead with the vaccine in their dc If they want too. Every family will do what they feel is best for them and I hope people can be Respectful of each others decisions.

I just filled out a consent form for the flu vaccine in school, and it said 'if you decline consent for the vaccine, your child will not be given it'.

I suspect Javid is talking out of his arse on that point.

I would absolutely agree to have it if I thought it would prevent further disruption to their education. And that is what they are giving as one of the reasons to recommend it but they’re not explaining HOW. It was the bubbles and household isolation that was causing the disruption (lockdowns aside) and they’re no longer a requirement.