Is it selfish to travel abroad at the moment?

[RockingMyFiftiesNot]

I expect the responses will be very mixed with responses from 'yes selfish' to 'no, go', and some in between - but I am torn so will consider all perspectives.

DH and I pondering seeking some winter sun in a country that's currently on the amber list. Mentioned to some friends who were horrified and said it was extremely selfish to travel abroad, and 'just because you can doesn't mean you should'.

We will fly, stay in hotels and use restaurants, outside seating where possible. We will hire a car, and go sightseeing / walking outside as much as possible.

We've looked into the risks (obviously concerned about our own safety as well as being potential carriers to/from holiday country.)

Risks areas I see are:

• airports - but taking precautions such as masks, distancing, hand washing/sanitising after touching things, don't see the risk as being any greater than a supermarket
• the flight - this is what is worrying me most but I understand the filtration systems to be effective, along with mask wearing, which should reduce the risk. Tho I am sure if you are sat near someone who is positive, you are quite vulnerable
• bars and restaurants - will be outside as much as possible which is lower risk than being inside in the uk
• everyone on the outbound flight will either be double jabbed or have taken a test before departure. Appreciate that isn't going to mean that everyone on the plane is negative but risk is reduced.
• everyone on the return flight will have been tested 3 days before the flight. Same comment as above.

We have said we will isolate at home fully until we've done the test after we return, and even if negative will avoid mixing for a further week or so and do our own tests regularly.

Appreciate we may need to isolate at our own cost on return if the country turns red while we are out there and cover other costs not included in insurance. If it looked like the country we decide on is heading in that direction before we leave, we'd cut our losses and not go.

I'm leaning towards 'we have to learn to live with it', but equally don't to be irresponsible / selfish.

Any points I haven't thought of to help weigh it up?

Bloody hell there are risk areas going to Tesco - should we all just stay at home.

We just returned from Greece- had a fabulous time. Ate outside for every single meal, did sit near anyone during the day (our hotel room had a private pool). We wore masks at the airport and on the plane. Trying hard to think how it could have been safer. We obviously also tested negative on all the tests we had to do to come home.

@moohoop

Not selfish but it does seem nuts just for a bit of sun. High risk of increased costs and what if you test positive while there and get stuck there?

Nice hotel in UK?

See if I thought the risk was high, I wouldn't be going. I agree there is some risk of course. Although yes having to quarantine on either side would be a pain, but low enough risk for us to take it.

As previously said, we've had several UK a breaks this year. Lucky I know but this is what we've worked for for decades and time is ticking.

@NellWilsonsWhiteHair

I think flying for any non-essential purposes is becoming increasingly difficult to defend from an environmental perspective... I see less of a problem with international travel during the pandemic, assuming compliance with testing, isolating where necessary, etc.

Way too many people think like this. Air travel is actually a tiny slice of overall emissions.

Not selfish at all.

We went to spain And everyone loved if!!

I wish I could but due to my work cannot chance isolating if I catch covid, too busy for time off.

I would if I could though, enjoy

No it's not "selfish" 🤨 what is selfish is those who bleat on about it being selfish, whilst they themselves have years of exciting travel experiences behind them.

I've been away twice this summer and will this week be booking my October break.

@MyLeftFootVMyRightFoot

I wish I could but due to my work cannot chance isolating if I catch covid, too busy for time off.

I would if I could though, enjoy

I take it you don't go anywhere then? Covid can be picked up near home too.

@IsabellesMissingSock

It's getting stuck abroad that's the problem dearie. Covid at home means I can work still albeit from home.

There's always one who thinks that are being clever 🙄 🤣

I should have said chance catching covid abroad for the over picky brigade 🤣🤣

@IsabellesMissingSock

No it's not "selfish" 🤨 what is selfish is those who bleat on about it being selfish, whilst they themselves have years of exciting travel experiences behind them.

I've been away twice this summer and will this week be booking my October break.

Yep

no. You are far less likely to catch covid abroad than you would be in certain parts of the UK at the moment.

However YWBU to complain if you do get covid when abroad and then become stuck for a week or more. Or get covid immediately before you go and then not be able to go after all. I think this is a chance you have to take and if you're comfortable with it (I'm not) then go for it.

@MyLeftFootVMyRightFoot

I wish I could but due to my work cannot chance isolating if I catch covid, too busy for time off.

I would if I could though, enjoy

I think we're all going to get it sooner or later tbh. As things stand more likely to get it on holiday in the UK than abroad.

[quote MyLeftFootVMyRightFoot]@IsabellesMissingSock

It's getting stuck abroad that's the problem dearie. Covid at home means I can work still albeit from home.

There's always one who thinks that are being clever 🙄 🤣[/quote]
You mentioned isolating, so I thought you meant isolating. If you meant quarantine abroad, perhaps you should have said so. Dearie 🤣

@IsabellesMissingSock

I bear in mind to include all details to ensure you fully understand next time dearie😉🤣

@Frazzled2207

no. You are far less likely to catch covid abroad than you would be in certain parts of the UK at the moment.

However YWBU to complain if you do get covid when abroad and then become stuck for a week or more. Or get covid immediately before you go and then not be able to go after all. I think this is a chance you have to take and if you're comfortable with it (I'm not) then go for it.

This us my problem. I would love to return to my holidays abroad but don't want to get stuck abroad

However YWBU to complain if you do get covid when abroad and then become stuck for a week or more. Or get covid immediately before you go and then not be able to go after all. I think this is a chance you have to take and if you're comfortable with it (I'm not) then go for it.

Yes appreciate this is the risk we take. Insurance covers not being able to go because of COVID. Being stuck there with it is a worry but feel the chances of that happening are relatively low.

Currently sitting by the Aegean.
Couldn’t be less sorry.

I’ll post a picture later

BTW you don’t have to test before going to Greece - just show proof of vaccination.
The test to come back is an LFT.

Yeah. It’s awful here.

[quote MyLeftFootVMyRightFoot]@IsabellesMissingSock

I bear in mind to include all details to ensure you fully understand next time dearie😉🤣[/quote]
Thank you that would be much appreciated 😃😉

@RockingMyFiftiesNot

However YWBU to complain if you do get covid when abroad and then become stuck for a week or more. Or get covid immediately before you go and then not be able to go after all. I think this is a chance you have to take and if you're comfortable with it (I'm not) then go for it.

Yes appreciate this is the risk we take. Insurance covers not being able to go because of COVID. Being stuck there with it is a worry but feel the chances of that happening are relatively low.

Yes insurance which covers not being able to go due to covid is a must. Being stuck there is unlikely. But you never know, hence I have taken my work laptop with me on both my holidays this year, which is not something I ever thought I would do 🙈

Mutations occur everywhere, of course. Their occurence is a direct proportion of the virus population size and the time a virus stay within a host.

Keeping movement short, keep the spread of different strains contained, and allows the detection of a new dangerous variant with good containment time.

Why is the government letting trips occur? because they are worried about politics and economy. They are looking at their bottom line, in a very selfish way (as all politicians do by the way).

Why are they letting children in households with positive PCR tests go to school ? Certainly not because it is safe. They know the cases will spike and are still doing so...

I would say that it is a little selfish, but also a little irresponsible, the cost if things go wrong (infected abroad, having to quarantine abroad) or quarantine on return etc. are things that most people are ignoring.

With climate change I think a lot of international travel is going to have to be cut back anyway, the days of easy, cheap and regular international travel have gone (and yes I was guilty of that myself in my twenties). International travel (or at least flying and cruises) is something that is going to have to be limited going forward.

the cost if things go wrong (infected abroad, having to quarantine abroad) or quarantine on return etc. are things that most people are ignoring

Who is ignoring them? They’ve been addressed multiple times on this thread, including by the OP, and I’d wager that most people going abroad have thought of them. We certainly did.