No vaccines for healthy 12-15 Yr olds

[Wellbythebloodyhell]

news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vaccines-will-not-be-recommended-for-healthy-children-aged-12-to-15-government-advisers-say-12398444

Is anyone else glad this potential decision has been taken away? I was very much undecided about vaccinating my older dc and now feel a bit of a weight has been lifted now its not something I need to consider.

I'd only be questioning you if you were happy to follow them in one regard (adult vaccination) but to ignore them in the other (child vaccination).

No you're correct that's absolutely exactly how I feel.

Did I follow advice to have the vaccine, as an adult who is unlikely to be extremely poorly but would rather avoid being unwell at all, and bearing in mind I've had my children and am not breastfeeding so was OK with tolerating the hormonal side affects. Yes, absolutely.

Would I follow any advice to have my 12-15 year old girls vaccinated (who have not been through puberty, not had any children they might wish to yet, so hormonal or long term side affects concern me), even though the science is very clear it would not be for their benefit, it will only be advised to benefit the rest of society.... absolutely not.

I don't see that as a contradiction at all.

@onlyreadingneverposting8

My reckoning is that they haven't recommended it YET based on the fact we don't have enough vaccines to vaccinate 12-15yr olds and booster all the old people/vulnerable too. Once they've had boosters I bet the JVCI will change their minds.

It’s not supply - we have surplus and atm some of that is 4m to Aus

CarrieBlue what do you mean until? Of course it's unless. Just because one child at school gets covid doesn't mean the whole year does, which is why the 10 days at home for everyone has been so ridiculous. But also, if they all stop testing as much a lot of positive tests won't be picked up anyway as they're never symptomatic. I have never, and will never, test any of my children as a matter of routine. I was tested once to get entry to an event, but apart from that have never done a LFT and never would.

@CarrieBlue

So a child who tests positive stays home for 10 days, everyone else carries on as normal unless they test positive. So hardly anyone off surely?

It’ll be until the test positive, rather than unless. Children will be off in waves, rather than as a group so individuals will be far more disrupted since the children will all have missed different parts of the curriculum and there won’t be any capacity to ‘catch up’ individuals.

This was raised several times as being detrimental to learning. There will be little provision for catch up if everyone is off at different times. It’s going to be a mess and a disaster for development. Children are going to suffer once again only some a lot more severely than others.

Some countries (Malta being one) insist on anyone over 12 being vaccinated, and entry is prohibited otherwise.

The vaccine should at least be available privately for those who want to travel, even if it's not universally offered, otherwise certain countries are completely out of bounds to teens. Awful if you've got family there.

I suspect the government will be recommending 12-15s are done anyway in a couple of weeks.

@Thislittlefinger123

I'd only be questioning you if you were happy to follow them in one regard (adult vaccination) but to ignore them in the other (child vaccination).

No you're correct that's absolutely exactly how I feel.

Did I follow advice to have the vaccine, as an adult who is unlikely to be extremely poorly but would rather avoid being unwell at all, and bearing in mind I've had my children and am not breastfeeding so was OK with tolerating the hormonal side affects. Yes, absolutely.

Would I follow any advice to have my 12-15 year old girls vaccinated (who have not been through puberty, not had any children they might wish to yet, so hormonal or long term side affects concern me), even though the science is very clear it would not be for their benefit, it will only be advised to benefit the rest of society.... absolutely not.

I don't see that as a contradiction at all.

We are definitely taking at cross purposes here!

The experts are saying don't vaccinate your kids, so there is no contradiction - you're following the advice as it stands (hoorah)

If advice does change down the road to saying 'vaccinate your kids' and you don't decide to then that's another matter, but hopefully it won't come to that.

@PicsInRed

It's a dreadful decision, probably kicking a tough political decision into the long grass due to the questionable call on no parental consent required. It should at least have been allowed by parental choice.

We'll probably rue the lost time come winter.

Parental consent is required. My 12 year old had his first jab last week, when making the appointment it was made very clear that the person taking him must have parental responsibility in order to give consent.

The right decision in my opinion, children should not be put at risk for the protection of the elderly/CEV population or so that they can go on holiday, except for in the most exceptional cases (CEV relatives within the same household) where on balance it would be better overall for the family and therefore the childs mental health.

@bumbleymummy
It's how you see what the disruption to education is, really. It's not just by being ill, also I need to consider long covid as a parent. Risk of long covid increases with age. So older the children is, more risk, and especially when they are at exam age, etc, the lost time would be detrimental.
www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/01/one-in-seven-children-with-covid-still-suffering-three-months-later-study

This has really disappointed me.
12-15 Yr olds and their parents should have been given the choice to have it or not.

@halcyondays

They haven’t actually made a decision just passed the buck to other people to decide. I’m furious my children still can’t get a safe and effective vaccine that was approved by the MRHA months ago. I’ve no idea why they’re focusing so much on the risk of myocarditis which is a very very rare side effect, the risk of getting it from catching Covid is considerably higher. Having the jab reduces the chance of long Covid, which thousands of children in the UK already have and it can be really debilitating.

They weighed up the risks and benefits health-wise and found that the benefits didn’t outweigh the risk for healthy children. Those very rare side effects must have been more likely with the vaccine than with the virus.

If it's not recommended, why would you want your child to have it?

@Thislittlefinger123

CarrieBlue what do you mean until? Of course it's unless. Just because one child at school gets covid doesn't mean the whole year does, which is why the 10 days at home for everyone has been so ridiculous. But also, if they all stop testing as much a lot of positive tests won't be picked up anyway as they're never symptomatic. I have never, and will never, test any of my children as a matter of routine. I was tested once to get entry to an event, but apart from that have never done a LFT and never would.

Your skewed reasoning is why we’ll never get out of this mess. If everyone had such simplistic logic the cases would be through the roof. You do understand why testing is important don’t you? Maybe have a word with someone knowledgeable to explain to you just why routine testing is necessary.

Sorry didn't mean to be so grumpy! I'm just fed up of covid now. We did our civic duty, stuck to the rules for the large part, had our vaccines. But I've drawn a line now as I'm not willing for my DCs lives to be disrupted any further for something that has never been a risk to them. So the suggestion they be vaccinated, stay home from school, be tested etc any longer hit a nerve. Apologies.

@whichone347

If it's not recommended, why would you want your child to have it?

It’s recommended by the MRHA and is also recommended in lots of other countries.

I expect it will be recommended here soon too.

I agree that JCVI are passing the buck.

They have clearly said the science doesn't support vaccination, but passed it onto other people to look at other factors such as 'disruption to education'

As far as I can see children catching covid has caused very little disruption to education. What has caused the disruption is the lockdowns and periods of self isolation. Not that I disagree with the lockdowns, but I think it is more sensible to think about and change some of the rules we've created around covid, rather than vaccinate children.

I have no faith in the government but would trust both JCVI and CMO. If they disagree and it is offered then it could make it harder for some parents to come to a decision. I'm glad mine aren't within that age bracket.

Thewiseoneincognito 😂 I'm not the only one grumpy today I see.

It's not a simplistic view. There is no "getting out", covid is here to stay now so it's how we manage it. Vaccines and staying home if you're personally positive is what I'm happy with. No I don't agree in mass testing any more. Early on before vaccines and better treatments etc, yes, no, no. You obviously disagree, which is fine. But I have as much of a right to my opinion as you do.

*now, no

They have clearly said the science doesn't support vaccination, but passed it onto other people to look at other factors such as 'disruption to education'

Which is interesting as last time they did comment on disruption to education. They said this could be dealt with by allowing pupils with covid to attend school. If that isn't their remit this time then it shouldn't have been in their report last time.

As far as I can see children catching covid has caused very little disruption to education. What has caused the disruption is the lockdowns and periods of self isolation. Not that I disagree with the lockdowns, but I think it is more sensible to think about and change some of the rules we've created around covid, rather than vaccinate children.

Absolutely agree with this. Covid has not affected my children at all (and wouldn't if they caught it). Lockdowns and isolation periods have and I'm very happy for them both to stop.

What has caused the disruption is the lockdowns and periods of self isolation. Not that I disagree with the lockdowns, but I think it is more sensible to think about and change some of the rules we've created around covid

This^.

To those that are happy with this decision, you do realise that this makes another Lockdown even more likely, don't you?

Schools are completely fucked.

I'd already decided my children will not be vaccinated so I'm glad about this decision it means they won't be under pressure to get vaccinated when they go back to school