Immoral and dangerous - or sensible? Vaccination for 16 year old.

[CaptainCaveMum]

Locally many many healthy (not CV nor living with someone CV) 16 year olds are getting vaccinated. The majority of my DS’s friends have now had their first dose. I’m being encouraged (by other parents) to take DS for the vaccine.

I’m conflicted.

The JCVI has clearly said the risk (small) to these children outweighs the benefits (even smaller).
Morally I am uncomfortable about cheating the system when older and sicker people here and overseas would benefit more.

But.

From a social perspective, my unvaccinated DS may miss out on some things eg nightclubs, festivals.
And what if the JCVI are wrong?
And what if he catches COVID?

DS says he’ll do what I advise.
Please help me unpick this.

@bethelighthouse

The JCVI has clearly said the risk (small) to these children outweighs the benefits (even smaller)

Really? I don't think they have said this outright. JCVI only prioritise the vaccine, they are not responsible for assessing data. That is the MHRA.
The government are misleading the public about that to cover up a shortage of supply and/or some rather anti-vaxx sentiment near the heart of government.

The MHRA have at no time said that the risk outweighs the benefit for the over 12s - quite the opposite, the MHRA have approved the vaccine for ALL over 12s and based on their on-going monitoring of ALL the data (which they receive directly as the sole body responsible for pharmacovigilance or drug safety in the UK) they have not changed their assessment or made any change to the marketing authorisation (approval) of the Pfizer vaccine for ALL over 12s.

This is what I’m referring to:

‘The JCVI is not currently advising routine vaccination of children outside of these groups, based on the current evidence.

As evidence shows that COVID-19 rarely causes severe disease in children without underlying health conditions, at this time the JCVI’s view is that the minimal health benefits of offering universal COVID-19 vaccination to children do not outweigh the potential risks.

Almost all children and young people are at very low risk from COVID-19. Symptoms, when seen, are typically mild and fewer than 30 children have died because of COVID-19 in the UK as of March 2021.

The Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine is the only vaccine that has been authorised for children in the UK, for those aged 12 or older. This followed a US clinical trial in around 1,000 children aged 12 to 15 that found side effects in this group were generally short lived and mild to moderate.

Real-world data on the safety of COVID-19 vaccines in children is currently limited, but there have been extremely rare reports of myocarditis (inflammation of the heart muscle) and pericarditis (inflammation of the membrane around the heart) following the use of the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines in millions of younger adults.

Until more safety data is available and has been evaluated, a precautionary approach is preferred.’

From here:
www.gov.uk/government/news/jcvi-issues-advice-on-covid-19-vaccination-of-children-and-young-people

@bethelighthouse how can they state this, if the trial data says the opposite?

FOr me I would like my daughter vaccinated. Some of my reasoning is that it helps protect all family members that she has contact with - several CV but not EV . FOr her its about ensurign that she can continue her life in a more "normal" way, to reduce the potential of her becoming ill, or being seriously ill and having the effects of that last the rest of her life (Long covid, organ damage, heart or circulatory damage, outcome of potential strokes or lung damage and the impact that would have on her long term). I think over 16 should be included in the have it if you want it, they are the age group going forward that will be socialising, off to college etc and also the 16 and 18 yr old cohort are the ones that educationally the pandemic has had a huge impact on with regard to exam outcomes, general education, socialisation in key years etc. DD would happily go and get it

The JCVI are not the body responsible for drug safety in the UK. That is the MHRA.
The UK is alone among developed nations in not offering the Pfizer to all under 18s.
The whole the US and EU and the UK MHRA think it is safe and the benefits outweigh the risks.
The JCVI decide on prioritisation of supply.

All the safety data go directly to the MHRA, not JCVI.
JCVI is a government advisory body not a regulatory body.

btw at 16 your DC is over the age of consent for medical stuff and doesn't need your agreement.

Plus as I said, 16 is in the adult age group of the Pfizer vaccine and has been approved for this age group since December 2020.
So you don't need to look at the JCVI excuses for not vaccinating 12-15 year olds.

Pretty much all the 16 year olds o know have had it. Shame DD isn’t 16 for another 6 months but when she is she will have it.

My 17 year old has had his first dose (within 3 months of turning 18 so allowed) and if my 15 year olds could get it, she would.
Uk is an outlier in not vaccinating children over 12.

I’m surprised that you can get 16 years old vaccinated so easily. Are you sure that all his vaccinated friends don’t have any underlying health issues/ additional needs? Just genuinely curious as a few friends are struggling to get vaccination for their eligible DC.

Thats what I dont get OP, why are they pushing the vaccine on the kids when they can still pass it on and covid is largely mild on them.

if this was like measles or the other ones they have been vaccinated for I'd be first in the queue with them but it just seems pointless for the younger ones to have it

If it helps, I think in September once the UK secures more supply and have formulated a long-overdue policy on third dose boosters and an impatiently awaited confirmation about the flu/covid booster schedule, the JCVI will finally concede that the data provided by the MHRA do indeed still support safety and benefits outweighing risks and then agree to vaccinate over 12s (after their education has been screwed up a bit more)

So you might as well beat the September queues and take the vaccine now if offered (since the current situation isn't about safety, it is about supply -> benefit of the doubt, but I still think someone close to heart of government is a bit anti-vaxx).

@magicwanda

Thats what I dont get OP, why are they pushing the vaccine on the kids when they can still pass it on and covid is largely mild on them.

if this was like measles or the other ones they have been vaccinated for I'd be first in the queue with them but it just seems pointless for the younger ones to have it

Who are 'they'?

pushing the vaccine on the kids LOL, are they going to pin down the DC in the classrooms? NO - it is OPTIONAL

Ahhh. I think the bat signal may have been hidden in plain sight in the OP.

@bethelighthouse

pushing the vaccine on the kids LOL, are they going to pin down the DC in the classrooms? NO - it is OPTIONAL

Is it? There have been thread on here where parents have said their DC felt pressured to have it. LOL

Has there?
Which country is that? As it can't be the UK for obvious reasons! @magicwanda

@Geamhradh

Has there? Which country is that? As it can't be the UK for obvious reasons! *@magicwanda*

@Geamhradh

Ahhh. I think the bat signal may have been hidden in plain sight in the OP.

Indeed, a confused SAHM who manages to quote convenient statements from the JCVI, but not the more expert and legally relevant ones from the MHRA.

I would be very wary about giving a "child" a gene-based vaccine which involves novel vaccine platforms, where the long term effects are essentially unknown, for very limited benefit to the "child".

NB I've had the AZ shot myself.

Eh?
Simple question. No need for head-tilting at me.
Which country?

Where are you in the U.K. that is offering 16yr olds the vaccine??

My CEV daughter, aged 15 hasn’t been offered it yet which is worrying me a lot!!

My 14yo DS has had first jab, second one due on a couple of weeks although unfortunately won’t affect our travel plans - he’s the only one having to do tests. We’re not in U.K. and at the moment the vaccine is not being recommended to under 16s but they are doing big 12-17 vaccine events every weekend to try and get as many kids as possible jabbed before September. Given that not being vaccinated has numerous disadvantages here (I’m not talking about health risks), it seems unfair to offer it only to adults.

@User1023

Where are you in the U.K. that is offering 16yr olds the vaccine??

My CEV daughter, aged 15 hasn’t been offered it yet which is worrying me a lot!!

Many areas have spare capacity and GPs are allowed to vaccinate anyone for whom the vaccine is licensed rather than waste vaccines.

Sorry to hear about your CEV DD. Chase her specialist and get them to urge GP to organise your DD an appointment

I'm furious that I can't get my almost 17yr old vaccinated, despite him due to be leaving for army college in less than 2months. He's going to be living in barracks/dormitories with people from all over the country, which seems to me inevitable that at least one person is going to arrive with covid!

@Seasidemumma77

I'm furious that I can't get my almost 17yr old vaccinated, despite him due to be leaving for army college in less than 2months. He's going to be living in barracks/dormitories with people from all over the country, which seems to me inevitable that at least one person is going to arrive with covid!

And they will probably all be fine. vaccinated or not.

I find the position of risks v benefits for under 18s very blinkered. They need to also factor in the impact on the young of things like losing a parent or knowing they've infected someone else they love who's now seriously ill. Protecting complete strangers isn't so much of a benefit to them but protecting their loved ones is.