Sajid Javid - arrogant, insensitive?

[RoisinD]

SJ coming under fire from many for his tweet yesterday following his full recovery from his Covid-19 diagnosis. As Health Secretary he should have chosen his words more carefully and been more sensitive to those who lost loved ones, suffering long covid etc
Link to his tweet

twitter.com/sajidjavid/status/1418932718847541248

Link to Yvette Cooper Labour MP's retweet and response

twitter.com/YvetteCooperMP/status/1419064768837599235

Why don't you have a crack at that? Show your workings,

Nah I don't owe you anything, if you don't thing there are many living in fear you are on a different planet.

@Againstmachine

Why don't you have a crack at that? Show your workings,

Nah I don't owe you anything, if you don't thing there are many living in fear you are on a different planet.

The thread is about the Health Secretary describing them as 'cowering'.

So you don't think living in fear and cowering are same thing then?

I don't care about lies in Boris Johnson's private life

What about the ones in his professional life? The ones he has lost jobs over, for instance? Were those ok?

I think it was established by Dominic Cummings that Boris Johnson was not aware of this at the time.

Was this because he was on holiday, or because he was dodging briefings?

Overall between a 7 to an 8 out of 10.

So you think that allowing infection levels to rise to levels where millions of children are missing school, and essential services can't run effectively is a '7 to an 8 out of 10'.

OK. We have different standards.

[quote Againstmachine]@foxandbee

I've not seen you name before are you a banned name changer.[/quote]
Nope, just a name changer who used to post on the defunct SoF thread. I have never been banned.

@noblegiraffe

Overall between a 7 to an 8 out of 10.

So you think that allowing infection levels to rise to levels where millions of children are missing school, and essential services can't run effectively is a '7 to an 8 out of 10'.

OK. We have different standards.

There is no other option than to let infection levels rise.

Even if the entire population were 100% double jabbed, you'd still have a massive exit wave. See HMS Queen Elizabeth.

Nope, just a name changer who used to post on the defunct SoF thread. I have never been banned.

Ah so call people out but pretend you are someone else right.

What about the ones in his professional life? The ones he has lost jobs over, for instance?

Do I care that Johnson was sacked for making up a quote as a trainee journalist aged 23? No, I don't.
He lost his second job because he lied about his extramarital affair - understandable in the circumstances. Wouldn't John Major have lied to colleagues in Parliament when he was carrying on with Edwina Currie?

I think it was established by Dominic Cummings that Boris Johnson was not aware of this at the time.
Was this because he was on holiday, or because he was dodging briefings?

I thought it was claimed that Matt Hancock didn't tell him.

@Againstmachine

Nope, just a name changer who used to post on the defunct SoF thread. I have never been banned.

Ah so call people out but pretend you are someone else right.

If I was pretending anything I would not have mentioned being on that thread!

I won't answer all the points, however to examine a couple:

1. You have to let infections run high. The only other option is to lockdown forever. Even 100% double-vaccinated populations see massive Delta outbreaks (see HMS Queen Elizabeth). Vaccination+infection is the only thing that really ramps up immunity.

This is bollocks isn't it - if the vaccine doesn;t stop you catching Delta, how does catching one variant stop you catching another? So how does infection help with immunity

What work better would be pushing vaccination rates higher and keeping cases fairly low.

Oh bold fail in the post above, soz!

Even if the entire population were 100% double jabbed, you'd still have a massive exit wave. See HMS Queen Elizabeth. This is nonsense, of course any exit wave would be lower if the population were actually 100% double vaccinated.

@lannistunut

I won't answer all the points, however to examine a couple:

1. You have to let infections run high. The only other option is to lockdown forever. Even 100% double-vaccinated populations see massive Delta outbreaks (see HMS Queen Elizabeth). Vaccination+infection is the only thing that really ramps up immunity.

This is bollocks isn't it - if the vaccine doesn;t stop you catching Delta, how does catching one variant stop you catching another? So how does infection help with immunity

What work better would be pushing vaccination rates higher and keeping cases fairly low.

Infection of any variant gives you massive protection against others. SPI-M use 85-100% in their modelling. Perhaps you should go and tell them they're wrong?

My local area is 85% double and 73 single, ,pretty good for a high immigration area. My area must be on way to herd.

Infection of any variant gives you massive protection against others. SPI-M use 85-100% in their modelling. Perhaps you should go and tell them they're wrong?

The vaccine gives you protection against variants, without the risk from the first infection.

Vaccine immunity is better than infection immunity, but you are treating them as equal.

@Againstmachine

My local area is 85% double and 73 single, ,pretty good for a high immigration area. My area must be on way to herd.

Probably not because those are adult only figures (assume you don;t live in a retirement village).

@lannistunut

Infection of any variant gives you massive protection against others. SPI-M use 85-100% in their modelling. Perhaps you should go and tell them they're wrong?

The vaccine gives you protection against variants, without the risk from the first infection.

Vaccine immunity is better than infection immunity, but you are treating them as equal.

Nope, that is untrue.

For an individual it is much better to get vaccinated first, but infection is better at preventing transmission than vaccination. (Infection + vaccination is probably best).

If you think this is wrong, phone SPI-M up and tell them they're using the wrong figures.

If you think this is wrong, phone SPI-M up and tell them they're using the wrong figures.

Modellers regularly use wrong figure, I am not saying in this instance they are but to suggest they are infallible.

2. Kids need to catch Covid. It's actually less dangerous to them than flu. Getting them all infected and then immune is a good thing. Vaccinating them is actually slightly more dangerous than natural infection. Long Covid in kids is no more prevalent than for any other respiratory illness (see JCVI report)

..apart from CV is a vascular disease, they do not yet know the long term effects on children, lung tissue scaring, kidney liver and heart damage, we just don't yet know.
With a science background (i also have one as i did O level biology) i'm surprised you don't know this?

@Clavinova Still unable to make those UK - Germany death rate comparisons?
But more than capable to shift the conversation i see lol!

How about these Johnson lies, Clav? More up to date. twitter.com/peterstefanovi2/status/1419229161810448388?s=21

How about these Johnson lies, Clav? More up to date.

Peter Stefanovic reels off a list of countries in the video with "working" tracing apps (relevant to June 2020) including France, Poland and Australia. What is his definition of "working"? Peter Stefanovic would appear to be lying himself:

June 2020
The federal government’s Covidsafe contact tracing app works as few as one in every four times for some devices, documents tabled in the [Australian] Senate have revealed.

www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2020/jun/17/covid-safe-app-australia-covidsafe-contact-tracing-australian-government-covid19-tracking-problems-working

July 2020
Coronavirus contact tracing apps are not all they've cracked up to be and those being used in France and Australia have flopped, experts warn.

In France, two million people downloaded the StopCovid app but only 14 people received alerts that they were at risk in three weeks of the app being in operation.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8510941/Coronavirus-contact-tracing-apps-flop-France-Australia.html

September 2020
Just 1.9% of the Polish population have downloaded the government’s COVID-19 contact tracing app since its launch in June. That is one of the lowest levels of take-up among European countries.

notesfrompoland.com/2020/09/11/uptake-of-covid-contact-tracing-app-under-2-in-poland-among-the-lowest-rates-in-europe/

Is Serco's app working then Clav, if we're going to be picky about efficacy.

Good luck going through that whole video.