New Boris Statement: Where is this going?

[DadAManger]

‘We recommend masks but only recommend them’
‘Deaths will increase and we may reach 100,000 new cases per day’
‘We must open now and if not now, when?’
‘The slower we take it, the smaller number of people will die’
‘Return to the office of you can, otherwise keep working from home’

Just before Boris spoke, there was a BBC piece claiming that 10-20% of all Covid cases (mild, without symptoms, or otherwise) will be long-Covid cases of some sort or another. Now there a million long-Covid cases.

Are we aiming for herd immunity? Anyone else think this is going to be confusing for most and lead to a default setting of ‘normal’? Where is this going?

Where can we get the FFP3 masks ? My local pharmacy say they can't get them

@Angrymum22

It has always been the case that those who successfully risk assess tend to live longer than those who don’t. The nanny state/NHS has been doing all the grown up thinking for a large percentage of the population now they will have to do it themselves.

Why are smokers not allowed to risk assess whether or not to smoke a cigarette in a public indoor space?

Why are people not allowed to risk assess whether or not to wear a seat belt or decide on their own speed limit?

Why are people not allowed to risk assess whether or not to take heroin?

I’m not listening anymore. I came on here to see what was said but it’s clear nothing much at all was said. So I’ll carry on doing my own thing then.

I think no masks will backfire economically because a lot of people will not want to use public transport and go to galleries etc - if they kept masks these people would go out

Boris has really annoyed me with his delivery through this so far.

But today he was calm and sensible. Delivering a clear message. He even combed his hair and I actually thought he looked older.

Therefore I'm actually worried what the truth is re this exit wave.

Chris Whitty seemed to pass a very somber mood.

Thing is, some of those who really ought to be most considerate about their behaviour are least likely to be so. Unvaccinated yobs (not saying this is all the unvaccinated group, of course) aren’t likely to wear masks on the tube or self-isolate.

Absolutely right. It's so worrying for those who are vulnerable. They really do just have the choice to hide or cross their fingers and hope they are ok. And all for the sake of measures that really don't hurt the economy, like people being masked on the bus or when poorly.

You know, things that are considered common hygiene and courtesy in other countries.

@newnortherner111

Mr Johnson is only doing what he is doing now because too many Tory backbenchers will not support extending restrictions, and Labour will not agree to what Mr Johnson might propose.

You're probably right.

The pandemic is a crisis in some ways on a par with war - and during the war opposition parties worked together for the good of the country.

I think Keir might be willing to do the right thing actually. But I suspect he's in a similar position to Boris, in not having enough support from his own MPs. Which is a shame for all of us, particularly (but not only) the vulnerable.

It's interesting that for the four days post "Freedom Day" whilst Parliament is still functioning Parliamentary staff will be required to continue wearing masks. MP's will be encouraged but will have the choice.

I can't link it for some reason but there's an article about it on Huff Post.

@lovescats3

I think no masks will backfire economically because a lot of people will not want to use public transport and go to galleries etc - if they kept masks these people would go out

I'm not sure really. Around here anyway, everything is pretty quiet, even with masks required. I constantly see buses with only a handful of people on, our village pub's "beer garden" is pretty quiet again after it was busy for a couple of weeks once it was allowed to re-open. Shops are generally pretty quiet.

I think the vulnerable, and especially the ECV are already pretty nervous about going to potentially busy places, and have been throughout covid.

If they're barely going out when masks are mandatory (supposedly), they'll probably neither go out more nor less, when it's voluntary.

@lovescats3

I think no masks will backfire economically because a lot of people will not want to use public transport and go to galleries etc - if they kept masks these people would go out

I actually think that most people will be glad to not wear masks. It’s just the people who want to keep wearing them are being more vocal about it atm.

Are we aiming for herd immunity?

Through vaccination, yes.

It's not possible through catching it. People can catch it more than once, particularly different variants.

@Mixmeup

Thing is, some of those who really ought to be most considerate about their behaviour are least likely to be so. Unvaccinated yobs (not saying this is all the unvaccinated group, of course) aren’t likely to wear masks on the tube or self-isolate.

Absolutely right. It's so worrying for those who are vulnerable. They really do just have the choice to hide or cross their fingers and hope they are ok. And all for the sake of measures that really don't hurt the economy, like people being masked on the bus or when poorly.

You know, things that are considered common hygiene and courtesy in other countries.

But the worst offenders aren't wearing masks now, either, when they're supposed to be mandatory in shops etc.

There are often small groups of scaffolders, builders, roofers, etc., in our local shop (It's on a busy main road with parking for wagons) who aren't wearing masks and make no attempt to SD. Being law doesn't make them wear them now, so they'll act no different next week.

@Notonthestairs

It's interesting that for the four days post "Freedom Day" whilst Parliament is still functioning Parliamentary staff will be required to continue wearing masks. MP's will be encouraged but will have the choice.

I can't link it for some reason but there's an article about it on Huff Post.

Is there going to be a full return to Parliament, do we know?

Chris Whitty seemed to pass a very somber mood

I thought this and that he was almost uncomfortable or uncertain with what he was saying. He looked pretty exhausted TBH.

@Tealightsandd

Are we aiming for herd immunity?

Through vaccination, yes.

It's not possible through catching it. People can catch it more than once, particularly different variants.

People can still contract it after vaccination too.

Interesting article about whether or not it’s even possible to reach herd immunity:

www.wired.co.uk/article/covid-19-herd-immunity

It didn't mention a full return.

The handling here is one of blame transferral. I agree we cannot stay locked away for ever, but Boris is wary of being blamed for what might well be 1400 deaths a week as the cost of doing so. I spect when the figures rise, he will simply say something along the lines of I gave you all a personal choice, and this is a consequence of that choice. I don't know if there is more to say than that really. Many will die from covid, possibly more if we do not open up. it is a really difficult and nuanced decision.

Scratch that. I missed a bit below the advert- I'll try and copy it.

Our freedom will only last as long as the MP's summer holidays.

@MitzyMooo

Our freedom will only last as long as the MP's summer holidays.

Good point!

@Tealightsandd.

The advice for inside the Commons chamber makes clear that from next Monday MPs will be able to sit normally once more, although they will be encouraged to wear masks when not speaking.
“Wearing face coverings will be encouraged for all those in the Chamber, although not mandatory,” it states.
“Ticks and crosses on benches will be removed – and prayer cards will be back in use...Barriers at the end of the aisles will be removed.”
The hybrid model of working, using remote video links as well as in-chamber speeches, will continue. Proxy voting will remain in place too.
“Perspex screens and stickers on the floors will remain until they can be removed over recess.”
A spokesperson for Speaker Hoyle told HuffPost UK: “We have no employment or contractual relationship with Members which would enable us to mandate the wearing of masks. We therefore encourage Members to support us in keeping the Estate safe.”
Garry Graham, deputy general secretary of Prospect, one of the trade unions that represents staff in parliament, hit out at the guidance.

“We urge the Commission to rethink this decision, and at the very least act to protect staff by issuing strict guidance that MPs must wear masks in the chamber and around the estate, both for safety and to set an example to the public about how to behave in crowded indoor spaces.
“It is frankly ridiculous that staff will be required to wear masks around the estate but the very MPs and government ministers who set the rules will not.”
He added it was “extraordinary” that the House of Commons Commission had decided to allow up to 650 MPs to crowd into the House of Commons from next Monday.
“With just a few days until the summer recess, there is absolutely no reason why this move could not have been delayed for a few months when the health situation would hopefully have improved and everyone would have had the opportunity to receive both doses of the vaccine.

@WeirdArchitecture

I imagine the worst will pan out in shitholes like certain areas of the north west, where most people are tired, poor and not altogether educated in general. I know this because ive lived there in the past, and they will be the ones hardest hit, and so will their hospitals.

I also find it darkly amusing that so much focus is on people working in offices, when only 37% of the population have been wfh. Outside of covid, only around 27% worked from home (myself included), so we are a relative minority - but they are the only ones who matter! The rest off the population and those stuck with public transport can clearly fuck themselves.

So yes, I expect it to go nuts in shitty areas, and those who live in decent environments possibly won't feel the worst of it.

I wonder if the future will provide a well funded health and mental health service that treats those with long covid with decency. I can't really imagine the benefits system will care, and this will be even further compounded by UC payments dropping down to their usual rate once more. Those who end up depending on this will become the new 'scroungers', and sadly, most of those in secure work will fall for the spiel.

To sum it up, those trapped in urban shit holes will pay for this, and the rest of us will probably be ok. No change there then.

Sad but true

People can still contract it after vaccination too.

But often less seriously (depending on which vaccine). So far data from America looks promising. 99.5% of their Covid deaths are now in the unvaccinated.

Of course things might change when the UK produces a vaccine resistant variant. Which seems to be what the Westminster government is aiming for.

I don't imagine 650 MP's will be back in as they are continuing with current workings but will be interesting to see how many are there and who wears masks when not speaking.

Where is this going?

And you come on Mumsnet to ask about the future of society?