Online emergency meeting of British scientists and politicians tomorrow

[JanFebAnyMonth]

www.johnsnowmemo.com/summitdeclaration.html?fbclid=IwAR1ip9v81nlZUTBIN46cKEOhvqmr3n2ISfEGYsUI8WKkb7ZEMnoM6jUEwPQ

JOHN SNOW MEMORANDUM
EMERGENCY SUMMIT AGAINST MASS INFECTION
THURSDAY 8th JULY, 10:00 am

We are holding an emergency summit to outline our concerns about the UK government’s current strategy to abandon most restrictions in England on the 19th July in the midst of a surging pandemic. We have outlined our concerns in a letter to The Lancet (embargoed until 23.30hrs UK time on Wednesday 7 July 2021), now signed by more than 120 of the world's leading scientists. At the summit we will outline our grave concerns about the UK government’s dangerous and reckless strategy, and the urgent steps we need to take to protect the public.

PROGRAMME

Statement from Scientists and Medical Doctors
Professor Trish Greenhalgh, Professor of Primary Care Health Sciences, Medical Sciences Division, University of Oxford
Dr. Richard Horton, Editor-in-Chief of The Lancet
Professor Kailash Chand, Honorary Vice President of the British Medical Association and former deputy chair of the BMA
Dr. Deepti Gurdasani, Clinical Epidemiologist and Senior Lecturer in Machine Learning, Queen Mary University of London

Q&A session
Panel will include all speakers and:
Dr. Rachel Clarke, NHS palliative care doctor and author
Sir David King, former Chief Scientific adviser and chair of Independent SAGE
Professor Susan Michie, Professor of Health Psychology, University College London and member of Independent SAGE
Caroline Lucas, MP, Former Leader of the Green Party of England and Wales
Richard Burgon, MP, Labour MP for Leeds East
Debbie Abrahams, MP, Labour MP for Oldham East and Saddleworth
Philippa Whitford, MP, Scottish National Party MP for Central Ayrshire
Barbara Keeley, MP, Labour MP for Worsley and Eccles South

This event will be livestreamed at: and on Twitter at @allthecitizens.

We will be taking questions from the press and public. Please contact us at [email protected] if you'd like to ask a question.

Please join us at 10am tomorrow

Come on WHO don't hold back about the UK's hybrid herd immunity plan. “Moral emptiness and epidemiological stupidity”

twitter.com/GabrielScally/status/1412911843631411203

Richard Horton:
Horton defended his position by saying "I do not regret publishing the original Wakefield paper. Progress in medicine depends on the free expression of new ideas

Well yes, but the ramifications of that position still have implications today. Well done.

"Boris Johnson is no Gareth Southgate" LOL. Yes, true words from Dr Kailash Chand, Hon vice president of the BMA.

@TheReluctantPhoenix

The whole thing is a balancing act.

We cannot be overwhelmed with COVID, with people dying in homes and on streets.

Equally, we cannot lock down forever, destroying young people’s lives. They have a right to meet and reproduce. Ultimately, that is the prerequisite for existence.

You have to trust that they have looked at the modelling and seen we can cope.

There is no perfect solution and, despite what they say, they can lock down quickly again if absolutely necessary (vaccine breakout, for instance).

The group referred to by the OP are entitled to make their point, but most experts are now leaning the other way, and that is why the government are unlocking.

It's clear there is some disagreement between Chris Whitty and the government.

It is not at all clear that "most experts" are leaning the way of unlocking more rapidly at a time of rising cases.

Most reputable senior medics would be urging caution (like the BMA).

We don't want further health crises if we can avoid it - from a business point of view as well.

Did anyone hear Chris Hopson this morning on R4?

I was surprised he wasn’t more against what we’re doing, but I only half heard it

@MarshaBradyo

There might be a couple not on I Sage posters respect but aren’t all the MPs opposition? And only a handful too.

There isn’t anything here that will influence - and quite far from calling an emergency meeting which would suggest a recognised group talking to those in power.

It seems to be overstating impact somewhat.

Maybe some press but anything gets in the press these days if the football doesn’t override it that is

Well the be all and end all is not whether this can edge the footie off the front page.

The BBC news on radio 4 managed to mention the Euros and also mention this letter.

We absolutely need the discussion space. Well done to them for organising it.

@MarshaBradyo

Did anyone hear Chris Hopson this morning on R4?

I was surprised he wasn’t more against what we’re doing, but I only half heard it

He;s being very balanced and nuanced as usual.

Previously the press cut and pasted little bits of what he said and distorted it.

There's a good thread here

twitter.com/ChrisCEOHopson/status/1413000336915243010

My point still stands

Who is turning up?

A handful of opposition MPs?

It’s hardly calling an emergency meeting. No one is in power

@MarshaBradyo

My point still stands

Who is turning up?

A handful of opposition MPs?

It’s hardly calling an emergency meeting. No one is in power

Well no, you wouldn't expect Tory MPs would you, at something like this, stands to reason.

Lots of doctors though, who know quite a bit about the covid crisis.

Lots of Drs and very few MPs

Doesn’t sound very pressing to even the opposition

2,436 watching right now - wonder if this thread has increased this? I hope so as it is critical to be informed on this.

That is the number from the YouTube livestream.

@MarshaBradyo

Lots of Drs and very few MPs

Doesn’t sound very pressing to even the opposition

It's a press conference, not the Houses of Parliament.

Main likely outcome of press conference is stuff in the press, that's to be expected surely?

It's a press conference, not the Houses of Parliament.

It’s still very weak support. Can’t you see that?

2000 on YouTube ok great if that’s what you want.

I’m sure it will do sod all

Anyway you seem happy and I cba arguing I’m not even watching it.

A press conference to me is on TV with public not that but hey

Thank you. Good science as we know is based on consensus.

Let's build one. Mumsnet important here.

Many moons ago we were told that the earth was flat. Then that changed. Let's hope for changes here too. More power to your elbow. Have another bump.

I'd be sharing this on Facebook as well.

And women are represented in this line up.

Remember, immiseration is a terror tactic. You can all do your part in making things better. Be realistic but don't give up. Think of days and years.

And don't read the Sun.

@puppeteer

Wow. This is pure hyperbole.

The ONS figures do indeed suggest around 1.5% of cases result in some form of "symptoms persisting for more than four weeks". This seems to be the foundation of their argument.

But that's a hugely broad definition, and the linked NHS advice suggests "most will make a full recovery within 12 weeks".

So the damming headline that it leaves "[...] hundreds of thousands of people with long-term illness and disability" is a gross over-simplification at best.

This is political manoeuvring dressed up in as academic work. Which is a shame, because the figures are significant enough that they certainly merit further investigation. But this kind of effort isn't the way to do it.

It's badly timed too. The press seem to have been captivated by the football results today.

You’ve either misread or misunderstood the ONS statistics there. The 1.5% is the prevelance in the entire population, not just those who’ve had covid.

And while the ONS does use 4 weeks as a definition, about 90% of those cases had had symptoms for over 12 weeks and 40% for a year.

@MercyBooth

I'm beginning to hate living in this country with all the hate spewed at people who are respected within their fields. Hate it. So awful.

Like the hate against Professor Karol Sikora. Where a cancer specialist with several decades experience was called a quack.

I don't think he's a "quack" but he's a oncologist who has made some completely ridiculous statements about the control of coronavirus which show he doesn't have a good enough understanding of epi to try and inform policy. He completely misses the point that allowing coronavirus to get out of control will have a a worse impact on cancer patients than lockdown restrictions would.

I wouldn't dream of wading into the world of cancer treatments and demanding an overhaul of the type of surgeries offered for bowel cancer.

Wish they'd put 0.1 percent of this energy into ehlers danlos syndrome and cranio cervical instability. We're just left to suffer and denied life saving cci surgery on the nhs. Covid is obviously a concern, but there are many other things that need attention/research too.

[quote Enb76]world famous editor of the Lancet which is an outstanding medical journal

Used to be an outstanding medical journal - peer reviewing is not what it once was.

'More recently, Richard Horton, editor of The Lancet, wrote that “The case against science is straightforward: much of the scientific literature, perhaps half, may simply be untrue. Afflicted by studies with small sample sizes, tiny effects, invalid exploratory analyses, and flagrant conflicts of interest, together with an obsession for pursuing fashionable trends of dubious importance, science has taken a turn towards darkness”'

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4572812/[/quote]
Totally agree however I assume he's not not referring to the work published in his own journal ?

It is more a general aspect of science in that there isn't much time or money given to reproducing other people's results when you are pushed to do your own original research.

There was some data on the oxidation of tungsten that had been treated as gospel for 60 years that was only recently reviewed.

There was a Nobel prize winner who recently retracted a paper because no-one else could reproduce her results.

Scientists, politicians, whoever.

If you watched the football last night, it is quite clear the stable door is wiiiiiiide open and all the ponies are galloping all over the place as much as they like.

Meanwhile Japan (pretty switched on scientifically and economically) declares a state of emergency due to their rocketing cases.

For those who genuinely don’t see a threat, can you explain to thick little me, why we’ve not just cracked on with it without doing anything? Why we’ve backtracked sooooo many times when numbers accelerate time and again? Why, despite the double vaccine, the vaccinated are still getting ill, and some seriously?

You would almost think that viruses evolved by being able to spread more, would you? Still, it won’t evolve to be more dangerous, will it? Or to be able to evade the vaccines?

Just checked the ONS prevalence study. The estimate the actually come up with for the number of people who had covid and still had symptoms after 12weeks is 13.7%.