Online emergency meeting of British scientists and politicians tomorrow

[JanFebAnyMonth]

www.johnsnowmemo.com/summitdeclaration.html?fbclid=IwAR1ip9v81nlZUTBIN46cKEOhvqmr3n2ISfEGYsUI8WKkb7ZEMnoM6jUEwPQ

JOHN SNOW MEMORANDUM
EMERGENCY SUMMIT AGAINST MASS INFECTION
THURSDAY 8th JULY, 10:00 am

We are holding an emergency summit to outline our concerns about the UK government’s current strategy to abandon most restrictions in England on the 19th July in the midst of a surging pandemic. We have outlined our concerns in a letter to The Lancet (embargoed until 23.30hrs UK time on Wednesday 7 July 2021), now signed by more than 120 of the world's leading scientists. At the summit we will outline our grave concerns about the UK government’s dangerous and reckless strategy, and the urgent steps we need to take to protect the public.

PROGRAMME

Statement from Scientists and Medical Doctors
Professor Trish Greenhalgh, Professor of Primary Care Health Sciences, Medical Sciences Division, University of Oxford
Dr. Richard Horton, Editor-in-Chief of The Lancet
Professor Kailash Chand, Honorary Vice President of the British Medical Association and former deputy chair of the BMA
Dr. Deepti Gurdasani, Clinical Epidemiologist and Senior Lecturer in Machine Learning, Queen Mary University of London

Q&A session
Panel will include all speakers and:
Dr. Rachel Clarke, NHS palliative care doctor and author
Sir David King, former Chief Scientific adviser and chair of Independent SAGE
Professor Susan Michie, Professor of Health Psychology, University College London and member of Independent SAGE
Caroline Lucas, MP, Former Leader of the Green Party of England and Wales
Richard Burgon, MP, Labour MP for Leeds East
Debbie Abrahams, MP, Labour MP for Oldham East and Saddleworth
Philippa Whitford, MP, Scottish National Party MP for Central Ayrshire
Barbara Keeley, MP, Labour MP for Worsley and Eccles South

This event will be livestreamed at: and on Twitter at @allthecitizens.

We will be taking questions from the press and public. Please contact us at [email protected] if you'd like to ask a question.

Please join us at 10am tomorrow

Science finds the evidence that we work with and the basis for making solutions. Policy is what is needed to execute it. Remember to attack the argument not the person. No ad hominem attacks please. We can do better than the tabloid press.

@SamusIsAGirl

Science finds the evidence that we work with and the basis for making solutions. Policy is what is needed to execute it. Remember to attack the argument not the person. No ad hominem attacks please. We can do better than the tabloid press.

No policy doesn’t “execute” it. Policy is about decision making which is inherently political. Failure to understand that is a serious problem, and is currently wrecking havoc on our democracy.

Well, politicians sure are lousy engineers...

@Bizawit

You are scientists. Not policy makers. You are not elected. Stick to your lane.

They ARE sticking to their lane.

Thankfully we still have free speech here,

Thing is, we end up in the political lane whether we want to or not. Research that has critical implications on health and infrastructure tends to end up that way.

If only I could get what I want out of people by smashing them up in a cast-iron mortar, frying them with X-rays and just maybe heating them up to 3000C in the gas chromotograph, life would be a bit simpler. But people tend to get a bit offended when you hit them with a lump hammer...

I’m sick of “scientists” like you

bizawit why the quote marks? Do you think they are pretending to have PhDs and years of expert experience? If we ignore well educated specialists we are returning to the dark ages. We are returning to caves.

I don't like what they are saying and I am well aware of the consequences of what they say. Perhaps the government will decide that the economy matters more. There are difficult decisions to be made. But only backward and ignorant countries refuse to listen to the input of people who really know what they are talking about when making decisions.

That's why you and your children go to school. That's why you go to a trained dentist rather than pulling your teeth out yourself. Emotion and individual experience is no way to make decisions.

@Bizawit,

If we had a coup by scientists (highly unlikely!) they would be ‘outside their lane’.

Governments need expert advisers. If we go to war, we would do well to listen to generals. In a pandemic, it is important scientists present the data and modelling of different outcomes vs different policy decisions.

Ultimately the government decides, scientists don’t. But scientists are entitled to put forward strong opinions within their areas of expertise.

@SamusIsAGirl

Well, politicians sure are lousy engineers...

Covid policy isn’t engineering. It’s about an incredibly complex set of trade offs that profoundly affect all aspects of our political-economy and society. These questions cannot be answered by one singular “Scientific” perspective as a categorical imperative. The fact that you fail to understand that is precisely why you are , very apparently , not qualified to make pronouncements / judgements on these issues, and are clearly stepping outside of your lane.

Susan Michie and Richard Burgon are both Marxists, and therefore adherents of the most discredited ideology in human history. Consequently, I and anyone else with half a brain will be ignoring anything they say about any subject.

The politburo of scientists aren't ready for their curtain call, are they? They're clinging on for dear life.

Taxi's arrived ladies and gentlemen. Nigel, the door please.

The usual bunch of zero covid fanatics. Sounds great, might watch if I run out of pins to stick in my eyes.

@MaxNormal

The usual bunch of zero covid fanatics. Sounds great, might watch if I run out of pins to stick in my eyes.

🤣

Whereas I think we can't have enough scientific debate about this. It might inform the political debate usefully.

And I will be interested to tune in and hear what they have to say (I can always turn it off if it starts to pall).

It's why you don't do things on your own in terms of large policy decisions - hence the need for constructive dissent since it is crucial to avoid group think at times like this. Also important to ensure an even spread of skills and experience in a mixed disciplinary team - need to avoid the policy version of 'false equivalence'.

We don't want to find we've done something dumb like put the equivalent of Richard Dawkins and Ken Ham on the same billing.

More eyes on a problem - more gaps are covered. Also, less of the defensiveness already. Always assume you are going to be wrong about things, but a bit less wrong each time - that's where ideas and solutions come from.

(nervously eyeballs the things that were supposed to be super-refractory materials but just turned to cowpats when heated)

bizawit can you explain why you called them "scientists?"

Do you think they are pretending to be well informed?

@MaxNormal 😂😂

Thing is, politics and most large-group thinking IS engineering. But then what drives it is the problem.

We could have reached our goals on child poverty and have no homeless people - these things can be designed out of the system - it wouldn't happen overnight. But too many people are afraid to ever admit that they can be wrong or that since it doesn't affect them why they should care. Never attribute to pure malice what exists due to stupidity and complacency.

Always assume you are going to be wrong about things, but a bit less wrong each time - that's where ideas and solutions come from

Oh yeh cos that’s exactly the kind of humility, reserve and caution the scientific advisors who have been informing covid policy for the last 18 months have been demonstrating. Give me a break.

@Bizawit

Always assume you are going to be wrong about things, but a bit less wrong each time - that's where ideas and solutions come from

Oh yeh cos that’s exactly the kind of humility, reserve and caution the scientific advisors who have been informing covid policy for the last 18 months have been demonstrating. Give me a break.

Sounds just like the zero covid lot 🤣🤣

Life doesn't give you a break!

on the plus side, hopefully this will get a bigger viewership with all these bumps! MN is useful in making me realise that adult outreach is something science education has been falling down on.

Maybe you don't realise this but this group of people includes the editor of the Lancet (which is one of the foremost medical journals) and several very senior doctors?

You can disagree with them of course but it's very unlikely you guys know more science than them.

And really, just because Boris Johnson somehow managed to get himself elected as Prime Minister, that doesn't mean that everyone else should stop discussing the political issues of the day. In fact, with such an incompetent and untalented government, it is all the more important that there is a high level of national debate about these very important scientific and medical issues.

@Briset

bizawit can you explain why you called them "scientists?"

Do you think they are pretending to be well informed?

Because for all the scientists who believe one theory you’ll find a different group who believe another!

Bizawit What are your occupations and interests? You are clearly passionate about your views - it would be useful since my colleagues and I need to be able to find the best ways of disseminating information and keeping people such as you informed and interested.
While there is no limit to information available online there is also no lower limit and it can be a struggle to keep informed even with the best access.

I was just posting a notice.....