Did it seem a bit odd that the tone of today's announcement was so sombre?

[secretintrovert]

Bojo should have been doing his victory dance for freedom day! Instead the three of them looked as miserable as sin. There's trouble afoot methinks. This will be very very temporary

@Unsure33

Honestly they can’t win . There have been loads of threads saying we should have lifted lockdown as deaths so low .

Now it’s up to every individual to chose and every business to do their own rules and risk assessment and you are still moaning

Personally I will be assessing every situation and acting to try and minimise risk .

And those that don’t you are in for a big shock .

I am not going out mixing without care .
To all of you who hate being told what to do , or who use covid to make a political point , best of luck .

I have to agree with this. I think lots will get a shock when the numbers start rising and people they know start becoming unwell, including children.

Thank goodness. Let's just get on with a full life rather than this half life we've had for the past 18 months.

My parents died young. If I've inherited their dodgy genes I don't want to spend X number of years "staying safe" just in case. I want to see people, go places.

If I get covid, I'll deal with it then. Same for long covid.

@Dustyboots I think that too. I'm preparing myself for next week's 'We told you we would do this, but alas..' moment.

I guess we will find out how effective the vaccines really are against delta.

We have held off to get as many double vaccinated and single vaccinated as we can. And the summer is a much better time to do it rather than winter

This was hinted at in the last press conference too. Valance said then that if we delayed beyond the 19th we’d run the risk of pushing this wave into autumn, which would be a bigger problem for the nhs.

Ultimately, it seems to have been a “it’s now or not at all this year” thing. And there’s no way compliance would keep up if restrictions were kept up for the whole year.

@MrsJuliaGulia

I hope the CEV folk will be given adequate support so they can stay at home if that’s appropriate but I for one am delighted that life is going back to normal and people can get their livelihoods back on track.

I stopped wearing a mask on 21 June and off on holiday in 3 weeks. Won’t be wearing a mask on the plane either. And if I die of COVID I’ll have no one to blame but myself. I’m perfectly fine taking the risk though.

Translation: shut them all away forever and ever because IDGAF, I can go on holiday!

Christ.

[quote MercyBooth]@Tealightsandd dont be so flippant. DH has COPD He smoked between the ages of nine and 56 when he had his heart attack. He survived his.[/quote]
I'm glad he survived Mercy

Both my grandfathers died of smoking related illness - one in his 50s from a heart attack, the other in his 80s from COPD (emphysema) complications. Neither made it to a care home and both were happy whilst alive. But like your DH, my experiences are anecdotal. However, when we get to data.... Smokers are statistically more likely to die younger. This has been included in the research reports about the net economic gain of smoking. Huge taxes plus shorter life expectancy.

My main point remains. Why the hypocrisy and double standards? Smoking, unlike Covid, boosts the economy. Personal choice? What, to risk somebody's life and health through not wearing a mask. Yet no smoking on transport or in pubs.

I just hope we don’t ever have another lockdown no matter what.

Translation: shut them all away forever and ever because IDGAF, I can go on holiday!

Christ.

Yep!

@Tealightsandd

It flipping hasn’t if you want or need to travel. It’s extremely complicated and expensive to get out of this sceptred isle.

The inevitable consequences of the UK's failure to suppress and contain. Just because Boris wants to kill and disable, doesn't mean other countries wish to do the same. They'll be understandably cautious about letting us in. We already allowed one strain to develop last summer. Which we exported around the world. Now we're threatening to bring about the development of a vaccine resistant variant.

Newsflash.

Whats happening in the other 150+ countries in the world?

Variants are not unique to the uk. Vaccines are not unique to the uk. People don't just travel to and from the UK.

There was collective international failures. It wasn't something unique to the uk.

The UK got covid from failures in China and Italy. Alpha was unfortunate but it could have happened anywhere else - the uk was not unique in struggling with case numbers. Delta happened. Our mistake was in not stopping travel to India sooner but this may yet turn out to be a blessing in disguise as I think we got it early enough to avoid the winter. It would have got to us eventually - being hit with it in say November may have taken us by surprise more and made it harder to manage / cope with psychologically. Australia with its virtual closed door policy still has ended up with a growing Delta problem. And they haven't vaccinated nearly enough people there and the lockdowns announced sound wishfully short at present... Uk March 2020 wishfully short.

There are likely to be other issues we don't yet know. Whitty is on record as saying he expects covid to throw up at least one more unexpected twist before winter.

Its very well looking back and trying to throw blame about. It doesn’t change the point we now find ourselves at.

I have been fine with restrictions and taken them on and followed them. My heads been in the right space since October. I'm for masks continuing. But i dont think its tenable to carry on much longer. Even if i want to. More and more people simply have had enough.

If England win on Wednesday then everyone will lose the plot completely. Sunday will be the death of many remaining restrictions in practice if we reach the final. It will be the moment people lose the plot and stop caring. No government scientist or politician nor opposition leader is going to stop that if Southgate nails it. Reckless as it may be, its 18months of pent up frustration that just needs a focus...

Behavioural science not medical science is very much where things are.

On this the UK are world leaders. We know our stuff - largely for many of the wrong reasons!! But its to our best interests right now.

Why are people told not to smoke 'because it shortens your life', yet then when they give up smoking and get to elderly age, they're told they're past their time to live?

If we're told to accept the unnecessary risk of Covid deaths (masks reduce the risk), why not smoking. Which, unlike Covid, is enjoyable for many and a net gain to the economy.

Why also is assisted suicide not legal in the UK. Personal choice and all that.

Newsflash.

Whats happening in the other 150+ countries in the world?

Restricted access to travellers from the UK. Oh, and yet another UK exported strain. It was us who spread the Delta variant to many countries.

I'd say that the scientific and medical experts at the WHO and our own here in the UK know best. And they advise opening up - BUT with simple and easy precautions. Like masks.

Many of the experts are warning that the UK is one of the riskiest places for the development of a vaccine resistant strain. Due to our refusal to take any precautions whatsoever. I repeat, precautions i.e. masks. Precautions are not the same thing as restrictions.

Wearing a mask in an enclosed space is a fairly minor thing to do for most people. Such a little gesture yet giving so much more freedom to the millions of vulnerable. Many of whom work and pay their taxes, and all of whom are valuable members of society.

And again. Long Covid won't go away just because it's being ignored. It's going to cost us dear. In terms of both health and economy.

@ChloeCrocodile

We have held off to get as many double vaccinated and single vaccinated as we can. And the summer is a much better time to do it rather than winter

This was hinted at in the last press conference too. Valance said then that if we delayed beyond the 19th we’d run the risk of pushing this wave into autumn, which would be a bigger problem for the nhs.

Ultimately, it seems to have been a “it’s now or not at all this year” thing. And there’s no way compliance would keep up if restrictions were kept up for the whole year.

There was something in the press about how a number of scientists on Sage had said back in June at the time of the delay that we had something like a six week window of opportunity to reopen before winter complicated matters.

It seems now like most were in agreement on this. Whitty amongst them (but he wasn't the one pushing this most).

From what was said today it sounds like the thing that drove the delay was the risk to the 40 to 50 age group, who wouldn't have been double vaccinated but most will be by the 19th. This is a bit of a contrast to a lot of comments made (here and elsewhere) about how this age group had been hung out to dry. It seems very much like they've been considered after all. And it says much about the degree of concern about this age group being slightly higher with Delta and which has been generally played down previously.

The logic on this argument is hard to get your head round but does make sense. Its not all about covid and there are increasing fears about other health issues which seem to be bothering SAGE.

Thats what makes me nervous as this talk of a wave of other illnesses is something of a new one but apparently happens with pandemics naturally.

I'm wondering how many other countries will be putting us in a red list once we've opened up and ditched the masks and distancing. We'll be over 50k cases a day in a fortnight. What sensible country is going to want us as tourists with our exciting new variants?

Thank You @Tealightsandd He smoked his last cigarette on 31 March 2006. The day of his heart attack.
But still craves them.

@DameFanny Nail On Head. People will be spending their money in the UK.

[quote MercyBooth]@DameFanny Nail On Head. People will be spending their money in the UK.[/quote]
Will they be losing their pre-booked travel though? Who pays if the host country shuts their doors?

@DameFanny

I'm wondering how many other countries will be putting us in a red list once we've opened up and ditched the masks and distancing. We'll be over 50k cases a day in a fortnight. What sensible country is going to want us as tourists with our exciting new variants?

I think in all honesty, there's going to be a batch of countries struggling with their own issues in 4 to 6 weeks time and arguably we will not not be wanting to travel to them anyway because they may well be under stricter restrictions which 'ruin our holidays' anyway.

I think people planning on going abroad this year are either bonkers or retired and without commitments so can accommodate last minute changes of plan more easily.

The uk might be wet and a bit cold but it offers us more certainty this year. The timescale on vaccination programmes in different countries which became apparent with the AZ EU debacle was a bit of a clue to probable issues over the summer... Even without Delta.

More and more people simply have had enough.

Like giving birth and going through labour, having enough doesn't stop it happening. We've all had enough but head in sand denial doesn't make it go away and magically make it all better. That's the attitude that has got us to this situation. Facing it head on and dealing with it was the fastest way out. Australia, New Zealand, East Asia, and Africa. Unfortunately for us and them, countries like the UK fucked it up. And are doing it again. Deja vu.

Australia with its virtual closed door policy still has ended up with a growing Delta Australia with its virtual closed door policy still has ended up with a growing Delta

Because they opened the door too wide. They've now (very sensibly) cut the numbers allowed in. My family in Australia are doing just fine. Better than fine in fact. Vaccines slow but not urgent like the UK. But still it's starting. Two family members in their early 40s are already double Pfizer jabbed. Their lives are relatively normal. Btw just as London or Manchester don't represent the majority of the UK, nor do Sydney and Melbourne represent the majority of Australia. Also, their closed border economy is booming. Ours on the other hand...

RTB - do you think the Delta variant is a big game changer?

Oddly I wasn't too worried about it. No idea why. I think my coping strategies of escaping to cloud cuckoo land have really kicked in with all of this.

@Dustyboots Now thats where i fancy a holiday.

"Like giving birth and going through labour, having enough doesn't stop it happening"

Perfect analogy @Tealightsandd. Shame there's no squishy newborn at the end of all this though

I'm thinking about all the people booking up right now @RedToothBrush, because the government's said it's legal...

Who writes his rubbish speeches? He should be carefully explaining the cost benefit analysis of continued restrictions versus reducing restrictions. It's no wonder people don't trust him. This country collects so much data they could have called on.

He didn't commit to the 19th. Does anyone think the date will be pushed back?

The argument about having a wave in the winter being worse than in the summer - haven't they heard of a thing called the autumn?

It was all so unsatisfactory.

@Dustyboots

RTB - do you think the Delta variant is a big game changer?

Oddly I wasn't too worried about it. No idea why. I think my coping strategies of escaping to cloud cuckoo land have really kicked in with all of this.

Yes.

Some of the data about how its transmitted and escaped quarantine in Australia are noteworthy.

They were managing reasonably well to contain it until then.

Its stuff like it seems to transmit to everyone in a household once its in (where previously it wasn't guaranteed to infect everyone). Or how its 40% more transmittable outdoors (though keep this in the context of 40% more of a very small number is still a very small number).

Australia has a much lower percentage of the population who have antibodies through vaccination and having covid previously but these trends are still troubling.

The uk found that previous restrictions stopped being effective when Alpha hit us because it was more infectious so we had to strengthen them suddenly just before Christmas. Multiply that again for Delta and you've got a problem on your hands.

I would be concerned if I was Australian right now. A few weeks of restrictions isn't going to cut it with that level of infectiousness. And they don't get a major delivery of vaccine until October. They can't get near our vaccine rates until near the end of the year with a best case scenario.

The only good thing Australia has going for it is distances between settlements - but thats also an issue if youve got lots of sick miles from the nearest hospital...

So yeah game changer.

I think the US is going to be the place to watch next - particularly red states with lower vaccine rates. Biden didn't hit his vaccine targets so that much be causing concern. Then i think some EU countries will follow soon after with issues. The Netherlands was doing badly with their vaccine program for a long time - im not sure where they are now, but if they haven't picked up pace with it they could be in some trouble too.

Delta is a monster.

@DameFanny

"Like giving birth and going through labour, having enough doesn't stop it happening"

Perfect analogy @Tealightsandd. Shame there's no squishy newborn at the end of all this though

I'm thinking about all the people booking up right now @RedToothBrush, because the government's said it's legal...

They are daft and not following the news properly!