Thoughts on the non-vaccinated!

[UnluckyMe]

Why have people been so critical of those who have chosen not to be vaccinated against covid 19?

I've read all sorts of comments about those, like me, who chose not to be vaccinated calling us selfish, uneducated and so on. There seems to be a massive lack of respect for what others choose to do with their body and I'm just curious as go why people feel the need to make comments about it. There are obviously many who don't and I do acknowledge that, my post is more directed to thoughts on why the other side do (feels very playground bully like to me).

The way I see it is everyone has a choice - respect that choice and move on with life rather than throwing insults at one another or dwell on something out of your own control.

I'd also like to confirm i do not own tin foil hat, expect the end of days soon or believe everyone will drop dead in 6 months / will transform into magneto from X-Men (all those coins sticking to people's arms!)

I have followed the rules down to a tee but have just chosen not to be vaccinated at present. Maybe I will change my mind, maybe I won't 🤷‍♀️ who knows.

I am genuinely curious - I read on another post "all vulnerable and sensible people have had the jab" as a comment which riled me a bit too! I like to think I'm pretty sensible but clearly this Mumsnetter thinks otherwise 😆😆

UndercoverToad
It’s an interview with the mother of 12-year-old who has been severely injured during covid vax trial. If it’s genuine (which I have no reason to doubt) why shouldn’t it be allowed?

@DownSideUpped

ollyollyoxenfree It was an example of “science” whether good or bad. I’m saying it doesn’t make sense to “believe in science” because it isn’t a right or wrong. It’s ever evolving, often flawed, often trial and error. Sorry to bring up thalidomide, but that was also “science”.

But again, this makes no sense

Using an example of poor science to say you should ignore the body of literature that demonstrates something else is illogical.

As I said before, no one should be cherry picking a study to prove their point. Systematic reviews are really important to triangulate evidence to try and converge around a viewpoint (ie, masks are safe)

I have no idea what idea we is but presumably it’s hosting content that has been banned elsewhere. Are you saying this child wasn’t injured in a covid trial and that it is fake?

I'm getting vaccinated tomorrow. I am doing so purely due to social pressure and increasing feelings of anxiety about being outed as an 'anti vaxer'. I have read so SO much data on covid and this vaccine that it's making my head spin. I am not at all convinced the risks stack up in my favour and honestly if I could get someone to put a placebo in my arm and sign the card I would.

Sad, but true. I'm just not strong enough.

ollyollyoxenfree
I’m not ignoring anything. I’m pointing out that “science” is often flawed and you are arguing that I’m using a bad example?

A bad example of flawed science?

And thalidomide? Bad science. But it was “science” and people believed in it. It doesn’t mean it was right, good or safe, no matter how much or little research went into it. It was still “science” and it just doesn’t make sense when people are accused of not following science or not believing in science as if science is god.

@User24689

I'm getting vaccinated tomorrow. I am doing so purely due to social pressure and increasing feelings of anxiety about being outed as an 'anti vaxer'. I have read so SO much data on covid and this vaccine that it's making my head spin. I am not at all convinced the risks stack up in my favour and honestly if I could get someone to put a placebo in my arm and sign the card I would.

Sad, but true. I'm just not strong enough.

@User24689

If you're not comfortable with it then don't get vaccinated. If at a later date it becomes clear not having it is going to be problematic then you can be vaccinated later. Honestly, this forum is such a hotbed of polarised views it can magnify these issues but people in RL don't think this way.

ollyollyoxenfree

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1117574/

@DownSideUpped

And thalidomide? Bad science. But it was “science” and people believed in it. It doesn’t mean it was right, good or safe, no matter how much or little research went into it. It was still “science” and it just doesn’t make sense when people are accused of not following science or not believing in science as if science is god.

thalidomide was a medical disaster which changed the way drugs are developed and rolled out

I am not personally suggesting anyone should think "science is god" (I'm not entirely sure what it means), and noone in the field thinks that way either.

The point I'm trying to make is that decisions are made on multiple lines of evidence (so lots of different studies, with different types and directions of biases) and the idea is that if by triangulating evidence you get to the same answer, you can be reasonably confident in your decision. Among this, there will always be single studies that can be cherry picked to oppose your views.

@DownSideUpped
The point is - is that the case is being weaponised by people like you - and the far right, without context.

Unless the unvaccinated had a medical reason not to take it, i couldnt give a hoot what they do!

And Mumsnet have deleted your link.

[quote UndercoverToad]@DownSideUpped
The point is - is that the case is being weaponised by people like you - and the far right, without context.[/quote]
the link appeared to be broken but I'm guessing it was referring to "Maddie" which is a story that has been doing the rounds for a while on SM

there's been lots of conflicting reports about what actually happened and no credible platform has picked the story up, which is why I'm slightly hesitant to believe it's all that it seems

This is in contrast to other deaths after vaccination (including one young boy ) which have been widely reported on in the media

@ollyollyoxenfree of course it’s dreadful - but what is ALSO dreadful are the reports of the 1300 babies who have died from Covid in Brazil. This is why context is SO important.

[quote UndercoverToad]@ollyollyoxenfree of course it’s dreadful - but what is ALSO dreadful are the reports of the 1300 babies who have died from Covid in Brazil. This is why context is SO important.[/quote]
yes completely - the aunt of the boy in question stated that even if her own children hadn't been vaccinated she'd still go ahead with it and she was furious fox news were using her story to promote their anti-vax views

the point I was making is there's no real evidence the story @DownSideUpped linked is actually true

@User24689

I'm getting vaccinated tomorrow. I am doing so purely due to social pressure and increasing feelings of anxiety about being outed as an 'anti vaxer'. I have read so SO much data on covid and this vaccine that it's making my head spin. I am not at all convinced the risks stack up in my favour and honestly if I could get someone to put a placebo in my arm and sign the card I would.

Sad, but true. I'm just not strong enough.

This is also me - to a tee :(

Just seen my very first FB post about someone feeling bribed into taking the vaccine to go on holiday. I used to get drunk with her in the pub and cadge all her cigarettes!

Now there is a lot of evidence on the harmful effects of drinking/smoking - but!! - don’t come near me with a carefully regulated vaccine (although maybe if get to go on holiday…)

Just wondering if the vaccine came in pill form, or a nasal spray - or if a side effect was to lose a stone in weight/give you a suntan - if refusers would then take it?

I think many of us have been taught all our lives to only ever identify as a victim. And many are reluctant to do something unless they can see a direct (or instant) personal benefit. What’s in it for me? Along with a massive dollop of psychological reactance (if someone in authority tells me to do something, I will do the opposite).

@UndercoverToad

Just seen my very first FB post about someone feeling bribed into taking the vaccine to go on holiday. I used to get drunk with her in the pub and cadge all her cigarettes!

Now there is a lot of evidence on the harmful effects of drinking/smoking - but!! - don’t come near me with a carefully regulated vaccine (although maybe if get to go on holiday…)

Just wondering if the vaccine came in pill form, or a nasal spray - or if a side effect was to lose a stone in weight/give you a suntan - if refusers would then take it?

I would take it if it was not via a needle, and there was also not this level of coercion from all and sundry about it. Calling me thick or stupid wont make me get it.

@XenoBitch I haven’t called anyone thick or stupid! I don’t really think refusal is related to intelligence - it’s related to individualism.

And coercion is on all sides. I’d say the far right links I keep seeing here are - absolutely - harmful coercion. Misinformation and pseudoscience = harmful coercion.

Yeah absolutely @UndercoverToad.
The vaccine will give you AIDS was another gem I heard.

Just wondering if the vaccine came in pill form, or a nasal spray - or if a side effect was to lose a stone in weight/give you a suntan - if refusers would then take it?

No.

@bumbleymummy A dinner date with Ryan Gosling? If you said yes to the vax?