Anti-lockdowners pretending to care about kids again

[noblegiraffe]

So it's all over the news about how nearly 400,000 kids are having to isolate because of covid cases in schools. Complaints about how disruptive to education it is and to the mental health of the children involved. This disruptive isolation must end as soon as possible.

Contrast to last November when nearly a million kids were self-isolating in a week. Do you remember the headlines, discussions and outrage about that?

No, of course you don't. Because back then, the solution to so many kids isolating was to put more mitigation measures in schools and attempt to stop so many kids catching it.

Now they can argue that it doesn't matter if all kids catch it, they're all over the 'terrible' isolation figures which are less than half of those last year.

I'm SO done with people only caring about kids and education when they think that they can use them for their own benefit.

If these loud voices could be used to talk about things like the cuts to pupil premium, the pitiful covid catch-up funding, the critical shortage of teachers, the unsafe state of schools, the massive waiting lists for CAMHS and SEN services, then maybe I'd believe them when they claim to care about children.

@Mistressiggi

A lot of time is spent attacking Noble (the person) rather than Noble's arguments. Wonder why that is?

Quite. And pretending that noble has said something that she hasn't.

And that when she says repeatedly, 'I want schools to be safer so that they can stay open' what she actually means is, 'I want schools to close'.

Weird.

We have absolutely zero evidence to suggest that any of the mitigations proposed would have kept schools open. Community spread at the point of closures was so high that I suspect nothing would have kept them open

Which is exactly what I was saying. Because we had no mitigation measures it got to the point where schools couldn’t be kept open because infection rates in them were the highest of any age group.

If only someone had thought of introducing mitigation measures before it got to that point.

Oh right, I did. 🤦‍♀️

@Delatron

OP is not actually very good at explaining herself or her point I think.

It can’t be a coincidence that many of us get confused about what she actually wants. We’re not all thick. I have a politics degree so I’m pretty used to debate. Maybe it’s the maths that’s her strong point.

Also agree with @Chillychangchoo that OP is very passive aggressive, she hones in on one poster and is very much like a dog with a bone. It’s exhausting.

I do think if she had a different posting style she would get more support for her ideas. She shoots herself in the foot really. By battling so many people.

oh so I disagree in that

• noble explains herself extremely clearly

• is it a coincidence that many people who disagree with her seem to set up straw man arguments which bear no direct relation to what she says?

• congratulations on the politics degree

• passive aggressive means something else. Not someone who is "like a dog with a bone", which is actually not a bad description. A juicy coherent bone of an argument that she has been determined to pursue.

• If she had a different style she would have been worn down by all the strawman arguments and ad hominem attacks by now. Go her.

I know what passive aggressive means @herecomesthsun, she can be many things. None of them facilitate a decent discussion though.

Of course a handful of her teacher friends support her. Quite often in the past most other posters just leave you all to have a moan amongst yourselves..

Many other posters see that she’s started yet another thread and don’t even bother to engage. So not really ‘go her’, people can’t even be arsed to engage with her anymore.

I agree delatron and I don’t think it’s healthy. I don’t care if that’s taken to be patronising, it isn’t healthy at all.

@cornflowersandpoppies Agree, no it’s not healthy.

But then we got accused of ‘faux concern for her health’

@cornflowersandpoppies

It’s 💯 percent not healthy.

[quote UsedUpUsername]**@ChloeDecker* @herecomesthsun*

You linked a bunch of studies that use models (not convincing) and even one that mentioned droplets (when we know it spreads via aerosols).

You can’t find one RCT study because it doesn’t exist. At least, not one that supports masking.[/quote]
I literally referred to this in my post and the first link, which was not a computer modelling study, acknowledges this (you know aerosols are just smaller liquid droplets right!?)
Cloth masks not only effectively block most large droplets (i.e., 20-30 microns and larger)9 but they can also block the exhalation of fine droplets and particles (also often referred to as aerosols) smaller than 10 microns ;3,5 which increase in number with the volume of speech10-12 and specific types of phonation.13

Definition of aerosols: Aerosol is a suspension of fine solid particles or liquid droplets in air or another gas.

Of course a handful of her teacher friends support her. Quite often in the past most other posters just leave you all to have a moan amongst yourselves..

Many other posters see that she’s started yet another thread and don’t even bother to engage. So not really ‘go her’, people can’t even be arsed to engage with her anymore.

And many other posters, thank her for continuing to post on those threads too who are ‘not teacher friends’.

@Delatron

I know what passive aggressive means *@herecomesthsun*, she can be many things. None of them facilitate a decent discussion though.

Of course a handful of her teacher friends support her. Quite often in the past most other posters just leave you all to have a moan amongst yourselves..

Many other posters see that she’s started yet another thread and don’t even bother to engage. So not really ‘go her’, people can’t even be arsed to engage with her anymore.

#I'm not a teacher

She's clearly passionate about keeping school going as best as possible for the kids she teaches. We need that.

It’s a shame then that she can’t gather the support she needs due to her posting style...

If she had a different style she would have been worn down by all the strawman arguments and ad hominem attacks by now. Go her.

Thanks. I think some people are disappointed that my mental health is more robust than they think it ought to be, because they think they should have been able to stop me posting.

@noblegiraffe

We have absolutely zero evidence to suggest that any of the mitigations proposed would have kept schools open. Community spread at the point of closures was so high that I suspect nothing would have kept them open

Which is exactly what I was saying. Because we had no mitigation measures it got to the point where schools couldn’t be kept open because infection rates in them were the highest of any age group.

If only someone had thought of introducing mitigation measures before it got to that point.

Oh right, I did. 🤦‍♀️

That’s not what I said. Community spread was so high due to the Kent variant that regardless of the infection rate in schools, they had to close. Any ‘mitigations’ wouldn’t have changed that at that time, regardless of when they were brought in. A mechanical ventilation system that isn’t proven to stop viral particles circulating wouldn’t have stopped that. Masks wouldn’t have stopped that (infections in schools didn’t drop when masks were mandated). Open windows wouldn’t have stopped that. Because schools don’t exist in a vacuum.

Anyway the main point of my post was that really, there’s no point engaging with your posts (ironic I know ). Because there’s no nuance, no discussion. Just you telling people why you’re right and always have been, and why everyone else is wrong.

I assume as you feel so strongly though that you must be involved in some real life pressure groups (we all know that simply writing letters doesn’t do much to influence policy, it certainly didn’t help the NEU), so I wish you good luck with that!

Community spread was so high due to the Kent variant that regardless of the infection rate in schools, they had to close.

‘Regardless of the infection rate in schools’. What was that infection rate in secondary schools? Oh yeah, the highest in any age group by far. Was that a problem? Oh yes SAGE said that the most likely first case in a household was a school child who was then more likely to pass it onto a family member than adult to adult family member.

They had to close schools because they were a massive pool of infected kids that was leaking out into the community.

You keep trying to rewrite history though.

I said ‘the support she needs’. Not ‘any support’. For someone who gets very cross about being misquoted you may need to check your own posts.

Equally there are many who see a post from you and don’t even open it. So it works both ways. But of course you will have support from teachers. They would always have supported you. It’s the parents on here you are at loggerheads with mainly and surely those are the ones your posts are targeted? Not your teacher friends.

@noblegiraffe

Community spread was so high due to the Kent variant that regardless of the infection rate in schools, they had to close.

‘Regardless of the infection rate in schools’. What was that infection rate in secondary schools? Oh yeah, the highest in any age group by far. Was that a problem? Oh yes SAGE said that the most likely first case in a household was a school child who was then more likely to pass it onto a family member than adult to adult family member.

They had to close schools because they were a massive pool of infected kids that was leaking out into the community.

You keep trying to rewrite history though.

No, I don’t. But like I said, no point engaging. You’re right, everyone with a differing opinion is wrong. No nuance, no discussion.

I assume as you feel so strongly though that you must be involved in some real life pressure groups

Not really my scene, tbh.

It’s the parents on here you are at loggerheads with mainly

Nope, plenty of agreement from parents who were horrified at how schools have been underfunded and how covid has been allowed to spread through them.

Not sure what you mean by ‘support she needs’….what do you think I need?

While not wishing to hurt Noble's feelings in any way, if she posted shit I didn't agree with I would not post to say I agreed with her. I am not automatically friends with everyone on here who says they are a teacher. Why would I be? You become friendly with people you think talk sense. Plenty of teachers on here I wouldn't give the time of day to.

Handy way to dismiss anyone who agrees with the views posted though - "well you would say that, you're her friend"

@Delatron

I said ‘the support she needs’. Not ‘any support’. For someone who gets very cross about being misquoted you may need to check your own posts.

Equally there are many who see a post from you and don’t even open it. So it works both ways. But of course you will have support from teachers. They would always have supported you. It’s the parents on here you are at loggerheads with mainly and surely those are the ones your posts are targeted? Not your teacher friends.

She is not at loggerheads with me.

I have 2 school kids.

I am not a teacher. (in case you didn't see my last post)

You’ve said yourself @herecomesthsun that you are vulnerable? And don’t go out to restaurants. So yes I can see why you agree with the OP.

However many on here don’t. And I don’t think her posting style helps her case at all. Personal opinion but I’m not the only one that has said this.