Anti-lockdowners pretending to care about kids again

[noblegiraffe]

So it's all over the news about how nearly 400,000 kids are having to isolate because of covid cases in schools. Complaints about how disruptive to education it is and to the mental health of the children involved. This disruptive isolation must end as soon as possible.

Contrast to last November when nearly a million kids were self-isolating in a week. Do you remember the headlines, discussions and outrage about that?

No, of course you don't. Because back then, the solution to so many kids isolating was to put more mitigation measures in schools and attempt to stop so many kids catching it.

Now they can argue that it doesn't matter if all kids catch it, they're all over the 'terrible' isolation figures which are less than half of those last year.

I'm SO done with people only caring about kids and education when they think that they can use them for their own benefit.

If these loud voices could be used to talk about things like the cuts to pupil premium, the pitiful covid catch-up funding, the critical shortage of teachers, the unsafe state of schools, the massive waiting lists for CAMHS and SEN services, then maybe I'd believe them when they claim to care about children.

I was just interested in a teacher's view of this

Liz Truss already ‘leaked’ that the vaccine committee are unlikely to recommend routine vaccination of 12+, and they’re talking about testing not vaccination as a way out of isolations for kids so I think it’s a bit of a non-discussion at the moment.

I’ll be interested to read the JCVI verdict when it comes out because I don’t know the data well enough to comment.

@noblegiraffe I think it’s sadly true, but I think a lot of people will manipulate anything they can to substantiate their view.

The good teachers I know are very altruistic. You have to be on a daily basis in your profession. So it comes as second nature to you.

Others just don’t see the world that way.

I posted this article yesterday - it’s worth a read!

behavioralscientist.org/why-are-people-ignoring-expert-warnings-psychological-reactance-coronavirus-covid-19/

100 % agree with you.

100% agree with you Noble, yet again.

I similarly wonder how many will change their mind about vaccinating their children when it is a requirement for entry to their holiday destination of choice?

@noblegiraffe

So it's all over the news about how nearly 400,000 kids are having to isolate because of covid cases in schools. Complaints about how disruptive to education it is and to the mental health of the children involved. This disruptive isolation must end as soon as possible.

Contrast to last November when nearly a million kids were self-isolating in a week. Do you remember the headlines, discussions and outrage about that?

No, of course you don't. Because back then, the solution to so many kids isolating was to put more mitigation measures in schools and attempt to stop so many kids catching it.

Now they can argue that it doesn't matter if all kids catch it, they're all over the 'terrible' isolation figures which are less than half of those last year.

I'm SO done with people only caring about kids and education when they think that they can use them for their own benefit.

If these loud voices could be used to talk about things like the cuts to pupil premium, the pitiful covid catch-up funding, the critical shortage of teachers, the unsafe state of schools, the massive waiting lists for CAMHS and SEN services, then maybe I'd believe them when they claim to care about children.

And I am so done with people like you pretending to care about mental health and people dying. You only give a shit about Covid deaths and not the deaths from suicide and undiagnosed cancers that have happened since. You call us Covid deniers just because we point out that lockdown is causing deaths too. We are not the ones ignoring facts.

@buffyajp you need to read the University of Manchester report regarding suicide in the first lockdown. They reported no significant rise in numbers.

My family member faced very long delays in her cancer treatment because there huge waiting lists, her hospital was overwhelmed, and her surgeon was pulled away from cancer treatments to treat the high number of Covid cases.

I would say using suicide to substantiate an anti lockdown stance with no real knowledge of findings is just as bad as what @noblegiraffe has observed in her opening post.

@noblegiraffe

Equally someone could easily say you're only pretending to care about kids when in actual fact you only care about your own risk and wellbeing.

But then I could point them in the direction of my long posting history regarding concern for kids and their education and tell them to jog on.

A history that the anti-lockdowners newly concerned about kids don’t have.

And the hundreds of post about concern for yourself.

I 100 per cent agree with you noble.

buffyajp - noble has been very vocal on Mental Health etc. in children (even her OP was talking about CAMHS etc) and there have been many threads on the subject but sadly, most people don’t post on those because they can’t stick the boot in to noble on those ones.

You really can't see the difference between November and now?

The vulnerable have been vaccinated. Thousands of fans are flocking into football stadiums and piling into pubs, but kids are still having to be locked down in their thousands.

That's what people are getting angry about. I wasn't angry in November because I understood the need. I'm angry now because whilst high value business reps can fly into the country and skip quarantine, I can't watch my daughter's first sports day which is in a massive field and at any moment she could have to spend another ten days stuck indoors because of a fleeting contact at school.

Last November we hadn't had the large vaccine rollout.

Last November we were still less than a year into this pandemic and very much in a new emergency situation.

Now is the time to stop the isolations and replace with either testing or nothing.

As a po said, you don't have the monopoly on caring about kids.

@VariantL1130

You really can't see the difference between November and now?

The vulnerable have been vaccinated. Thousands of fans are flocking into football stadiums and piling into pubs, but kids are still having to be locked down in their thousands.

That's what people are getting angry about. I wasn't angry in November because I understood the need. I'm angry now because whilst high value business reps can fly into the country and skip quarantine, I can't watch my daughter's first sports day which is in a massive field and at any moment she could have to spend another ten days stuck indoors because of a fleeting contact at school.

It's kind of silly if you don't want your dc SIing but want to attend sports day while the numbers are increasing among school children. If you don't want children to be SIing, school needs to take measures to prevent spread. Getting angry at teachers expressing their pov won't help.

@roguetomato

Except that's not what I'm angry about. I'm angry about the stark contrast between how football fans and business travellers are being treated compared to children. I never said I was angry at teachers for expressing their point of view. I was pointing out that the reason why so many people are being vocal this time around is because there appears to be a two tier system with children at the bottom.

I wasn't angry in November because I understood the need.

You should have been angry. Lack of mitigation measures in schools meant that far, far more isolations were needed than should have been if the spread in schools had been controlled more effectively.

@Hornbill123456789 Actually a recent report specifically about rates of child suicide since the start of the pandemic is quite concerning. It echoes terrible findings of increased child suicide rates in the USA, too. I can't help wondering if this is an issue all around the world.

www.independent.co.uk/news/health/coronavirus-uk-child-suicide-mental-health-nhs-a9617671.html

USA also- www.aier.org/article/more-covid-suicides-than-covid-deaths-in-kids/

Eh, I'm anti lockdown and have always been against any kind of disruption to children's education. Children should be society's priority, their lives, education and mental health should not be sacrificed for the sake of older people who are free to stay at home and be protected from covid that way

It's still early days with the vaccine end the virus.

Personally anecdotal I'm seeing far far more cases all around than in the previous waves.
I think it's raging around our area and will explode.
I want to see caution until next June. Not necessarily lock downs, but if we need a few weeks here and there in winter, so be it.
By next June we will know so much more about vaccine longevity, how this virus mutates, and how to combat it.
I also imagine by then we will have much better lat flow type tests.

I'm happy to go ahead with easing lock down measure in July but I'm very nervous about how this government is stacking up for a winter if absolute carnage.

Maskless students, no ventilation measures, no si, probably no testing, no telling us daily stats either.. Suppression of information and absolute carnage.

We need a flexible approach not this black and white rubbish it's a fluid ever changing situation!!

Actually a recent report specifically about rates of child suicide since the start of the pandemic is quite concerning.

That only covers March and April of last year and says it is inconclusive due to the small numbers involved?

Samaritans says detailed data isn't out yet, but overall there hasn't been a rise. www.samaritans.org/about-samaritans/research-policy/coronavirus-and-suicide/one-year-on-data-on-covid-19/what-do-we-know-about-coronavirus-and-suicide-risk/

That’s interesting LittleRed53 on that article from July 2020.
It is encouraging to read that since then, suicide rates haven’t risen (BMJ article from March 2021 and The Lancet from May 2021 below) but it’s important to keep it that way.
The issues around funding from the government on young people in this area is still woefully falling short and we need to act fast.

www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n834

www.thelancet.com/journals/lanepe/article/PIIS2666-7762(21)00087-9/fulltext

With reports like this from the government, it’s hard to see how the govt will fix this with its current ‘fingers in their ears’ approach.

@VariantL1130, but football fans and business travellers have other restrictions, like requirement of negative test? Maybe you should have asked the school to organize the event with parents and children testing negative for attendance or something. But I don't think that would be possible with so many people saying they don't even consent to lft in secondary.

Sorry, report from the govt in my last post got lost

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-mental-health-and-wellbeing-surveillance-report/7-children-and-young-people

For those concerned about mental health in young people, Young Minds are running a 'Fund the Hubs' campaign to get funding for national hubs providing early support for young people with their mental health.

If you fill out your postcode, it auto-generates an email to your MP.

act.youngminds.org.uk/fund-the-hubs