Angela Merkel launches bid to ban all British travelers from the EU due to Delta variants

[Honey12346]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/angela-merkel-launches-bid-to-ban-all-british-travellers-from-the-eu-cn95bjfpk

@Delatron

She’s a bit late. Why do Europe think they’re immune from any variant? They should focus on their vaccination program really as there will always be variants.

I do think we are being penalised for our ridiculously high testing (mainly of healthy children) and the fact our genome sequencing is the best in the world. What is the point in doing this sequencing though when you fail to act quickly (India/red list). Though it would have arrived here anyway. Just like it has in Europe and even in the impenetrable Australia.

Do you mean Europe? Or the EU? Big difference.

Do you mean Europe? Or the EU? Big difference.
It's always clear on threads like this that there are a lot of people who still don't understand what the EU is or how it works.

But you are happy for the UK to stop foreign tourists coming her?

Yes, I’m more than happy for unvaccinated ones to be stopped.

@Wakeupin2022 usa has got the borders closed to Europe but not to Mexico.
If Biden was asking mexico to close the borders to the uk/ or ask quarantine to those arriving from the uk, then the scenario would be the same. But Biden isn't doing it.

Merkle is asking other European countries to close the borders to uk

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/28/uk-and-brussels-near-deal-on-covid-passports-to-boost-holiday-hopes

Easter she's asking the EU to habe a blanket ban on UK travel. It doesn't really seem unreasonable as they do so many other things as a club.

If the UK was still in the EU then it would be a different story I am sure.

Mexico / US is not really comparable.

[quote EasterIssland]@Wakeupin2022 usa has got the borders closed to Europe but not to Mexico.
If Biden was asking mexico to close the borders to the uk/ or ask quarantine to those arriving from the uk, then the scenario would be the same. But Biden isn't doing it.

Merkle is asking other European countries to close the borders to uk[/quote]
Except the US and Mexico are not part of a political/economic union whereas Germany is part of the EU so obviously can make suggestions for that union.

Three genuine questions (not meant to be provocative but I genuinely don't understand):

1. Why would people anywhere in the world be laughing at us? Even if they think the pandemic has been badly handled here, do we really have such a poor opinion of people in other countries that we think they'd think of us as laughing stock. When we saw awful images of Indian hospitals and morgues, even if we though Modi was wrong to allow political events and mass gatherings I don't think any of us thought they were the laughing stock of the world. Similarly, whatever people think of Bolsonaro, I don't know anyone who thought Brazil was the laughing stock of the world. Ditto Sweden when they took a different approach to restrictions. Ditto Portugal when they saw a spike after the football final. Ditto Australia when they allowed the Australian Open to take place while tens of thousands of their citizens were trapped abroad. Ditto Italy at the start of the pandemic when people in cities had time to leave and spread it to other parts of the country. Ditto Austria with their refusal to shut ski slopes. Ditto almost every country in the world.

1. When people on these threads criticise "the government" and "the UK", is this aimed at Boris Johnson and the MPs who sit in Westminster? Or is it aimed at Boris Johnson, Mark Drakeford, Nicola Sturgeon and (up until recently) Arlene Foster and the members of the devolved governments? Health is a devolved matter and no nation has done spectacularly better than the others so I assume it is all of them?

1. I'm as cynical as the next person and have been critical of quite a lot of decisions taken in the UK. But what surprises me is that most people seem suspicious of our politicians and their motives but accept that politicians in other countries act with more integrity. Do people genuinely believe decisions being made in other countries are not to some extent aimed at deflecting criticism away from their failures? We often hear "France has done so much to help teachers / schools" and "Merkel is a doctor and is against UK travellers because she is worried about variants" etc. Because it doesn't seem to have helped them in their own countries given their recent elections (admittedly not national elections but appalling results for both the governing parties). Unlike here where in our recent local elections (England) and devolved Parliament elections didn't unseat any party from power.

@ChardonnaysPetDragon

But you are happy for the UK to stop foreign tourists coming her?

Yes, I’m more than happy for unvaccinated ones to be stopped.

But we are preventing any EU tourist coming here, vaccinated or not, unless they quarantine & test.

Why should UK tourists be exempt from other countries treating us in exactly the same way?

But what surprises me is that most people seem suspicious of our politicians and their motives
A lot of evidence has come to light of ppe contracts being awarded to personal friends of those in power. Is it any surprise that people have lost faith?

Why should UK tourists be exempt from other countries treating us in exactly the same way?

It's not the same though, Merkel wants a complete ban and 14 days quarantine. Here you can test to release after 5 days.

Good post Patrick.
I certainly don't think that people in France think particularly highly of Macron and Germans have also lost their love for Merkel in recent times. I guess when you are so focused on the fuck ups of your own govt, it's easy to look at what others have done well and ignore their fuck ups because they don't directly affect the UK

@PatrickTheFox

Three genuine questions (not meant to be provocative but I genuinely don't understand):

1. Why would people anywhere in the world be laughing at us? Even if they think the pandemic has been badly handled here, do we really have such a poor opinion of people in other countries that we think they'd think of us as laughing stock. When we saw awful images of Indian hospitals and morgues, even if we though Modi was wrong to allow political events and mass gatherings I don't think any of us thought they were the laughing stock of the world. Similarly, whatever people think of Bolsonaro, I don't know anyone who thought Brazil was the laughing stock of the world. Ditto Sweden when they took a different approach to restrictions. Ditto Portugal when they saw a spike after the football final. Ditto Australia when they allowed the Australian Open to take place while tens of thousands of their citizens were trapped abroad. Ditto Italy at the start of the pandemic when people in cities had time to leave and spread it to other parts of the country. Ditto Austria with their refusal to shut ski slopes. Ditto almost every country in the world.

1. When people on these threads criticise "the government" and "the UK", is this aimed at Boris Johnson and the MPs who sit in Westminster? Or is it aimed at Boris Johnson, Mark Drakeford, Nicola Sturgeon and (up until recently) Arlene Foster and the members of the devolved governments? Health is a devolved matter and no nation has done spectacularly better than the others so I assume it is all of them?

1. I'm as cynical as the next person and have been critical of quite a lot of decisions taken in the UK. But what surprises me is that most people seem suspicious of our politicians and their motives but accept that politicians in other countries act with more integrity. Do people genuinely believe decisions being made in other countries are not to some extent aimed at deflecting criticism away from their failures? We often hear "France has done so much to help teachers / schools" and "Merkel is a doctor and is against UK travellers because she is worried about variants" etc. Because it doesn't seem to have helped them in their own countries given their recent elections (admittedly not national elections but appalling results for both the governing parties). Unlike here where in our recent local elections (England) and devolved Parliament elections didn't unseat any party from power.

Good questions which I pretty much agree with so will let others who don’t answer

But the laughing stock stick is a tired one for the reasons you mention.

But also if we are ahead with vaccination we can handle a higher delta proportion. If other countries need more time it’s not much to laugh about. Besides that nearly everywhere has it already.

@Naggety I'm not saying there aren't things to be suspicious about here. I'm saying why is there an assumption there aren't suspicious things happening in other countries? I have lived in the UK for about 25 years but am not from here - and I have close family living in 3 different countries. So I follow their news too. And it isn't just here that these kinds of allegations are made. I think you stopped reading before the end of that sentence you quoted "... but accept that politicians in other countries act with more integrity".

But also if we are ahead with vaccination we can handle a higher delta proportion. If other countries need more time it’s not much to laugh about. Besides that nearly everywhere has it already

Whilst they may all have Delta, they just do not have it in the numbers the UK has.
I'm sure that once vaccines catch up in other countries and given their much higher healthcare capacity, we can all get back to tourism again.

From my european contacts, the laughter toward the UK came when Johnson became foreign secretary, many people associated him as a zany mayor of london with a big gob, not an international statesman, after that, there was little laughter, maybe pity and incredulity?

@thecatsatonthewall

But also if we are ahead with vaccination we can handle a higher delta proportion. If other countries need more time it’s not much to laugh about. Besides that nearly everywhere has it already

Whilst they may all have Delta, they just do not have it in the numbers the UK has.
I'm sure that once vaccines catch up in other countries and given their much higher healthcare capacity, we can all get back to tourism again.

From my european contacts, the laughter toward the UK came when Johnson became foreign secretary, many people associated him as a zany mayor of london with a big gob, not an international statesman, after that, there was little laughter, maybe pity and incredulity?

Really they are that interested?

Blimey they must be rolling around now he’s PM and the other side seems to be more ineffectual and quiet each month

[quote PatrickTheFox]@Naggety I'm not saying there aren't things to be suspicious about here. I'm saying why is there an assumption there aren't suspicious things happening in other countries? I have lived in the UK for about 25 years but am not from here - and I have close family living in 3 different countries. So I follow their news too. And it isn't just here that these kinds of allegations are made. I think you stopped reading before the end of that sentence you quoted "... but accept that politicians in other countries act with more integrity".[/quote]
I’m not surprised you’ve lived elsewhere. Me too, probably why your post makes more sense than the laughing stock ones.

Really they are that interested?

They are probably as interested in him as Daily Mail is in Macron / Merkel.

If anything what will make me ashamed to be British its the Politicians that are representing us on the world stage........

@Wakeupin2022

Really they are that interested?

They are probably as interested in him as Daily Mail is in Macron / Merkel.

If anything what will make me ashamed to be British its the Politicians that are representing us on the world stage........

When he was foreign secretary apparently, they were already interested and laughing. I suppose he’d enjoy the attention above others.

‘Ashamed to be British’ strong words. Hopefully the other side will pick up in time for next election so it’s not so bad.

Really they are that interested?

did you see Boris's speech at the G7 on building back better?

He looked half cut, dribbled on about building back green/back gender neutral/back feminine etc

Emily Thornberry was asked if she agreed with him, she replied "i ve no idea what he was on about" and neither did anyone else.

He is a guy that says "The matter is closed" and then 2 days later says Hancock removal was his doing.... people don't laugh at the UK anymore.

‘Ashamed to be British’ strong words.

Not really. Him and his party is one of the major reasons that I may not be British for much longer, whether I like it or not!

@Delatron

She’s a bit late. Why do Europe think they’re immune from any variant? They should focus on their vaccination program really as there will always be variants.

I do think we are being penalised for our ridiculously high testing (mainly of healthy children) and the fact our genome sequencing is the best in the world. What is the point in doing this sequencing though when you fail to act quickly (India/red list). Though it would have arrived here anyway. Just like it has in Europe and even in the impenetrable Australia.

I thought Iceland was the world leader in genome sequencing. They certainly were early on, well according to a programme I watched.

@thecatsatonthewall

Really they are that interested?

did you see Boris's speech at the G7 on building back better?

He looked half cut, dribbled on about building back green/back gender neutral/back feminine etc

Emily Thornberry was asked if she agreed with him, she replied "i ve no idea what he was on about" and neither did anyone else.

He is a guy that says "The matter is closed" and then 2 days later says Hancock removal was his doing.... people don't laugh at the UK anymore.

When he was foreign secretary?

That’s the part I found at odds with most.

"She’s a bit late. Why do Europe think they’re immune from any variant? They should focus on their vaccination program really as there will always be variants"

I don't think they believe they are immune from variants.

However, they have assessed the risk of allowing travellers from the UK more thoroughly than you have and decided that importing more cases and or seeding further outbreaks will accelerate the growth of cases. By blocking travel from high risk cases like the UK they can buy more time to get jabs in arms as opposed to extending restrictions like we had to after failing to restrict travel from India.

How novel for a government to learn from events in other countries and act accordingly...

[quote PatrickTheFox]@Naggety I'm not saying there aren't things to be suspicious about here. I'm saying why is there an assumption there aren't suspicious things happening in other countries? I have lived in the UK for about 25 years but am not from here - and I have close family living in 3 different countries. So I follow their news too. And it isn't just here that these kinds of allegations are made. I think you stopped reading before the end of that sentence you quoted "... but accept that politicians in other countries act with more integrity".[/quote]
I live here (UK) so what happens here is higher up my list of priorities than what happens elsewhere. If the answer to something being bad here is that it is just as bad elsewhere it doesn't help me at all.