So angry at the Government this evening

[Moonme]

I’m SO mad. I haven’t been on this board for months and I was feeling really optimistic about life feeling like it was returning to normal.
It is criminal that they have let this variant in. It’s literally ground hog day. Playing politics with public health to do trade deals (because of bloody Brexit) with India.
I know there is hope that the vaccines will do there jobs but we shouldn’t be in this position. This wasn’t inevitable. Arggh so cross

@EssentialHummus

What is going on? Are they making some stupid point at border control? Why is it so badly managed?

It has been badly managed for at least the 12/13 years I've been an immigrant here. Classic UKBA behaviour. I recently applied for citizenship - cost around £2,000 - and the borstal where you're interviewed doesn't even extend the courtesy of chairs to sit on during the two hour process. We are the great and glorious UK, and you, visitor, don't matter at all beyond your ability to get your chequebook out on demand. Queue for six hours, get infected, lick one another for all we care.

Appalling. Sorry to hear that hummus.

So saving costs/dire management has prob lead to this latest infection issue

6-8 hours makes the headlines but I gather many days it's 1-2 hours max...still not great if you are mixing in queues

I think there's a lot of politics at play with regard to all this and that given half a chance "Border"/Home Office/HMG will happily pass the buck and the blame for any problems onto airport management/airlines.

Oh and an aside I do know people who have self isolated and during that time been rung up on a landline and/or visited by the police, so some checking does go on.

It’s an expensive situation

An open letter was sent from airline industry to government this week on needing more, about £7bn support so far so its pretty hefty

Indian variant not just in the places mentioned on news, Bolton, Bedford etc.
Already arrived in less typical places, e.g. south-west.

School/PHE policy seems to have gone back to max measures again - whole year groups sent home for 10 days again now.

Yes, I am also very angry at the government. Could have been entirely prevented with proper travel policies, proper border control, proper quarantine. Yet another opportunity missed when case numbers were extremely low to close borders and reopen up life internally and get back to normal. Now we will be in lockdown again for months sooner or later.

IF..... India was on the red list and travel direct to here from there was banned, people would be shouting ''Racism!!'

Like they did for all the other countries with similar ethnic populations placed on the red list with far less cause, far sooner?... Oh wait - nobody DID cry racist!

Also - you can't circumnavigate red list status - if you've been IN a red list country within the last 14 days, the rules still apply - doesn't matter which airport you last visit.

@HouseofWindsor

There's some communities that need to pull their finger out and comply with the Government restrictions and measures.

The Government know who this communities are. However to mitigate risk they still allowed communities to freely travel back and fore to see family etc.

Blame Government AND communities in the hotspot areas.

I think there are several things that come together with England in particular, that may mean we are going to be a hotspot for covid going forward, for a long time.

1. Heathrow is a global transport hub.

1. Lots of staff work there, and then go home to places in or near London.

1. People in the UK have got used to flying in and out frequently, and maybe lived here partly because worldwide travel has been easy.

1. Many immigrants, legal and illegal, have arrived over the years, who have many family members across the world. They may not like or want to engage with authorities.

1. The UK is not a country like Chi na, or other countries who are very harsh against their own citizens.

1. Europe has not had many viruses like covid before, well not like perhaps Asia in particular, so it is hitting us hard.

1. We are not that densely populated in general, but probably plenty close enough in a pandemic.

I just cant see how covid can possibly be totally stopped, no matter how hard individuals try.

It would have got in, but would slowing it down earlier, have helped, maybe.

I would like the to hear reasons for not adding earlier from MP / other

Even right wing press highly critical this morning. Mail (sorry) reports that 4.8% of passengers from India were covid positive in the delay between Pakistan/Bangladesh and India being put on the red list. From the times
A source who attended a Whitehall war gaming exercise on Thursday said: “It’s very clear that we should have closed the border to India earlier and that Boris did not do so because he didn’t want to offend Modi.”

So there it is. Boris has put 100s/1000s more at risk inc our local economy here because we are so bloody desperate scrabbling around for trade deals. Another win for Brexit. Good job we’ve gained such great control of our borders eh?

Light and - that’s very reasonable BUT every day matters. Each day thousands are vaccinated and that needs to be faster than cases coming in. The gov fxxxed up.

Although I do agree with govt failing on this there has to be individual responsibility as well
School children are very open about how they have got back into the country after visiting India etc.... by going via Turkey gor example. And they weren't travelling for any urgent reasons either..... whilst the majority of the public barely strayed from home

So if people, as well as the gov't, weren't selfish idiots, we wouldn't be in this mess

Of course it would have got in eventually. But in much smaller numbers it’s much easier to control and detect with surge testing. And it would have given more time to know for certain if the vaccine remains effective against the new strain before it’s already spreading to masses of the population. I really don’t see how they can spin this as anything other than another massive f**k up.

Also - you can't circumnavigate red list status - if you've been IN a red list country within the last 14 days, the rules still apply - doesn't matter which airport you last visit.

I know what you're driving at and you are right in terms of what is written in guidance/law but just to be clear people can circumvent red list status by lying about their travel history on their Passenger Locator Form..

Not that I am suggesting that happened of course

@loginfail

Also - you can't circumnavigate red list status - if you've been IN a red list country within the last 14 days, the rules still apply - doesn't matter which airport you last visit.

I know what you're driving at and you are right in terms of what is written in guidance/law but just to be clear people can circumvent red list status by lying about their travel history on their Passenger Locator Form..

Not that I am suggesting that happened of course

I don't believe that did happen - not at least at any level that mattered.

The problem was the length of time it took to put India ON the red list and when they did so, they gave a 5 day notice period!

Estimates from other countries suggest that 50 infected people PER flight were returning to the UK in that final week.

Expected to quarantine at home, but no rules for their household members to quarantine with them...... totally stupid really.

It's JUST like March 2020 when returning skiers from Italy seeded the virus all over the country.

Incidentally, I notice the government lie, openly reported without challenge by the BBC that India went on the red list BEFORE the variant was put under investigation. Completely false - the variant has been under investigation for a LOT longer.

Isn't part of the travel quarantine issue the way it's done (for non-red list countries) - for example you are allowed to take public transport to your quarantine address and other people living with you don't have to quarantine? So someone could have followed the rules perfectly but if they live with five other people they infected on day 3 then they all mixed with others at work, schools, shops etc.

And there's a delay between detecting a case as this variant so track and trace is always a few steps behind, too.

It's all very frustrating and so avoidable if the system was better.

I don't believe that did happen - not at least at any level that mattered.
The problem was the length of time it took to put India ON the red list and when they did so, they gave a 5 day notice period!

I'm afraid I don't fully share you confidence with regard to the first point, certainly with regard to arrivals post the country going on the red list..

I agree with you on the second.

I know someone who came back from Dubai recently. They flew via another destination and then just lied on the form.

Some people on here very naive IMO. People lie all the time to avoid restrictions. i am well aware of people lying about where they've been, where they've travelled from and taken longer routes etc but none of it can be proven.

@NotSoLongGoodbye

Some people on here very naive IMO. People lie all the time to avoid restrictions. i am well aware of people lying about where they've been, where they've travelled from and taken longer routes etc but none of it can be proven.

I suspect it could be proven in many cases but it would require resources that, so far at least, HMG are not willing to deploy.....

They'd rather insist on insisting people fill in apps/paper forms and reminding them they should be jolly honest when they do so (which TBF most people are.

While all this mismanagement continues the UK is heading for a bigger car crash.
I went to a seaside resort yesterday and it was shocking to see how run down it has become since we visited last year. Also child poverty was clearly visible in the children playing in car parks who really shouldn't have been out without there parents.
Absolutely heartbreaking and i doubt i will see the recovery in places like that in my life time.
We need to do a LiveAid for this country to renew the areas that have lost out through lack of visitors.
All Government schemes just seem to end up lining chums and buddies pockets.

@sleepwouldbenice

Although I do agree with govt failing on this there has to be individual responsibility as well School children are very open about how they have got back into the country after visiting India etc.... by going via Turkey gor example. And they weren't travelling for any urgent reasons either..... whilst the majority of the public barely strayed from home

So if people, as well as the gov't, weren't selfish idiots, we wouldn't be in this mess

Agree about the individual responsibility.

A big reason Turkey got put on the red list was because so many people in India were using it as a route to get back to the UK.

I think one of the main problems is that we have a reckless PM and a reckless cabinet. Johnson's whole life has been a series of car crashes caused by his recklessness. He doesn't care what he breaks. This is just his character and he is unable to change.

It's JUST like March 2020 when returning skiers from Italy seeded the virus all over the country

All seems deliberate to me.
For what reason, I have yet to work out.
Incompetence? Having "higher" priorities such as trade in this case, herd immunity? Outside influences? I dont know.

@bookworm1632

IF..... India was on the red list and travel direct to here from there was banned, people would be shouting ''Racism!!'

Like they did for all the other countries with similar ethnic populations placed on the red list with far less cause, far sooner?... Oh wait - nobody DID cry racist!

Also - you can't circumnavigate red list status - if you've been IN a red list country within the last 14 days, the rules still apply - doesn't matter which airport you last visit.

They did cry racist when Donald trump imposed travel restrictions.

And China too.

Also people returning from skiing didn’t know they were incubating the virus. People have travelled back and forth to India in the full know,edge that the virus is raging there.

Irma, until the first week of April the Indian government was telling its citizens that covid had been defeated. Life was normal there until the end of March. The govt had approved religious ceremonies, weddings, and funerals. People were travelling within India, workplaces had opened up, and schools were partially open.