School pupils vaccinated from September

[Totalbeach]

This is in lots of papers today. Such as:

www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/19274021.secondary-school-pupils-set-get-covid-jab-september/

And:

www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/02/nhs-england-draws-up-plan-to-give-covid-jabs-to-children-12-and-over

What’s your reaction?

Mine is that I 100% won’t be allowing my children to be vaccinated.

In the whole pandemic so far, 12 children under 15 have died in the U.K. That increases to 32 in the under 20s. The mortality rate is vanishingly tiny. A huge percentage of kids don’t even get symptoms at all.

The government has assured us till they are blue in the face that schools are safe and that children don’t spread it so it will be interesting to see what kind of enormous gaslighting they attempt to pull off to persuade parents they now need to vaccinate their kids.

The long term effects of the vaccines are totally unknown and recent events with AZ have proved rather horribly that even after a vaccine is rolled out, serious effects can come to light. Including events that disproportionately affect certain age groups.

I’m fully vaccinated (including first Covid vaccine) as are my kids but there is no way I’d let them be vaccinated in September. With any of the vaccines.

Thanks for linking the Canadian approval @TruelyWonder. So great! My DD (13) is CEV and I am looking forward to the Pfizer vaccine being approved for 12-16 range so very much. I can’t find any information about MHRA (uk regulator) review. I’m hoping so much that they will review it for UK ASAP.

My kids are most definitely not being vaccinated. Utterly ridiculous idea.

Like I have said before the good news is America, Israel and now Canada will have been vaccinating their kid long before we have to decide anything.

Personally I think my teenager will have the jab. However won't make a final decision until I see what happens in the above places. We have the luxury of seeing there results and if any possible issues.

@TruelyWonder

Like I have said before the good news is America, Israel and now Canada will have been vaccinating their kid long before we have to decide anything.

Personally I think my teenager will have the jab. However won't make a final decision until I see what happens in the above places. We have the luxury of seeing there results and if any possible issues.

I think the MHRA are probably already reviewing an application from Pfizer for EUA, but there isn't much point in approving it until you can get more supply and get the older cohorts vaccinated. So they do have the flexibility to wait until more data comes in.

@Chocl8

Thanks for linking the Canadian approval *@TruelyWonder*. So great! My DD (13) is CEV and I am looking forward to the Pfizer vaccine being approved for 12-16 range so very much. I can’t find any information about MHRA (uk regulator) review. I’m hoping so much that they will review it for UK ASAP.

I know a far few people from work and socially that have CEV kids. So very happy they will get done with no need for intervention from a consultant or however that was going to work.

My school staff friends will definitely be getting their kids done straight away. Can imagine a lot of keyworkers will be pleased about this. Living with the knowledge that your job could put your child in danger isn't very nice.

@MissConductUS Just to say thank you for your posts on this thread. They are full of good information ❤

[quote TruelyWonder]@MissConductUS Just to say thank you for your posts on this thread. They are full of good information ❤[/quote]
Aww, thank you @TruelyWonder.

I'm an HCP as well as a mum, and I spent some truly horrific months last year caring for covid patients, so this is a topic that I'm really engaged with. It also bothers me how much misinformation on this topic circulates on MN, so I'm careful to cite real sources when I say something.

To those of you making the “crazy, ridiculous, madness, over my dead body” comments, I wonder what you’d think if you walked in my shoes?

My DD has post COVID symptoms of neurological symptoms, joint inflammation, insomnia, anxiety, rashes, new onset psoriasis, frequent nausea and diarrhoea, new food intolerances and visual disturbances. She’s bombing out in her a level studies; may have to quit. She was previously strong and healthy; never one to get ill or catch the circulating bugs. She catches everything now though, even with mask wearing and fanatical hand washing.

A fellow pupil developed a serious cardiac condition during her COVID illness. It is irreversible and will require lifelong treatment, although hopefully medical advancements will change that in time. Currently she’s in hospital frequently.

Don’t be so dismissive; or frankly, so sneery, in the case of some of these posters. You just got lucky. Some of us didn’t. I envy you, even if I don’t like your attitude.

My DS 15 will decide whether he gets it. I personally think it would be best

I would probably take my children out of school if mass vaccination became a thing for children. I am vaccinated against covid but I did it so my children wouldn’t have to have it. Noway enough time to look at all the long term effects.

@NicoleKidmanSuperFan I'm not sure why you would take them out of school, you will be able to say no, as adults have.

I would take them out of school if there was a sharp rise of infections again. I'd do that so they would have less exposure so they could try to avoid catching covid as we still don't know the long term. If the vaccine was the only option other than staying home then I'd keep them home.

I'd rather have a wait and see approach with the children vaccines. If you all want to give your kids as a trial go ahead.

Mass vaccinations at school happen all the time. I remember getting my rubella vaccination at school. Now it's flu and HPV.

Taking your kid out of school to avoid it would be a bit excessive, we don't surprise-jab them, we do need consent!

@Lupinhere37, I'm so sorry your daughter has had such a rough go with covid. If she hasn't been vaccinated, speak to your GP about getting it done. That's helped a lot of people with lingering symptoms. A lot of people don't realize how wildly unpredictable it is and how it can present very, very differently in different people. This article is enlightening.

How does coronavirus kill? Clinicians trace a ferocious rampage through the body, from brain to toes

As to the dismissive or sneery comments, I think that most people who participate in a thread like this are just properly cautious about the decision to vaccinate their kids and are looking for information. I also think that there are some who have an almost ideological opposition to vaccination in general, so they trivialize the risks of vaccine-preventable diseases. I see some people who don't think we should vaccinate for measles as they think it's just a minor illness. Most of the time it is, but severe cases can cause permanent disability. I have a 30% loss of hearing from a childhood case of measles. I struggled in school for years because of that and still have to wear hearing aids in some situations.

And some people minimize the risk of covid in their minds because being in a pandemic is a frightening experience. When I was caring for covid patients I had family members of patients demand to know why their relatively young, healthy family member was so ill. I was told, sometimes shouted at, that it couldn't be covid because covid was just the flu or only affected the elderly. People can get goady if you challenge something they really want to believe.

That's an interesting article MissConduct, however it seems to be mainly about adults, and talks of 50 year olds, 70 year olds, etc, and "Mangalmurti says she has been shocked by the fact that we don't have a huge number of asthmatics or patients with other respiratory diseases in HUP's ICU. "It's very striking to us that risk factors seem to be vascular; diabetes, obesity, age, hypertension".

These are not generally things I associate with little kids into their mid teens or so.

I suppose I have the opportunity to wait a bit if I think it's all a bit to quick with the childhood vaccination - mine are 11 and 13 and I'm just not seeing enough data at this point that convinces me that the risks of covid are worse or even equal to the risks of vaccine in order to do a risk benefit analysis, and that's as much to do with the lack of data for the vaccine at this point which will continue to change over time.

As I said before I posted the link, the article simply illustrates the wide variety of pathologies covid can cause. I never implied that it was primarily about pediatric risks. Another article I posted a link to up thread was more focused on the risk to children.

It's a moot point currently for people in the UK, as you are probably two to three months away from having the option to vaccinate those under 16. I agree that keeping an eye on the data in the interim is a good idea.

Sure MissConduct, sorry I was not trying to put words in your mouth there, I really appreciated the article because I need reminding myself from time to time how it can be serious. I'll keep an eye out for that data and in the meantime I'm getting myself vaccinated on Wednesday 👍🏻

Our local high school just announced two vaccination clinics in school for 12-18 year olds later this month and early next month, on the assumption that the Pfizer will be approved soon.

All of my teens have had a Covid shot this week (one first shot, two second shots). So far we've had two sore arms and one is waiting to see if she gets any side effects at all. DD2 was quite disappointed not to get any after effects and to have to go to school today after all.

Those of you planning to bring your children to the US for holidays - will you get them vaccinated if required? I suspect it might be a requirement next year once the vaccine is approved for those age ranges.

@ZZTopGuitarSolo

Our local high school just announced two vaccination clinics in school for 12-18 year olds later this month and early next month, on the assumption that the Pfizer will be approved soon.

All of my teens have had a Covid shot this week (one first shot, two second shots). So far we've had two sore arms and one is waiting to see if she gets any side effects at all. DD2 was quite disappointed not to get any after effects and to have to go to school today after all.

Tell her she may get lucky next time. Typically teenager then 😂

@MissConductUS

ZZtop, how old is your DD? If she's graduating this spring she must be very excited. My DD had to have a graduation by time slot appointment last year, which was better than nothing but not great. She then had to do her first semester of uni from her bedroom at home but was able to move to campus in January. Now she has an internship in the neurobiology lab that will keep her there over the summer.

People on MN often forget that not everyone posting here is in the UK. Some of us are even actual Yanks.

Yes she's graduating a month today! It's going to be outdoors (as always) but in a bigger space than usual. She's really excited to be able to go to university in person at the end of August.

DD1 is at another university in Chicago and she is really keen for things to get back to normal there. She's got her second shot today in preparation.

That's great news ZZtop. We have one jab left to go before the whole Conduct family is fully vaccinated. Neither of my kids has had more than a sore arm from it.

It's a bit weird when they start moving out, innit?

@MissConductUS thanks so much for the article; that’s interesting. I agree with your comments as well, especially about those trivialising dangers of vaccine preventable disease.
What frustrates me most are the people who are waiting to see what the data shows. That relies on crazy, mad people sacrificing their children as lab rats apparently.
Well if absolutely everyone took the watch and wait approach, we’d never move on and kids will be mask wearing, self isolating and bombing out of school for a long time to come.
I don’t have the answers and I respect the right not to vaccinate. I just expect respect in return. People are very judgemental though

I see what you are saying Luphinhere37 about lab rats. I was called one when I was in a phase 3 trial of Novavax, many times over. Also the UK were called them by Australians when our vaccine rollout was faster than theirs. But it is sort of true. For me, having a vaccine is a no-brainer (but hopefully not a blocked brainer!) but I feel that I need evidence, proper evidence of the risk benefit analysis for my children's age group.

It's starting to exist for middle agers - "chance of this that or that from covid this percent vs vaccine this percent with context of everyday risk (car accident? Adverse reaction to eyelash glue? This percent"

I can't find adequate for children vs vaccine that doesn't involve "protect your grandma who is already protected".

Happy to be educated, always! With the best will and wishes.

I volunteered for the clinical trials here but was never called because there were hotter hot spots at the time. Healthcare workers were the first group to receive the vaccines after EUA so I guess we were the vanguard of the lab rats. Most were thrilled to get it early.

But it's different when you're making the same decision on behalf of your children. I truly understand that.