Alternatives to AstraZeneca vaccine for under 40s “could be considered” amid rise in blood clots

[Whichjab]

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/astrazeneca-vaccine-side-effects-blood-clots-under-40-b931498.html

This is concerning, especially as there is limited research into combining vaccinations. I feel that the trust in vaccination is being eroded. I have always been pro vacc but feeling much less so atm.
I'm not sure I will get my second jab now.

I’ve had both AZ jabs. I’m not worried. I’m 37

My son's friend with severe asthma would disagree with you.

And healthy young people will benefit from the vaccination program - lockdown will end, they can go back to school and college, play sports, travel, see the world, hang out with mates, got to clubs and parties and generally enjoy being young people - massive benefit to them and their mental health.

@bumbleymummy

Additionally, some young people (perhaps not you) have older friends and relatives who they care about.

Older friends and relatives who have already been vaccinated themselves?

You're quoting me out of context. An accident, I'm sure.

I was replying to a post suggesting younger people are only being vaccinated for the benefit of older groups. Clearly you agree with me that it's not the case - because, like you say, older groups have already been done.

Less rotten than peddling cheap ones that kill.

How are hyperbolic statements like this helpful, or accurate, in any way? The AZ vaccine has undoubtedly saved far more lives than it has taken. We have clear data, people should do what they feel is best for them personally- I won't judge someone that doesn't want to be vaccinated but they shouldn't expect the nhs to bend over backwards to offer an alternative. I'm 33 and had AZ yesterday. Not worried about blood clots in the slightest, I'm more likely to die if I drove to the supermarket this afternoon. Asides from feeling a bit shivery and achey overnight I've been fine. I feel very fortunate to live somewhere with an effective, safe vaccine programme that has worked incredibly well so far.

Surely a British manufacturer producing vaccines that kill

"vaccines that kill"?

FFS aren't you embarrassed to be writing this shyte?

You mean a vaccine which is extremely safe and effective and is the main reason Britain is now returning to normal? You're making it sound as though AZ came up with some sort of poisonous drug they sneaked onto the market.

We as a global village have safer vaccines...just step aside and let Pfizer, Moderna and other companies supply them to the world, convert the AZ factories to making Pfizer jabs.

We aren't a 'global village'. What trite nonsense. There ae 7 billion people in the world and nowhere near enough vaccines of any brand to go around. As for simply converting 'AZ factories to making Pfizer jabs', do you live in the real world?

Yes, let’s just supply mRNA vaccines to the rest of our ‘global village’ - when they have no way of purchasing them (they’re expensive) or storing them at the required temperatures. Until then, who cares how many people in India die from coronavirus. They cannot have this bad, bad vaccine! No no.

FYI I have family in India who cannot get a second AZ vaccine for love nor money, and they are absolutely desperate. The paternalism here is astounding.

Unfortunately the entitled who want decades of research into a vaccine into a new disease will have to de-rust their brains. All about relative risks and being able to understand maths - probably no chance for many. You do realise what covid can do to you without killing you?

No one is being coerced. Vaccination is voluntary.

Vaccines do not kill.

Sorry. I was actually trying to report a seriously dumbfuck post there, but on reflection four words do the same thing.

@murbblurb

Vaccines do not kill.

Um...they do, its been proven. Blood clots which have only occurred due to being vaccinated. Saying they don't kill is the same as the American gun lobby saying guns don't kill.

They haven't got to that age group yet in my area (scotland) - I'm 47 and not had my first

They are doing that age group in Scotland. My sister had hers yesterday (up north) and others in my area in south Scotland have been called for theirs too.

Um...they do, its been proven. Blood clots which have only occurred due to being vaccinated. Saying they don't kill is the same as the American gun lobby saying guns don't kill.

Um....they haven’t proven anything, and looking at the numbers they likely won’t.

It does fuck me off when people say 'ageism alive and well' when people question the policy of vaccinating people who are statistically unlikely to have complications from covid in order to protect the old or unwell. Why should the desire to protect the old and unwell trump a young person's desire to protect themselves?

Saying they don't kill is the same as the American gun lobby saying guns don't kill.

Pretty crap gun if it only manages to kill about 1 in every 10s if not 100s of thousands of people shot by it.

Dumb analogy.

Um...they do, its been proven. Blood clots which have only occurred due to being vaccinated. Saying they don't kill is the same as the American gun lobby saying guns don't kill.

How do you not yet understand that the diseases vaccines prevent kill far greater numbers of people? The number of people dying as a result of the AZ vaccine and blood clots are minuscule.

@Whichjab were you so concerned with all the other vaccines you've had throughout your life? I hope you never take paracetamol/ibuprofen if you have a headache.

@Whichjab

It does fuck me off when people say 'ageism alive and well' when people question the policy of vaccinating people who are statistically unlikely to have complications from covid in order to protect the old or unwell. Why should the desire to protect the old and unwell trump a young person's desire to protect themselves?

I'm statistically unlikely to have complications from coronavirus. I'm only 33, young, slim, healthy. Not much older than the age group who will be given a choice of vaccine. I'm still glad to have had the AZ vaccine yesterday.

By all means, no one should be coerced into having the vaccine. If people don't want AZ fine. Remind yourself of your privilege to be living in a country like the UK, and not India or Brazil, and go to the back of the queue to wait for Pfizer/Moderna.

@Whichjab - why do you find it so hard to comprehend that you are protecting the whole of society, young and old, and its healthcare systems if you vaccinate the young, too? By your logic, we should all be sitting back now already in the UK, congratulating ourselves that the most vulnerable are already protected and we can all now go back to “normal.” Except it doesn’t work like that. You could see young people getting vaccinated more as saving their jobs, or ensuring there is space in our hospitals for younger people who happen to fall ill with something other than covid 19 if it helps. Thinking a vaccination is about protecting yourself alone is just ignorant thinking. Vaccinations don’t work unless enough people have them - look at measles and mumps as examples.

I also meant to say that as someone who still considers themself 'young', I had the vaccine primarily for my own health and not in order to protect the rest of society- although as my children are young and not able to be vaccinated I hope that me being vaccinated reduces their chances of catching coronavirus.

I had the vaccine for my own health- because I am still more likely to die from coronavirus than any of the vaccines, because I don't want long COVID and potential organ damage, and because I want life back to normal ASAP. I don't care if I'm called selfish for my reasons- I just wanted to make the point that I think there are many reasons for young people to be vaccinated for their own health and not just for the good of society.

@MintyMabel

Um...they do, its been proven. Blood clots which have only occurred due to being vaccinated. Saying they don't kill is the same as the American gun lobby saying guns don't kill.

Um....they haven’t proven anything, and looking at the numbers they likely won’t.

Er, yes they have proven it. Why else would the WHO require that a waning label be added to the AZ vaccine of this REAL risk of a fatal blood clot? We can argue all day if the benefits outweigh the risks on individual, or on national and international population levels, can argue all day about supply and logistics and whether the money saved is worth extra dead bodies, but you cannot deny the fact that the AZ vaccine has in fact a higher death rate due to fatal side effects than the other Covid vaccines have.

go to the back of the queue to wait for Pfizer/Moderna

At this point I may well consider doing that if I knew it's an option. Would also happily pay for a vaccine if that was an option. We are not really being told what the options are though, and if waiting longer means an alternative to AZ will be available.

It's hardly entitled to wonder about it when scientists in the MHRA are themselves considering the options and already said it shouldn't be given to under 30s. By doing that they are clearly admitting there is a risk.

@User657849 this is good news and shows that greater transparency IS the way forward (along with giving people a choice) - if symptoms can be spotted early enough, lives can be saved.

@Walkaround Vaccinations don’t work unless enough people have them

Yes, they do. They provide individual protection against serious illness/death. We are already seeing them work in reducing hospitalisations and deaths in the more vulnerable groups who were prioritised for vaccines. Young people do not need to be vaccinated to protect groups that have already been vaccinated themselves.

@PlanDeRaccordement - we also cannot deny that there is a global shortage of vaccines; that vaccines requiring complicated arrangements for appropriate storage cannot be delivered as quickly, nor can they be delivered everywhere; and that the slower the rollout of vaccines, the greater the chances of dangerous mutations cropping up before any semblance of control over the spread has been regained, and people continuing to be trapped in lives where close contact with others is not permitted. There is no entirely palatable way out of this global mess. I would say continuing to offer the currently available vaccines, including AZ, to the UK population now is the most palatable option at the moment. Slowing everything down while we wait in the queue for more Pfizer and Moderna vaccines and play silly games with the EU, US and India over imports and exports, is not in our interests.

@bumbleymummy - except no vaccine provides 100% protection for everyone vaccinated from anything, whether serious illness, death or mild illness, so actually you are wrong, you still need critical mass, particularly when length of immunity is uncertain.