Anyone feeling increasingly anxious about Pfizer?

[Doireallyneedaname]

With all the news re the AZ & J&J vaccines I can’t help but feel a sense of dread when checking the news.

I am starting to think it’s only a matter of time until something horrific comes out about the Pfizer vaccine (which I had)

What a strange time to be alive. Sometimes I still can’t believe this is all happening.

My parents didn't want AZ because blood clots and Pfizer because brain bleeds: they ended up having Moderna.

Is moderna not much the same as pfizer and likely to have the same issues?

I just want my offer of any vaccine sent to me (scotland, so we get a letter invite rather than able to book online)

There is an excellent article in private eye this week about the vaccine. It said of the 4.4 million people who've had covid, and they if they'd been vaccinated 5 would have died from a blood clot. Instead 128'000+ are dead.
Those that have been hospitalised with covid, 1 in 4 had a blood clot.

I know which chance I'd take.

I haven’t read that article but clearly mostly older people have died from Covid. The specific clot issue seems to mainly affect younger people and possibly younger women more. No one knows at the moment but this is why most other countries take a cautious approach now. It’s an ethical dilemma. Do you sacrifice the few to save the many? Do you sacrifice the young to save the old? It’s not straight forward at all and I don’t understand why the U.K. refuse this debate.

I think the UK is treating citizens appallingly re the AZ vaccine -
there are other vaccines available that don't have such a clear link to blood clots (i.e. Pfizer, Moderna) but they aren't offering people a choice (unless you are under 30 - a somewhat arbitrary figure given that the people who have died from clots were all under 63). I will not be taking AZ. I will wait to get moderna or pfizer.

@TroubleUsedToBeMyBusiness

I think the UK is treating citizens appallingly re the AZ vaccine - there are other vaccines available that don't have such a clear link to blood clots (i.e. Pfizer, Moderna) but they aren't offering people a choice (unless you are under 30 - a somewhat arbitrary figure given that the people who have died from clots were all under 63). I will not be taking AZ. I will wait to get moderna or pfizer.

Waiting doesn’t help me, I’d prefer AZ now and I’m glad I am getting it this week.

How old are you out of interest? Are you up for a vaccine now in any case

@TroubleUsedToBeMyBusiness

I think the UK is treating citizens appallingly re the AZ vaccine - there are other vaccines available that don't have such a clear link to blood clots (i.e. Pfizer, Moderna) but they aren't offering people a choice (unless you are under 30 - a somewhat arbitrary figure given that the people who have died from clots were all under 63). I will not be taking AZ. I will wait to get moderna or pfizer.

I think the UK has made the right decision re: AZ on the basis of the current available evidence.

Every country is struggling with the vaccine issue and implementing policies which are opposite to what is happening elsewhere. For example, France is going to use J&J, which has been paused in the US. Germany is going to mix vaccines for the second dose in people who have had one dose of AZ, which the WHO does not recommend (and this approach is still in trials in the UK).

I've had AZ and happy to get the second dose.

I'm not even worried about the other two. Let alone Pfizer.

Do you sacrifice the few to save the many?

I think using emotive language like "sacrifice" is not helpful. All medicines have the potential to be deadly. Aspirin and other anti-platelet drugs kill about 3000 people a year. Are they being "sacrificed" so that others can take those drugs?

@TroubleUsedToBeMyBusiness

I think the UK is treating citizens appallingly re the AZ vaccine - there are other vaccines available that don't have such a clear link to blood clots (i.e. Pfizer, Moderna) but they aren't offering people a choice (unless you are under 30 - a somewhat arbitrary figure given that the people who have died from clots were all under 63). I will not be taking AZ. I will wait to get moderna or pfizer.

You've found a clear link, have you? You should probably pass that on to the authorities, because nobody else has.

I think using emotive language like "sacrifice" is not helpful.

Except when it's the most accurate language for what you are trying to describe.

Aspirin and other anti-platelet drugs kill about 3000 people a year. Are they being "sacrificed" so that others can take those drugs?

Nonsense comparison. There is no national programme to give aspirin to all adults.

And for the record: accusing others of using emotive language is a cheap shot that tries to pit your own view as 'rational' or 'scientific' against an 'irrational', 'emotional', 'emotive' (and hence inferior) interlocutor. Something, for example, that (mostly male) scientists have done for a long time when questioned or challenged by those of the opposite sex ('you're just being hysterical').

I just saw that Canada is reported to now be saying it is not going to restrict AZ after a review showed the benefits outweighed the very rare risk of blood clots.

I know so many who have suffered pretty severe side effects to these vaccines. No way will I take the risk.

@Sadsiblingatsea

I know so many who have suffered pretty severe side effects to these vaccines. No way will I take the risk.

I'm sure getting Covid will be much more fun.

@Sadsiblingatsea

I know so many who have suffered pretty severe side effects to these vaccines. No way will I take the risk.

How old are you?

@Sadsiblingatsea

I know so many who have suffered pretty severe side effects to these vaccines. No way will I take the risk.

I have had colleagues in bed with flu like symptoms and too unwell to work. I'm in my thirties and I was nowhere near that unwell with Covid.

Here's the latest vaccine victim; no matter what excuses and denials they roll out, it seems the vaccine created a high temperature spike that gave him a seizure and he died (NO prior history of seizures) -

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9469529/Mother-demands-answers-son-20-died-12-hours-receiving-Pfizer-jab.html

In the article, what makes me angry is the line: "'The current evidence does not indicate an association between the Covid-19 vaccines and onset of seizure events in people with or without a prior history of seizure" because when I look at the yellow-card reports, I see on page 46 a total of 159 seizures and a number of other seizure kind of events so in that article, they are concealing the truth that seizures are happening shortly after the jabs.

Maybe they have not proved a connection, but when it happens within hours or days of the vaccine then I say they are deliberately trying to deny a truth that is staring us in the face. Some of the most vulnerable people, that the vaccine was meant to prevent dying from covid, are dying from the vaccine.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/977005/COVID-19_mRNA_Pfizer-_BioNTech_Vaccine_Analysis_Print.pdf

Maybe he had an underlying health condition

I see on page 46 a total of 159 seizures and a number of other seizure kind of events so in that article, they are concealing the truth that seizures are happening shortly after the jabs

Each and every one of those seizures might have happened anyway. There is no proven causal link.

And if "printing it on page 46" is 'concealing' it, they're not doing a very good job are they!

@SmallTownSouthernGirl Wow, that’s awful. Obviously as you say right now we don’t know if it’s the vaccine that caused it, but Jesus..

I wonder if the heart meds had anything to do with it.

I see on page 46 a total of 159 seizures and a number of other seizure kind of events so in that article, they are concealing the truth that seizures are happening shortly after the jabs

But when you are vaccinating millions of people in a short space of time, some will inevitably become ill for reasons that may have nothing to do with the vaccine. In the case of seizures:

One in 20 people will have a one-off epileptic seizure at some point in their life (although this does not necessarily mean that they have epilepsy).

One in 50 people will have epilepsy at some time in their life (not everyone with epilepsy will have it for life).

Around 87 people are diagnosed with epilepsy every day.

epilepsysociety.org.uk/about-epilepsy/what-epilepsy/epilepsy-facts-and-myths

At least none of the seizures reported resulted in death.

It's not just that he had a seizure, it's the fact that he had never before had a seizure, and it happened 12 hours after the vaccine. No wonder his poor Mum is demanding answers.

And I was pointing out the obvious discrepancy between the statement to the media, and the actual reported cases of 159+ seizures following the vaccine on the yellow-card system. It seems transparency is only adhered to when it's a document tucked away on a government website where few people will search it out.

@SmallTownSouthernGirl

It's not just that he had a seizure, it's the fact that he had never before had a seizure, and it happened 12 hours after the vaccine. No wonder his poor Mum is demanding answers.

And I was pointing out the obvious discrepancy between the statement to the media, and the actual reported cases of 159+ seizures following the vaccine on the yellow-card system. It seems transparency is only adhered to when it's a document tucked away on a government website where few people will search it out.

What would your plan be for next year or so?

If you are concerned about vaccines

@SmallTownSouthernGirl

It's not just that he had a seizure, it's the fact that he had never before had a seizure, and it happened 12 hours after the vaccine. No wonder his poor Mum is demanding answers.

And I was pointing out the obvious discrepancy between the statement to the media, and the actual reported cases of 159+ seizures following the vaccine on the yellow-card system. It seems transparency is only adhered to when it's a document tucked away on a government website where few people will search it out.

People have first-time seizures all the time. Nobody has managed to prove a causal link with the vaccine yet. And, statistically, no more people have had first-time seizures after the vaccine than in the normal general populace.