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Covid

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Anyone feeling increasingly anxious about Pfizer?

261 replies

Doireallyneedaname · 13/04/2021 17:55

With all the news re the AZ & J&J vaccines I can’t help but feel a sense of dread when checking the news.

I am starting to think it’s only a matter of time until something horrific comes out about the Pfizer vaccine (which I had)

What a strange time to be alive. Sometimes I still can’t believe this is all happening.

OP posts:
HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 13/04/2021 21:24

Why do people keep using the getting in a car risk. It's not the same. Most of us Have to use our cars probably daily for us to function. We don't have to take the vaccine.

The level of risk of death is higher from getting in a car than the vaccine. The reason for getting in the car is irrelevant.

No one is being forced to have the vaccine.

Terracotta9 · 13/04/2021 21:24

Re Shielding the vulnerable

That’s exactly what happened during summer, when the vulnerable continued to shield and the rest of us got on with it

MrsTerryPratchett · 13/04/2021 21:26

@Terracotta9

Re Shielding the vulnerable

That’s exactly what happened during summer, when the vulnerable continued to shield and the rest of us got on with it

Didn't actually answer the question.
Chloemol · 13/04/2021 21:27

There are already issues with Pfizer, people have had blood clots with it

But it’s like any vaccine or medication, different people are affected in different ways

You have had your first with no issues so stop worrying

Terracotta9 · 13/04/2021 21:30

Didn't actually answer the question.

What question?

We DID continue to shield the vulnerable while the rest of us emerged from lockdown in the summer.

saraclara · 13/04/2021 21:50

Jeeze, this pandemic really has messed with people's heads, hasn't it?

Risk perception is all over the place. I despair.

pinkearedcow · 13/04/2021 22:14

It’s not a choice between VACCINE or LOCKDOWN. We do have an immune system, you know. How do you think humanity survived pandemics in the past, before vaccines?

Do you think if vaccines were available for the Spanish Flu, people would have gone "na, we're OK, ta. We'll stick with 228,000 deaths in the UK and 50 million worldwide?"

Circumlocutious · 13/04/2021 22:19

How do you think humanity survived pandemics in the past, before vaccines?

What a grim mindset.

How do you think women gave birth before the advent of modern obstetrics? They just cracked on with it didn’t they.

🙂

MarshaBradyo · 13/04/2021 22:20

@Circumlocutious

How do you think humanity survived pandemics in the past, before vaccines?

What a grim mindset.

How do you think women gave birth before the advent of modern obstetrics? They just cracked on with it didn’t they.

🙂

Exactly we’re still here so you could say that about anything even if more barbaric or painful
Blessex · 13/04/2021 22:21

The friend of my ex DH is in intensive care with Covid age 50. Am I or he worried to be vaccinated tomorrow against this. Errrr no.

TheThingsWeAdmitOnMN · 13/04/2021 22:21

@Terracotta9

Did you read the bit about shielding the vulnerable?

Covid only has a significant mortality/complication rate for those who are old and/or have other health issues.

Did you pay ANY attention to the basic facts why this was A BAD idea?

Seemingly not. Try looking up what valance & Whitty said.

Happyface120 · 13/04/2021 22:23

Absolutely not at all: I took the pill for years, have had elective surgery, ski, horse ride, mountain bike, drive, cross roads etc... All of which are far more risky than the vaccines

FascinatingCarrot · 13/04/2021 22:27

@Doireallyneedaname

Right, let’s just clarify straight up that the clots with the vaccines are not “just clots” Hmm I’m so fed up of hearing that.

They’re potentially FATAL brain clots which are extremely dangerous and unusual in younger people normally.

And I am so fucking sick of the whining mardarse should I/ shouldnt I have the first/second dose of every single vaccine. Lets just clarify, its YOUR choice. At least we have one.

Dont have it. Simple. Do have it, simple.

Terracotta9 · 13/04/2021 22:31

Why can’t any of you discuss this with any nuance?

Someone claimed that we have a choice between vaccines and lockdown forever, and I pointed out that no, actually, it’s not a binary choice and there are other ways of dealing with a pandemic.

That’s it. That’s all I said.

No need for all the hyperbole about “mass graves” and the like.

getyourfreakon · 13/04/2021 22:33

I had Pfizer first dose almost 7 weeks ago. No issues at all. I've been taking the pill for years. Not worried about it and looking forward to second dose.

Motorina · 13/04/2021 22:43

@Terracotta9 what you said was:

How do you think humanity survived pandemics in the past, before vaccines?

That’s literally been the typical pandemic response since time immemorial.

And people have pointed out that, whilst in the past the species survived pandemics, individuals generally faired badly. Yes, mass graves. Yes, statistics like "killed 30% of the population".

If you're going to use the argument of history to say we should not lockdown or vaccinate because, in your own words, this is "unprecedented" then you also need to accept that the lesson history teaches us is that allowing a pandemic to rip through the population is typically a very very bad thing.

You're quite right, it's not a binary choice between lockdown and vaccines. It's a threeway choice. Lockdowns. Or vaccines. Or accepting a very substantially higher fatality rate than the already grim deathtoll to date.

hodgebit · 13/04/2021 22:48

@Terracotta9

Re Shielding the vulnerable

That’s exactly what happened during summer, when the vulnerable continued to shield and the rest of us got on with it

But we could only do that for a few months before exponential growth took hold again.... Even in the summer, things were far from normal. Had we tried to go back completely to normal, it seems reasonable to assume we'd have had more critical infection levels far earlier.
hodgebit · 13/04/2021 22:53

Right, let’s just clarify straight up that the clots with the vaccines are not “just clots” I’m so fed up of hearing that. They’re potentially FATAL brain clots which are extremely dangerous and unusual in younger people normally.

And an extremely rare side-effect of a vaccine!

Do you normally let 1:1,000,000 chances of death impinge on your daily life? If so, I hope you don't drive or climb down stairs.

ImAlrightThanx · 13/04/2021 23:11

@Terracotta9

Did you read the bit about shielding the vulnerable?

Covid only has a significant mortality/complication rate for those who are old and/or have other health issues.

You do realise that "the vulnerable" are quite a large portion of society? Many need care or support in some form. Many have kids in school, need to attend multiple appointments, have jobs, families, need some company now and again. It's impossible to 100% shield for many people.
EnidSpyton · 13/04/2021 23:17

The public messaging surrounding coronavirus in general and then also the vaccine rollout are a huge part of the reason why having a nuanced discussion about people's choices regarding the vaccine is so difficult.

I use the term force-feeding because we have been effectively force fed a diet of fear and paranoia for the past year, far out of proportion to the risk coronavirus presents to the vast majority of the population. There are 66 million + people who live in this country. Approx 120k people have died from coronavirus. Less than 1% of the population. I'm not negating the individual tragedies behind these deaths, but statistically, this is a tiny number.

However, on Mumsnet, the answer to anything remotely critical concerning coronavirus, is 'well I'm sure you'd rather X than being on a ventilator'. Which is a nonsensical statement to make, because a TINY proportion of people who catch coronavirus end up on ventilators. Only a very small percentage of people who catch coronavirus even end up in hospital at all, and most of those don't end up on ventilators! A third of people who catch coronavirus don't even get symptoms, for goodness' sake!

And yet a huge number of people seem to have convinced themselves that coronavirus is a deadly disease, and if they catch it they will certainly die, or end up on a ventilator fighting for their lives. This is simply, statistically, not true. But because of constant fearmongering and disproportionate media reporting of worst case scenarios and uncontextualised statistics, many people whose personal risk of a bad outcome having caught coronavirus is tiny have been reduced to a state of such fear that they would do anything to avoid catching it. Including unquestioningly consenting to giving up their daily freedoms and now being injected with a novel vaccine that many people don't actually need.

And when anyone does say anything on here suggesting that the vaccine might not be 100% suitable for everyone, the pile on begins. It's this kind of forceful, bullying, belittling, one sidedness of the issue that equates to force feeding. If you question the vaccine, you're told you're stupid, you're ignorant, you're selfish, etc. That makes people feel like they have no other choice but to have it. You don't need to be physically dragged into a vaccine centre to be there unwillingly. Coercion can be emotional just as much as physical.

Making a choice about medication is a personal one based on your own medical history and your own risk factors. The vaccine isn't essential for everyone and it's not right for everyone. It is not the one and only solution to ending the pandemic and not everyone needs to have the vaccine in order for herd immunity to be achieved. If you are young and healthy, the choice to have the vaccine is not the no brainer it might be for someone older and unhealthier. Everyone should read the evidence available and work out what's best for them considering their circumstances. And no one should be shamed, belittled or bullied into getting medical treatment they personally feel isn't right for them. Why people on this thread feel the need to criticise and shame other people for holding a different view to them, I don't understand. If you have had the vaccine, or plan on getting the vaccine, and you're happy with that decision and feel it's right for you, then great. There's no need for you to justify your decision by belittling those who don't feel the same way as you.

fiendfyre · 13/04/2021 23:28

@EnidSpyton

The public messaging surrounding coronavirus in general and then also the vaccine rollout are a huge part of the reason why having a nuanced discussion about people's choices regarding the vaccine is so difficult.

I use the term force-feeding because we have been effectively force fed a diet of fear and paranoia for the past year, far out of proportion to the risk coronavirus presents to the vast majority of the population. There are 66 million + people who live in this country. Approx 120k people have died from coronavirus. Less than 1% of the population. I'm not negating the individual tragedies behind these deaths, but statistically, this is a tiny number.

However, on Mumsnet, the answer to anything remotely critical concerning coronavirus, is 'well I'm sure you'd rather X than being on a ventilator'. Which is a nonsensical statement to make, because a TINY proportion of people who catch coronavirus end up on ventilators. Only a very small percentage of people who catch coronavirus even end up in hospital at all, and most of those don't end up on ventilators! A third of people who catch coronavirus don't even get symptoms, for goodness' sake!

And yet a huge number of people seem to have convinced themselves that coronavirus is a deadly disease, and if they catch it they will certainly die, or end up on a ventilator fighting for their lives. This is simply, statistically, not true. But because of constant fearmongering and disproportionate media reporting of worst case scenarios and uncontextualised statistics, many people whose personal risk of a bad outcome having caught coronavirus is tiny have been reduced to a state of such fear that they would do anything to avoid catching it. Including unquestioningly consenting to giving up their daily freedoms and now being injected with a novel vaccine that many people don't actually need.

And when anyone does say anything on here suggesting that the vaccine might not be 100% suitable for everyone, the pile on begins. It's this kind of forceful, bullying, belittling, one sidedness of the issue that equates to force feeding. If you question the vaccine, you're told you're stupid, you're ignorant, you're selfish, etc. That makes people feel like they have no other choice but to have it. You don't need to be physically dragged into a vaccine centre to be there unwillingly. Coercion can be emotional just as much as physical.

Making a choice about medication is a personal one based on your own medical history and your own risk factors. The vaccine isn't essential for everyone and it's not right for everyone. It is not the one and only solution to ending the pandemic and not everyone needs to have the vaccine in order for herd immunity to be achieved. If you are young and healthy, the choice to have the vaccine is not the no brainer it might be for someone older and unhealthier. Everyone should read the evidence available and work out what's best for them considering their circumstances. And no one should be shamed, belittled or bullied into getting medical treatment they personally feel isn't right for them. Why people on this thread feel the need to criticise and shame other people for holding a different view to them, I don't understand. If you have had the vaccine, or plan on getting the vaccine, and you're happy with that decision and feel it's right for you, then great. There's no need for you to justify your decision by belittling those who don't feel the same way as you.

Damn right. Well said.
StarCat2020 · 14/04/2021 00:44

I got something called Stevens-Johnson Syndrome from an extremely common antibiotic.

My skin peeled off in sheets to reveal burn-like patches.

It seems that I am actually really special as so few people have ever had this reaction to it.

Similar to the number of people who got these blood clots in relation to doses given.

StarCat2020 · 14/04/2021 00:50

And yet a huge number of people seem to have convinced themselves that coronavirus is a deadly disease, and if they catch it they will certainly die, or end up on a ventilator fighting for their lives. This is simply, statistically, not true
Bit ironic as the same could be said of the blood clots

CovoidOfAllHumanity · 14/04/2021 01:02

Yes it's a tiny risk of a bad outcome from Covid as a healthy person in your 40s say but an even tinier risk of a bad outcome from the vaccine.

The risk of COVID outweighs that of the vaccine by hundreds of times (according to WHO, MHRA, EMA and even the scientist who first found the link) but you'd never believe it from what's posted on here. You'd think it's somehow an equivalent risk and it really isn't.

OliverBabish · 14/04/2021 01:06

@EnidSpyton brilliant post.

The lack of compassion on these posts lately has been really sad to see. People with anxiety generally don’t respond well to statistics (“someone has to be the 1 in X”), being belittled (it’s just pointless, they are already feeling like shit) and comparisons (“hope you don’t drive anywhere then!” Because they aren’t worrying about being in a fucking car, they are worrying about something else). Anxiety isn’t a logical thing.

Either show compassion and find ways to have a compassionate conversation or just scroll on by.