MHRA may change advice for young people receiving AZ vaccine

[IloveSooty424]

I just saw this news story on Channel 4 news tonight.

www.channel4.com/news/uk-medicines-regulator-considers-issuing-new-advice-over-oxford-astrazeneca-jab

It seems the MHRA may follow other European countries and Canada and advise that younger people should not receive the AZ vaccine. It seems the decision will be made imminently in the coming days.

I’m due to book my vaccine this week and don’t know whether to wait and see how this plays out. I’m 42. I’m also concerned that if younger people will only be offered the Pfizer vaccine it will slow down the vaccine programme substantially.

Any thoughts?

Oh, and if my DH who is still waiting on the vaccine gets Covid in the meantime, I will hold anybody who is attending appointments and not having the jab (thereby denying an opportunity to someone else who could have had it) personally responsible.

Some of the clots in the Covid patients though will be situational.... immobility for periods of time. I don't think they have data to identify a link to the disease versus the outcome of the treatment protocol.

The vaccine is different though as it's a direct link to receiving it.

I think it should be specified at the time of booking an appointment what vaccine you'll be getting, so you can either accept or decline. When you're prescribed a medicine you can read a leaflet and decide if you're ok with taking it or not. Why is it different with the vaccine? Also government knows that under 30s are less likely to get vaccinated, so they're trying to incentives them by offering choice. What's wrong with that?

But you would not refuse medication on the very low incidences of blood clots being discussed. In fact most people are so desperate to get medication they will accept all sorts of side effects. So you should not refuse a vaccination. My DDs aged 25 and 28 have had AZ. There was no choice.

I heard a lady the other day talking about her brother in his 50s who died of blood clot after AZ vaccination. She urged people to have the vaccination but there were no findings regarding an autopsy yet. Jusdt the doctors thinking very strongly that there was a link. No doubt they had read about it but how could they possible know without detailed medical investigation? They could be correct, but they might not be.

Taking the pill has higher incidences of blood clots.

@PresentingPercy, this is not the type of blood clot you typically get from the pill or a long haul flight.

[quote PandoraP]@PresentingPercy, this is not the type of blood clot you typically get from the pill or a long haul flight.[/quote]
it's just another type of risk

A major difference is your gp talks through your risk based on various factors. It's not a case of heres the pill cross your fingers and hope for the best. Due to risk factors I never went on the pill and alternatives were used.

Last year they wanted me to start something new. I was sent details where to look at the patient leaflet. The meds risks far outweighed any potential benefits I declined. Gp agreed. Had I said sod it give it to me it would be prescribed.

I've had horrific side effects from various meds and injections over my life. Not on gp or consultation has said stop being ridiculous and take the damn thing. Or applied pressure to have the flu vaccine because flu kills including potentially me.

Yet random think they have the right to tell others to go and have the damn thing without knowing any medical history.

And now we have people who will hold others responsible if their partner dies because some will walk out of the centre's without the vax. Would you hold the person responsible for having emergency surgery thus delaying yours? See how ridiculous this sounds?

@PresentingPercy
If there was anything about medication that I was not comfortable with I would go back to the GP and requested a change. And you're right that people desperate about life-saving medicine wouldn't mind few side effects. BUT it isn't a case with covid vaccine and young people. They aren't desperate, they only get vaccinated for 'greater good'. Also, you said that your daughters didn't have a choice, well there will be one now and I think it might help some people to decide to get vaccine after all.
And no one asks women to take the pill for others' benefit, they do it for themselves, so it's completely different argument.

@EasterIssland, I don’t agree with that. The clots caused by AZ vaccine creates pretty catastrophic events in the body. I know all blood clots are of course serious, but this is not comparable in my opinion.

Europe's drugs regulator said on Friday it was reviewing reports of a bleeding condition in people after receiving AstraZeneca's COVID-19 vaccine and looking into Johnson & Johnson's shot over reports of rare blood clots.
Four serious cases of rare blood clots with low platelets, one of which was fatal, have been reported after inoculation with J&J's vaccine from its Janssen unit, the European Medicines Agency (EMA) said.

mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN2BW1MB?__twitter_impression=true

I think many people are having COVID vaccinations for themselves. So they don't get it. So they can see relatives and even might be allowed to travel. Even young people. There is also a good reason to help society overall so the vaccination works for everyone. Including those who cannot have it. I’m glad younger people are not entirely selfish.

And how many have the flu vax to protect themselves instead of the greater society?
Had their child vaccine to protect them against serious chicken pox or whatever not for society?

How many dose up their children to get them into school? sod little Johnny who would end up in icu because of that incredibly selfish choice?
Or parents arguing with schools because it's not fair my little Johnny loves nuts.

People make selfish choices on a daily basis. Many aspects of life come with risks regardless of other people's choices

[quote PandoraP]@EasterIssland, I don’t agree with that. The clots caused by AZ vaccine creates pretty catastrophic events in the body. I know all blood clots are of course serious, but this is not comparable in my opinion.[/quote]
Likewise the clots caused by covid and long covid. They cause the same catastrophic events in the body.

These blood clots have a higher mortality rate but, as they are much rarer, there is no greater risk of death overall.

Riding a motorbike has a greater risk and is also optional. It’s still a regular activity that no-one bans.

@PresentingPercy
Of course many have vaccines because they're scared of covid. But statistically younger people are more hesitant than older people to get vaccinated. I didn't make that argument, it's a fact - 'around 1 in 6 (17%) adults aged 16 to 29 years reported vaccine hesitancy; this was the highest of all age groups' (www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthandwellbeing/bulletins/coronavirusandvaccinehesitancygreatbritain/13januaryto7february2021). Vaccine isn't compulsory to see relatives or to travel (you can get negative test instead). I mean altruism is a wonderful thing, but it doesn't always work. Older people get vaccinated mainly for their own benefit. 18-30 years old have relatively low risk of getting seriously ill from covid, so they won't take a vaccine with these kind of side effects. So if government (or anyone else) wants them to get vaccinated for 'greater good' they have to offer them other vaccine. It's as simple as that. And no amount of moaning about 'selfish youngsters' will change that.

[quote GeorgiaMelissa]@PresentingPercy
Of course many have vaccines because they're scared of covid. But statistically younger people are more hesitant than older people to get vaccinated. I didn't make that argument, it's a fact - 'around 1 in 6 (17%) adults aged 16 to 29 years reported vaccine hesitancy; this was the highest of all age groups' (www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/healthandwellbeing/bulletins/coronavirusandvaccinehesitancygreatbritain/13januaryto7february2021). Vaccine isn't compulsory to see relatives or to travel (you can get negative test instead). I mean altruism is a wonderful thing, but it doesn't always work. Older people get vaccinated mainly for their own benefit. 18-30 years old have relatively low risk of getting seriously ill from covid, so they won't take a vaccine with these kind of side effects. So if government (or anyone else) wants them to get vaccinated for 'greater good' they have to offer them other vaccine. It's as simple as that. And no amount of moaning about 'selfish youngsters' will change that.[/quote]
“Selfish youngsters” who have already made a hell of a lot of sacrifices ‘for the greater good’ this year.

Today 15:07 PresentingPercy

I think many people are having COVID vaccinations for themselves. So they don't get it. So they can see relatives and even might be allowed to travel. Even young people. There is also a good reason to help society overall so the vaccination works for everyone. Including those who cannot have it. I’m glad younger people are not entirely selfish.“

I don’t think young people have been selfish about this situation at all. Why do you?
Ours have pretty much given up a year of their lives, for one an important, formative year when they ought to have struck out independently. It couldn’t happen because they were protecting their elders, which they did, assiduously and without a single complaint. Some years at Christmas when they couldn’t see their loved ones (including us) but never a complaint because they understood the situation.

I am still reeling from an upsetting conversation earlier with an elderly, much loved and hitherto very compliant relative. They told me in no uncertain terms that they would not be taking the recommended twice weekly lf tests at home. They had been vaccinated, would not fall ill themselves and had no intention of isolating. (This person was not shielding, is fit and well in their 80s and has been going about their usual routine as usual because they aren’t very sociable anyway).

I pointed out that whilst they hopefully would not suffer themselves, they could still carry and pass on the virus to younger people (like our children, their close and we had assumed loved relatives) who were not as fortunate as them vaccine wise and would have to wait until July at least for theirs.

It made no difference. They were irritated even more and said they had no intention of locking themselves away so unless it was law they would be taking no test. I had to end the conversation at that point. My kids have willingly done everything asked of them but it seems now it was a one way street.

I’m beyond gutted. If every older, vaccinated person takes that attitude this will all go on much longer than it should.

It’s two free, simple tests twice a week for a few months until all adults are vaccinated. Is that too much to ask from people who others have put their lives in hold for a year/lost their livelihoods for.

I can’t put into words how upset I am.

Sorry about the rant

Tears, not years

I’m beyond gutted. If every older, vaccinated person takes that attitude this will all go on much longer than it should.

Why? The lockdown was to prevent the nhs being overwhelmed by hospitalised covid patients. We’ve vaccinated the people most likely to end up in hospital. Why should lockdown continue because people don’t take COVID tests twice a week? Young people are unlikely to be ill anyway.

Yep all those selfish youngsters who have missed out on:

Socialising
School
GCSEs
A levels
Visiting Unis
Starting uni/freshers activities
18th birthday parties
Holidays at end of a levels
Going out drinking and clubbing
Going to festivals and concerts
Meeting new people/boyfriends

And I haven't heard too many of them complaining. They aren't at risk so expecting/forcing them to have a vaccine they don't need would be the ultimate betrayal of these brilliant young people.

@btwwhichonespink

Yep all those selfish youngsters who have missed out on:

Socialising
School
GCSEs
A levels
Visiting Unis
Starting uni/freshers activities
18th birthday parties
Holidays at end of a levels
Going out drinking and clubbing
Going to festivals and concerts
Meeting new people/boyfriends

And I haven't heard too many of them complaining. They aren't at risk so expecting/forcing them to have a vaccine they don't need would be the ultimate betrayal of these brilliant young people.

I agree with the list and it’s been a painful to watch as well as little complaint from them but I have no issue with the approved vaccine for their age. There is small risk of an outcome you’d like to avoid.

Only if they want it @MarshaBradyo. No issue with them having it if it is wanted , but not forced or pressured to to get their lives back

bumbleymummy

I’m beyond gutted. If every older, vaccinated person takes that attitude this will all go on much longer than it should.

Why? The lockdown was to prevent the nhs being overwhelmed by hospitalised covid patients. We’ve vaccinated the people most likely to end up in hospital. Why should lockdown continue because people don’t take COVID tests twice a week? Young people are unlikely to be ill anyway.“

Because the number of infections still seems to be driving policy.