MHRA may change advice for young people receiving AZ vaccine

[IloveSooty424]

I just saw this news story on Channel 4 news tonight.

www.channel4.com/news/uk-medicines-regulator-considers-issuing-new-advice-over-oxford-astrazeneca-jab

It seems the MHRA may follow other European countries and Canada and advise that younger people should not receive the AZ vaccine. It seems the decision will be made imminently in the coming days.

I’m due to book my vaccine this week and don’t know whether to wait and see how this plays out. I’m 42. I’m also concerned that if younger people will only be offered the Pfizer vaccine it will slow down the vaccine programme substantially.

Any thoughts?

I think there may well be a genuine risk with AZ for younger people. What remains to be seen is whether that risk is significant enough to warrant people not having the jab. At the moment, the numbers don't stack up, and covid appears to be by far the bigger risk. However, that's on the basis that we've had 22 cases out of 17million jabs or whatever the numbers are now.

What I don't know is how many of those 17million vaccines were given to younger people (younger women?) who are in the at-risk group for these clots. I'm also unsure as to how many of those younger people receiving the vaccine might still be in the "danger period" for one of these clots occurring - is it up to 3 weeks after the jab? It's possible that the numbers may go up, and that the odds for the jab may start to look less good. Or they may stay low and everyone will stop worrying. I'm cautiously hoping for the latter.

I'm 48 and had my first jab around 10 days ago. As things stand at present, I am fully intending to have my second jab, but I will await the decision of the MHRA with interest. If they do decide to withdraw the vaccine for younger people, then I trust that a plan will be put into place for those who are currently awaiting the second shot.

I think we need to watch the data carefully, but there is no cause for panic at the moment.

The number of people who got the clots after the jabs is the same number of people who would have got clots anyway in a population number that size. So it's a non event which has turned very political.

I wonder if it’s a combination of the oral contraceptive pill and AZ which is causing a risk? Would tie in with it being younger women who they are saying are more likely to get a clot?

My 18 year old dd1 is due hers on Thursday. She is desperate to have it (obviously we are desperate for her to be vaccinated - although she has already had covid) but I am concerned. I am 40 and have had one dose of AZ and am also concerned as I have "thick" blood (nothing diagnosed just really gloopy blood that is hard to extract!) and a family history of DVT.

I'm just n my 30s and due my second vaccine shortly.

I have questions. The risk seems minimal out of 18 million or whatever, but how many of those 18 million were actually younger women? Is it the case that if you've had your first and been ok you'll be fine with the second.

I had 100% trust in the vaccine but now have doubts given my age.

There is so much speculation around online too. I really thing that someone should come out very soon and clarify things given that other countries have suspended its use in younger age groups.

@OpheliasCrayon

The number of people who got the clots after the jabs is the same number of people who would have got clots anyway in a population number that size. So it's a non event which has turned very political.

This is a misrepresentation (can't judge whether cynical or due to lack of understanding) as the number of blood clot events may be similar but apparently the type/severity is different.

CAnt see anything in the news today about mhra making an statement like some were reporting yesterday. So I’ve the feeling this was mostly someone saying something on tv... and making some damage in the young women’s confidence

I think the UK government trying to avoid talking about it is what is damaging confidence really.

European Medicines Agency decision on AZ is due on Weds apparently.

Government need to get out in front on this.

There's an article in The Guardian this morning.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/apr/06/medicines-watchdog-says-no-decision-made-astrazeneca-jab-for-under-30s?CMP=ShareiOSAppp_Other

It gives the Neil Fergusson quote in full.

Thanks @RaggieDolls. Even there it says mhra hasnt taken a decision

@EasterIssland

No decision has yet been made on any regulatory action is a usual non-comment from government, doesn't mean anything really!

Secondly it seems if it is going to affect you it’s after the first jab

Possibly only because most young people haven’t had a second yet.

Thirdly, you do realise you get the same clots from Pfizer? It’s just that for some reason it’s not being so well published in the EU ( which is where the scaremongering started)

There have been 22 reports of this with AZ, 8 other cases of an unusual combination of clotting and low platelets with AZ and NONE with Pfizer.

Fourthly it’s 30 people out of 17m who have been vaccinated, and all regulators are saying it’s safe at the moment.

Not necessarily because we have no data on the age or sex of those affected. If it’s affecting a particular group then it’s misleading of them to quote it as being out of the total number jabbed. A bit like saying that the chances of it affecting your periods are x in 18.1 million when most of the people vaccinated are too old to get periods and half of them are men.

Spanish media was reporting that the young woman that had died post az vaccine and that the media was saying it was because of the vaccine... the medical investigation had concluded it wasn't because of the vaccine. I see it difficult to ban a vaccine that is helping millions of people for something that it's not 100% happening, and ii think that's why MHRA and EMA continue recommending it despite the age or sex

I hope MHRA carry out a very detailed analysis of the situation before issuing any further guidance.

I'm in my 40s and would much rather have the AZ vaccine (which has been administered to 18million+ people already - and millions more, if you include EU countries and Covishield in India) than the J&J, Novavax, Moderna etc which equates to starting the risk assessment all over again.

In terms of women's age, 30 is very different to 55 (if anything, due to the hormonal profile). Also younger women are more likely to be on the contraceptive pill and older women on any other medication or already suffering from autoimmune conditions.

Someone mentioned Pfizer and Israel upthread. It's not clear whether Israel will be inclined to report externally at this point such a small number of events in younger people, as their relationship with Pfizer is so strongly intertwined (nothing sinister, but they have exchanged doses for recipients'' data)

I agree with OpheliasCrayon in that a lot seems to be political and profit driven as the AZ vaccine is so cheap. Any issue needs to be investigated properly, but the amount of negative press it's receiving (while everything seems to be suspiciously quiet on all the other vaccines is ridiculous)

I’m 41. Ten days post 1st jab. I wasn’t worried when I had it, but I am getting more concerned now. If offered, I’d rather ‘risk’ mixing the jabs rather than getting a second AZ. I also think it would be helpful to release guidance about what symptoms to look for re clotting (are there any?) so we knew what to be aware of.

There have been 22 reports of this with AZ, 8 other cases of an unusual combination of clotting and low platelets with AZ and NONE with Pfizer

Yes, there have been reports of immune thrombocytopenia in the US with low platelets count. But this doesn't reach the European (or UK media)

www.nytimes.com/2021/02/08/health/immune-thrombocytopenia-covid-vaccine-blood.html

@TheJackieWeaver some posters left them in this other thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/coronavirus/a4206181-Canada-pauses-AZ-vaccines-for-under-55s-and-says-women-most-at-risk?msgid=106233772#106233772

Thank you @EasterIssland

@TheJackieWeaver

www.gov.nl.ca/covid-19/vaccine/astrazeneca-covishield-information/

This is the link they posted

@OpheliasCrayon

The number of people who got the clots after the jabs is the same number of people who would have got clots anyway in a population number that size. So it's a non event which has turned very political.

It's not just the incidence it's the type of clot

I'm pro vaccine but best to be clear and investigate fully.

This changes things here!

Ds is 16 and group 6. Due to Europe slowing down our supplies of pfiezer (GP practices words) he is on a "spare vaccines" list currently for his first

And yes I'm waiting for the "we've offered everyone in first 6 groups a vaccine announcement on 15th April"

He is due to see both his neuros next week and I was going to ask if they'd authorise him having either as he could get it if he can have AZ.

I'm due my 2nd pfiezer next week (under health and social care so had it earlier - I'm 40). I feel guilty that people like him who are group 6 (ironically I'm also that group as his carer too) will miss out when they are the ones vulnerable.

I had COVID last feb/March and although extremely ill with it I managed (just!) to stay out of hospital.

[quote mustlovegin]There have been 22 reports of this with AZ, 8 other cases of an unusual combination of clotting and low platelets with AZ and NONE with Pfizer

Yes, there have been reports of immune thrombocytopenia in the US with low platelets count. But this doesn't reach the European (or UK media)

www.nytimes.com/2021/02/08/health/immune-thrombocytopenia-covid-vaccine-blood.html[/quote]
Thanks for posting this mustlovegin it's an interesting read - the tone of the article is very calm and measured. The UK press could do with a bit more of that tone!

@CovidCorvid

What happens to those who have had one already....what will happen for their second? Dd has had her first of AZ already.

They will be offered their second dose as per schedule in all likelihood.

I am 24 and had my first AZ vaccine a month ago (and have a history of blood clots) and if it reassures anyone I have been fine.

However, I am really concerned about having my second one, or if I’ll even get a second one at all if it is removed for under 30s.

What I don’t think helps is the narrative that some people are creating that if you question the vaccine you are some sort of crazy anti vaxer conspiracy theorist. I’m not, I had the first vaccine and put my trust in the science. But now this makes me concerned about the unknowns regarding the vaccine and I really hope they release some more solid data to allow people to make an informed decision on if they wish to proceed.

@Cremeeggaddict1

I am 24 and had my first AZ vaccine a month ago (and have a history of blood clots) and if it reassures anyone I have been fine.

However, I am really concerned about having my second one, or if I’ll even get a second one at all if it is removed for under 30s.

What I don’t think helps is the narrative that some people are creating that if you question the vaccine you are some sort of crazy anti vaxer conspiracy theorist. I’m not, I had the first vaccine and put my trust in the science. But now this makes me concerned about the unknowns regarding the vaccine and I really hope they release some more solid data to allow people to make an informed decision on if they wish to proceed.

For me anyone that has doubts is not an anti vax. Anyone that insists what they’ve seen in sm /dm and not listening to what experts say then it’s an anti vax. That’s why I keep saying on this thread no point on getting worried what will happen / will not happen unless the mhra makes an statement, if they say no more az for under 30s then they’ll come up of a plan for those that need their second dose. Someone saying on tv that it might be banned and the mhra might do an statement is not something that we should get worried with