Employer disadvantaging and threatening staff who haven’t had the vaccine

[MrsFCastle]

My partner works in health and social care. He isn’t an anti vaxxer. Just feels it’s too soon. His employer is furious and is threatening to stop offering shifts if they don’t get it. I’m genuinely concerned about his job security. Can they do this? Helpful replies only please. This isn’t a thread about anti/pro vax.

Is the home privately run? It would largely depend on the polices in place, especially under a duty of care and HASWA.

But I’m intrigued to know why he wouldn’t want the vaccine after the heart breaking images we’ve seen in the last 12 months, especially in care home, loved ones only being able to hold a hand up to a glass pane? Why won’t he just look at the evidence? And, too soon for what?

Newsflash: selfish people are allowed to have a job.

We're all selfish aren't we? I know I am.

Did you wear a mask when you had a cold in 2019? No? That was selfish. You could have passed a virus on.

Calling people selfish may make you feel better but I can't see it raising vaccination rates.

As far as legal costs go, check your household insurance and if it doesn’t have it, get it!! For £50 a year will give you 100k legal cover, but it might not cover it if deaths occur in the home due to staff not taking a preventative precaution!

I wouldn’t give him sympathy if he lost his job.

Yeah he’s wrong. If he doesn’t want the vaccine he’s got no place working in health and social care.

@PreachyGreen

Jeeperscreepers69 Where are care homes going to get all these new staff in order to lay off the experienced ones?

I think you’ll find the overwhelming majority will have the jab rather than loose their job

Plus it seems thr ops partner is on a zero hours contract as she says he’s being told he won’t be offered shifts. That doesn’t happen if you’re on a standard contract.

selfish people are allowed to have a job

Of course. They aren’t allowed to have any job they want though. There are conditions attached to many jobs that mean that they aren’t open to everyone.

It is everyone’s right of freedom to have or have not a vaccine, not everyone has a flu vaccine/MMR etc. No one should be singled out or punished especially for a non licensed and experimental vaccine

Calling people selfish may make you feel better but I can't see it raising vaccination rates.

That won’t, but making it mandatory for particular jobs / going abroad / accessing various venues will.

It is everyone’s right of freedom to have or have not a vaccine

And it’s employers rights to set conditions for jobs.

Here are the stats for the uptake of flu vaccines among healthcare workers. Flu kills many elderly and vulnerable every year:

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/894751/Seasonal_influenza_vaccine_uptake_in_healthcare_workers__HCWs__in_Englan....pdf

I get the too soon thing. The vaccines are in an emergency category release for people at severe risk of death. Not everyone under 60.

The vaccines are in an emergency category release for people at severe risk of death. Not everyone under 60.

Vaccines have been approved, by all the usual regulatory bodies for 18+.

For the ‘too soon’ brigade, how long are you prepared to wait? Are you happy to stay in lockdown for that time period?

They are perfectly within their rights unfortunately although I do sympathise,

How would he feel if he unwittingly passed on the virus to one of the vulnerable people in his care and they became seriously ill or worse, knowing that he could have had a simple injection which 17 million people have already had?

That’s interesting reformed I had no idea flu vaccine uptake amongst GPS was so low! And overall at 80% for healthcare staff sounds about the same as with the covid vaccine, or at least that’s what Mat Hancock was reported as saying by the Guardian.

@TheKeatingFive

selfish people are allowed to have a job

Of course. They aren’t allowed to have any job they want though. There are conditions attached to many jobs that mean that they aren’t open to everyone.

But care work isn't highly paid, highly regarded or highly sought after.

Most care work is not well enough paid to have people queuing up for jobs. We can't even get 2 stable teams of 4 to work nights. 2 of the 8 night staff have had a vaccination at my home. Realistically, what are the chances they are going to lay off 6 of them? The night staff can't see any current likelihood of losing their job and I think they're right.

The consequence of no international travel would be more motivating.

Bluntness100, the care company would have to be pretty confident of their position to lay people off based on not having a vaccination. They will most likely wait until someone sees enough financial incentive to take it to court. I really can't see that being anytime soon.

It's sometimes better to do what works rather than be right.

This sounds like my employer! I wonder where you are ?

@Pastanred

They are allowed to do this for new staff just not existing contracts

I’m guessing overtime is seen as new in this case

Nope 👎 and if he’s zero hours they can just stop offering shifts

So it starts... if you are unsure about having a vaccine that no one knows the long term effects of you get discriminated against. The government did say that it wouldn’t be compulsory but they also said it would be up to employers if they wanted people to prove they had had the vaccination which does seem to mean that unfortunately they may be able to do this to him.

Most care work is not well enough paid to have people queuing up for jobs

Let’s see how the looming recession pans out, huh?

The current vaccine doesn’t stop you catching Covid, or passing it on.

That’s not true as all the emerging data demonstrates.

shall we just ignore the many studies regarding the positive effects of vitamin D use in covid patients?

If it was as easy as that, this would be over a long time ago.

Vit D may play a role, but clearly isn’t a magic bullet.

I don't think they can do that if he has contracted hours, I know we have two staff who flat our refused to get vaccinated, made up all sorts of reasons, and keep talking about all the conspiracy theories. So work has furloughed them on their base hours until all this gets sorted out.

A PP raised an interesting point about the employer's duty of care to other employees

I don't know how that'll work out, but if reports about the demographics of vaccine refusal are correct, the elephant in the room here is that any disciplinary measures might largely impact black and asian staff

Not sure that would be a good look TBH ...