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Anti-lockdown campaigners using children to push their agenda

999 replies

noblegiraffe · 14/02/2021 12:08

I can't be the only one disgusted with how certain groups are using faux concern about children to push the earliest dismantling of lockdown restrictions.

They are loudly catastrophising on the front pages of the press about our kids. The lost generation. £40,000 in lost earnings. Articles about schools full of traumatised kids suffering PTSD caused by lockdown.

And the solution they propose is always to re-open schools as early as possible. Even before March 8th. Regardless of covid.

Now, the situation in schools before Christmas was awful. Some areas of the country had less than 50% attendance due to the new variant ripping through secondary schools. Secondary school kids were the most infected subset of the population by far, and are now the second least infected subset of the population behind the 70+ age group after schools were closed, demonstrating that there was a massive problem with transmission in secondary schools. It wasn't good for pupils' mental health or education to be in a situation when they didn't know if they'd be in school or out at the drop of a hat. But before Christmas, there was complete media silence on the impact that this was having on children.

CAMHS has been devastated by cuts. Waiting lists are intolerable and children in dire need of support don't even qualify. Same for social care around vulnerable children.

Yet you won't hear these people clamouring for schools re-opening as soon as possible talking at all about how to improve safety measures in schools to prevent the scenario we had before Christmas happening again. You won't hear them demanding more funding for children's mental health services and for more support for social care services.

And the reason you won't hear that is that THEY DON'T GIVE A SHIT.

The reason that they want schools re-opened as quickly as possible is because the message was that schools had to open first.

They can't get what they really want open (everything else) until schools are open, hence the massive focus on schools and how terrible things are for children.

This catastrophising isn't good for parents or kids. It's scaremongering and unhelpful.

I know that there are kids (and parents) really struggling with their mental health and worried about their education. Blaring out messages about how terrible things are and how they will never recover because you want to hype up the message about schools going back is irresponsible and sickening.

We need sensible and calm conversations about how to support children and parents. We need funding for schools and massive investment in support services. We need a long-term program of recovery, not 9 months of a Catch-Up Tsar and quick fixes. We need a measured and sensible approach to schools re-opening that won't see kids in and out and in and out due to lack of mitigation measures causing rampant covid spread (particularly with the new variant).

We need these anti-lockdown campaigners to shut up and stop dominating the narrative.

OP posts:
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TryingNotToPanicOverCovid · 15/02/2021 08:56

I think having less children in a class and ventilation would be the main solutions. But at a time when everyone wears masks on public transport/shops etc it was pretty criminal to tell teachers/students they couldn't.

Bollss · 15/02/2021 08:57

@echt

Yes I can read Hmm

For instance what does it actually say about a return to school? Nothing

It doesn't have to. The context is the funding and the listening to schools.

Ok so she's not offering a solution, just saying the government are wrong on their strategy that we know nothing about because they haven't announced it yet. Got it, thanks.
TryingNotToPanicOverCovid · 15/02/2021 08:58

Fwiw I think nearly every teacher would far rather be in class teaching their students. Its far more satisfying than remote learning and easier. However they want it to be safe and sustainable. The schools that had bubbles breaking constantly and the fear that you'd suddenly have your child isolating for 2 weeks at any moment was awful.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 15/02/2021 08:58

But teachers and students were still wearing them?

Not in my school. In classrooms students didn't have to. Corridors they were supposed to but it was 50/50. Some schools actively banned them from being worn.

echt · 15/02/2021 08:58

Ok so she's not offering a solution, just saying the government are wrong on their strategy that we know nothing about because they haven't announced it yet. Got it, thanks

No. She proposes a way forward in the OP.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 15/02/2021 08:59

Fwiw I think nearly every teacher would far rather be in class teaching their students. Its far more satisfying than remote learning and easier. However they want it to be safe and sustainable. The schools that had bubbles breaking constantly and the fear that you'd suddenly have your child isolating for 2 weeks at any moment was awful.

This, from both a parent and teacher pov. Last minute childcare was a nightmare, teaching half a class in school and half at home was so so hard.

Bollss · 15/02/2021 08:59

@echt

Ok so she's not offering a solution, just saying the government are wrong on their strategy that we know nothing about because they haven't announced it yet. Got it, thanks

No. She proposes a way forward in the OP.

No she doesn't I think we've established that. I get that you're a big fan, but there's nothing in the op that tells us how to move forward. There is no "this is how we 're open schools safely"

Just that we need funding and conversations, yes well that has always been the case but that does not tell us when or how schools should open.

TryingNotToPanicOverCovid · 15/02/2021 09:00

Search her previous threads. She's set out detailed suggestions. Repeatedly.

echt · 15/02/2021 09:01

Just that we need funding and conversations, yes well that has always been the case but that does not tell us when or how schools should open

That is for the government to propose.

Bollss · 15/02/2021 09:02

@TryingNotToPanicOverCovid

Search her previous threads. She's set out detailed suggestions. Repeatedly.
Her previous threads are irrelevant considering the massive amount of vaccinating that's happened between then and now.
Bollss · 15/02/2021 09:02

@echt

Just that we need funding and conversations, yes well that has always been the case but that does not tell us when or how schools should open

That is for the government to propose.

Yes, so she's not really suggested anything like I said above.
HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 15/02/2021 09:02

but that does not tell us when or how schools should open.

When is up to the scientists. Community spreads needs to be lower than at present.

How depends on context. Secondary masks, testing and rotas. Primary staggered timings, small bubbles and any other measures schools are able to take depending on their context.

morninglive · 15/02/2021 09:05

100% agree. Most children are absolutely fine and will catch up with their schooling very quickly and allowance will be made anyway.

I'm not saying lockdown forever, but use the science to restart society safely.

LolaSmiles · 15/02/2021 09:07

No she doesn't I think we've established that. I get that you're a big fan, but there's nothing in the op that tells us how to move forward. There is no "this is how we 're open schools safely"
That's because this thread is about the agendas of a particular group, not how a poster on mumsnet thinks schools should reopen.

I honestly think some posters see Noble's name and already decide to ignore most of what she says in favour of saying 'but you haven't planned a full plan for schools opening so nothing you say is relevant'.

Bollss · 15/02/2021 09:08

@LolaSmiles

No she doesn't I think we've established that. I get that you're a big fan, but there's nothing in the op that tells us how to move forward. There is no "this is how we 're open schools safely" That's because this thread is about the agendas of a particular group, not how a poster on mumsnet thinks schools should reopen.

I honestly think some posters see Noble's name and already decide to ignore most of what she says in favour of saying 'but you haven't planned a full plan for schools opening so nothing you say is relevant'.

It's nothing to do with nobles name. If you're going to make big claims that people don't care about children, the government are shit but have absolutely no idea what they should be doing then what's the point?
OliveTree75 · 15/02/2021 09:10

@echt

Ok so she's not offering a solution, just saying the government are wrong on their strategy that we know nothing about because they haven't announced it yet. Got it, thanks

No. She proposes a way forward in the OP.

Do you always speak on other people's behalf? Confused
Shehz21 · 15/02/2021 09:11

Statements like morninglive made just boggles the mind. How the hell do you know children are absolutely fine?! There are so many children struggling,lots of parents who have actually commented on this thread and many many other threads about how much their kids are struggling.
"MOST" children are not "absolutely fine". The majority are struggling and even those who agree with the OP acknowledges that.
Asking for safer working conditions does not mean dismissing the very obvious concern for most children.

0gfhty · 15/02/2021 09:11

@Snookie00

Both sides (teachers unions and the so called nasty pro business lobby) are piggybacking on the crisis to push for changes that they want. Both sides are dressing it up with faux concern about kids. Teachers unions are there to get the best deal for teachers. Business leaders are lobbying for their members.

No one is representing children. Parents and pupils are caught in the middle of this turf war as neither side is putting children first.

Yes this is absolutely right.
Remmy123 · 15/02/2021 09:11

@HercwasanEnemyofEducation my sons secondary home all wore masks at all times.

Made no difference

echt · 15/02/2021 09:12

Her previous threads are irrelevant considering the massive amount of vaccinating that's happened between then and now

Try this:

Yes, so she's not really suggested anything like I said above

Yes she has, but you don't happen to like it.

HercwasanEnemyofEducation · 15/02/2021 09:12

@Remmy123 how do you know?

Lollipop1234 · 15/02/2021 09:13

Can someone explain what “reopening in a safe way” means?

Does it mean no possibility of covid cases in school, as surely this is a pipe dream?

Does it mean reducing the chance of transmission, as surely this can be achieved by ensuring pupils and teachers are tested regularly. They could also introduce fines for parents who send kids in with symptoms or waiting for test results, or kids who should be isolating?

Or does it mean no deaths or serious illness of pupils or teachers, as this is pretty much the case anyway? The older and more vulnerable teachers will have had the vaccine...

They could add measures like masks for teachers and older pupils? We are expected to wear masks on hospital wards where distancing is not always possible, and if it’s ok in this scenario, surely it should be ok in schools? It’s easy to get used to. Our patients don’t wear masks and I have spent the whole weekend being breathed all over by people!

echt · 15/02/2021 09:15

Teachers unions are there to get the best deal for teachers

That's their job, to represent the interests of their members.

The NEU has campaigned for increased funding for schools and colleges:

neu.org.uk/campaigns/funding

Shehz21 · 15/02/2021 09:16

@Lollipop1234

Can someone explain what “reopening in a safe way” means?

Does it mean no possibility of covid cases in school, as surely this is a pipe dream?

Does it mean reducing the chance of transmission, as surely this can be achieved by ensuring pupils and teachers are tested regularly. They could also introduce fines for parents who send kids in with symptoms or waiting for test results, or kids who should be isolating?

Or does it mean no deaths or serious illness of pupils or teachers, as this is pretty much the case anyway? The older and more vulnerable teachers will have had the vaccine...

They could add measures like masks for teachers and older pupils? We are expected to wear masks on hospital wards where distancing is not always possible, and if it’s ok in this scenario, surely it should be ok in schools? It’s easy to get used to. Our patients don’t wear masks and I have spent the whole weekend being breathed all over by people!

Very sensible post. I agree with all your points. And DH has spent a weekend similar to yours as the patients don't wear masks.
LolaSmiles · 15/02/2021 09:17

It's nothing to do with nobles name. If you're going to make big claims that people don't care about children, the government are shit but have absolutely no idea what they should be doing then what's the point?
There's been thread after thread with ideas, just posters on this thread are conveniently ignoring it.

I love the idea that nobody should be able to criticise government policy or lobby group agendas unless they have a full plan that could be implemented though. It's a nice way of trying to shut people down or discredit reasonable concerns.