We cannot cancel life, to preserve every life

[Slytherin]

I actually find myself agreeing with a Tory for once...we’ve given up so much and the goalposts keep moving, yes it’s an unpredictable situation, but it’s also unsustainable long term. The idea that this summer will be possibly worse than last summer makes zero sense, when we have a vaccine roll out that far exceeds any other nation (except Israel) currently.
First it was let’s get the elderly and vulnerable vaccinated, then it was let’s get the over 50s vaccinated, now we’ve got members of SAGE suggesting restrictions have to continue until everyone, including children are vaccinated and beyond, because of the possibility of new variants. Professor John Edmunds said some would have to stay “forever” last night on Peston.

We must at some point live with an element of risk. I’m in no way suggesting we lift lockdown yet, but suggesting that things won’t have much improved by the summer, is, in my opinion encroaching into dangerous territory.

The government were over promising before, now they’re under promising. There’s got to be a middle ground, people’s mental health cannot sustain this level of pessimism and not having a single thing to look forward to. Everything gets dangled like a carrot, then taken away at the last minute. It’s beyond cruel.

Then it’s the mixed messages, Matt Hancock telling us he’s going on a summer holiday to Cornwall and he’s all booked up and Grant Shapps then telling nobody to even consider booking a holiday abroad or domestically this summer.

Yes, I support restrictions to save lives and support the NHS, but I don’t support the way the government are handling this once again. And I don’t support these restrictions indefinitely, especially when the majority of the at risk groups have been vaccinated.

www.channel4.com/news/we-cannot-cancel-life-to-preserve-every-life-tory-mp-sir-charles-walker-on-lockdown?fbclid=IwAR2RnQNKwJoQ4FSBxT9oTbwbFOCTWcIU9wD9WdYkTEA2sVlJ1posWZAfmsU

So even if we lockdown the country you will still get UK mutations as that’s what virus’s do

Yes they do but if we let the virus spread into more people, there will be even more mutations and so more chance of an even worse variant

With lockdown, less people are infected, and so less mutations. Until we have more vaccinated, a better way. It needs to be controlled

@Angel2702 mental torture ? Really..... ? Just existing, not living ? Think you need to get a grip. Self indulgent melodramatic tosh and actually a bit
tasteless considering that people of all ages have died.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

'Oh seriously get a grip. We have lost all perspective of what is a good age to reach. Of celebrating a life well lived'

No one has lost perspective, this isn't about a good age to reach it is about older people perhaps requiring a hospital bed unless euthanasia is your thing? And about the 50, 60 and 70 year olds requiring critical care. Do keep up.

🤦‍♀️ one more time...

Once the over 50s are vaccinated, why should younger people stay locked down?

I realise now I've not said explicitly but I don't actually believe in lifting lockdown tomorrow but once groups 1-9 are vaccinated, how long does this continue?

If you think about it realistically... the world is not safe until everyone gets the jab..

OK those who have it can travel, and if exposed it might not be too bad for them.

But what about transmission to others who have not had the vax yet?

People are going to be a lot braver once furlough stops. The virus really isn't very scary compared to the worry about losing your home or business.

I’m so sick of this “long Covid” nonsense. No other disease has the word “long” inserted before it - you don’t get “long flu” or “long cold” do you? So why not just call it by its proper name, “post viral fatigue”?

Incidentally, I know five people who’ve had Covid, all with mild symptoms. One of them is a massive hypochondriac who always catches every disease going. Guess which one is now suffering with “long Covid”?

@Hammonds The thing with SAGE is they will not allow other scientists to know how they are getting their findings

Do you know how many scientists are involved with SAGE and NERVTAG ? Do you think that some of them might be doing their job and trying to homeschool, haven't seen their friends or loved ones for a while, want to go on holiday and go to the pub and the gym and be allowed to do all the things that everyone else wants to do ? You honestly think they are all doing this for shits and giggles ?

Feels like a bit of fresh air to read this post.
I totally agree that there needs to be some hope and a move back to normal life, else what is the point?

I don't understand why there is such a push to roll out a vaccination at the cost of goodness knows what to the tax payer if it's not going to result in freedom. Why should I have it if I still have to live this half life?

I'm sure the people calling for this for months and months and years never had a life to loose in the first place if they are content to be locked up til god knows when.

I don't think the Government care about deaths. Its about people taking up space in hospitals and the costs of care. I think when the models show that number of people being hospitalised or requiring expensive treatment is less costly than not getting revenue from hospitality, travel, etc then they will open up again.

However it sounds nicer publically to talk about preventing deaths, because pricing peoples lives up as care vs taxes doesn't sound great to voters.

'Terrifying. Rebel against what? Are we children? Scientists stand in front of tv cameras every second or third day to try to explain that the higher the rates of Covid, the greater the inability of the NHS to treat non-Covid sufferers who need treatment. '

You'd think the wannabe rebels would see that PHE, CMO, CSA, etc etc just might know what they're talking about.

@MaxNormal

People are going to be a lot braver once furlough stops. The virus really isn't very scary compared to the worry about losing your home or business.

Quite. I think we will have a new wave of ‘ok this has gone on too long now’

@PatriciaHolm

I think back to what people must have suffered during the blitz and the stoic reaction to this.

Said by someone who knows nothing about the reaction to the restrictions caused by the Blitz. There was an awful lot of kickback about, for example, the blackout requirements. Looting became a huge problem, and a lot of the children first evacuated in 1939 actually returned home by Christmas because people couldn't see the need, plus they were homesick and missing their friends...People were not all sitting stoically in their homes in the dark "doing their bit".

Someone tried to tell me that you are more likely to get killed by a bus than die of COVID. Again - really?

Statistically, possible, for many people, given the very skewed age profile of those who have died from Covid. Around 1,800 people die a year on the roads; there have been approx. 1,600 deaths from covid of those under 50 S(Source - ONS). So yes, if you are under 50, it is more likely you will die in a road accident.

Correct Patricia. The Blitz spirit crap is so damned offensive. My gran survived the Blitz. She suffered permanent disfigurement due to the shock and trauma. All her eyebrows and eyelashes fell out and never grew back. It wasn’t all sing songs in the Anderson shelter. Some people really bloody suffered!

"I'd much rather sacrifice more now to get things more under control so that Track & Trace can actually stay on top of cases in future"

That is a very interesting question - we need to know why Track and Trace didn't do that last summer, could it be effective next time, and if so what has to happen to make it so? Quicker test results - but can even that work when there is asymptomatic transmission? On another thread pp said hand it over to local authority public health - what have they done differently that would make it work?

Or are we better off spending the t and t money on increasing NHS capacity - upskilling existing staff with ICU training, recruiting new staff to start the process of increasing capacity? I don't know the answer but would be good to have the debate.

The virus really isn't very scary compared to the worry about losing your home or business.

Indeed. One in three people don’t even know they’ve got it FFS!

a bit tasteless considering that people of all ages have died

Did people never die before covid then? Did death spring into existence a year ago?
Or has no-one in human history ever been allowed to be miserable about anything because People Have Died?

Tell that to the war veterans

Tell what to the war veterans ?

Tough restrictions are there to preserve NHS capacity to cope. It's the same all over the world.

@CountessFrog

I’ll have anyone in the house now, I have no fucks left to give.

Suspect many have reached that point.

And this 👆🏻is precisely why threads such as this are still happening. Jesus

Completely agree with the op and the Tory politician.

@HermioneWeasley

Agree. The average age of people who’ve died from Covid is older than average life expectancy. Death is part of life. People have to die of something.

Tell that to my young and otherwise healthy friend's widow.

There are those who see the big picture here here for everyone, and those who are naturally rebellious.

True or not?

@RedcurrantPuff indeed, my dad was & when the war ended. He remembers hunger and stress and his mum having a complete mental breakdown from which she did not recover. And his dad losing his business.

Happy war memories indeed

The problem is this - the genome of the virus has proven less stable than they thought and hoped at the beginning. If you lift restrictions and allow it to run riot among the unvaccinated under 50s, it will mutate- and one of those mutations could mean it evades the vaccines altogether. So we’d be back to square one. The solution is to vaccinate everyone (which we hope to do with at least one dose by September) - the vaccines should cut down transmission. Coupled with loosening restrictions very prudently and a good test and trace, that would keep numbers very low and significantly improve the odds that we don’t get a nasty mutation.

It’s mind boggling that this government hasn’t started to invest in more nhs capacity including the creation of treatment pathways for covid that recognise that some people stay in hospital with it for ages

You could have had a whole cohort of covid specific auxiliary nurses trained up by now to begin to staff the nightingales.

I for one won’t be following the rules for much longer. I’m comfortable that some people might die as a result of opening things upc and they might even be people I know. Life goes on.