Furlough / working backside off

[Mingkong]

Am I the only person who is hacked off seeing people frolicking about whilst on furlough, while my husband works 12 hour days ? Also we have stuck to the rules throughout. I appreciate that he is lucky to have a job but he is worn out , not a break from the screen, has had shingles and eczema over the lockdown months, but still carries on without complaint. Meanwhile others ( some through no fault of their own ) are furloughed and having a jolly old time . And who will have to pay the furlough money ??? Us !! Makes me bloody angry.

@MotherExtraordinaire I actually don’t understand your logic if people were not furlough companies would go out of business.
Business that are struggling have and will go out of business anyway some may argue not enough Is being done for business but that’s a different discussion.
Many of these business were very profitable no where near struggling, my employer for example.
The thing is if industry are shut there isn’t the work then there isn’t the work . If they had to make the majority of staff redundant which less face it after almost a year who can afford to pay staff ( although they were open for a few months last year ). So if they made people redundant that’s millions of people looking for jobs which won’t be enough for everyone so on benefits not able to keep up mortgage repayments/ rent etc .
Then when companies are able to open what do they do then they probably won’t be able to open without any government support.
I’m sorry but majority of people have had no option to take furlough they can’t afford to turn it down because they can’t live off fresh air .
Please tell us what you would do or do you think it’d be just tough and live off benefits but then you can bitch about the unemployed then .
Oh and just because you see someone smiling on the internet supposedly having a great time furlough you don’t know that this same person is trying to put on a brave face but is in fact struggling .

I wa differed furloughing for childcare reasons, as I have a young child with additional needs and am cev.
So your industry is open , so what do you think people do that industry are shut ?
Stand outside the restaurant/ shop / hairdresser etc until Bojo said can open ?

For what it's worth I am on furlough because I am cev , had my first injection. OP I would dearly love to be at work. I miss my work team because I am in a high risk job I can't. I don't see anyone bar DH & DC's .I get your frustration my DH is still working but not all of us in furlough are having a good time .

@MotherExtraordinaire then your company shouldn't be furloughing if they aren't struggling for aren't business. Or are people furloughed for childcare reasons?

I actually have some sympathy for those on furlough as it's fairly apparent that furlough is simply deferred redundancy and those on furlough recognise that when the scheme ends there is a strong probability they will be out of a job in an economy with not a lot of job vacancies going.

So let's not be too harsh.

[quote Cantstandsmugness]@MotherExtraordinaire

How dare you - my company was around for 55 years!!!! So not a start up that would have gone bust anyway! The owners have lost everything.

And how can you choose NOT to accept furlough when the government won’t allow your company to work!
I really hope this shit doesn’t happen to you for no fault of your own!![/quote]
Well if its so long standing then hopefully it will reincarnate again.
What level of reserves did it have? Obviously not sufficient if it went under before this lockdown, given there were at least 7 months last year it could presumably have operated. Or indeed it could have changed its way of working or diversified.... Like many did successfully.

Or indeed it could have changed its way of working or diversified.... Like many did successfully.

Because it's so easy for lots of businesses just to change tack completely. I work in tourism, we let out houses for holidays. If you can think of a way to diversify that then I'm all ears. You seem to have a very simplistic view of business. I'd give anything to get back to proper work and not be in this soul destroying limbo. Our business has also been going for nearly 40 years and up until 2020 was totally viable. Now? Who the fuck knows.

Well where I work is not allowed to be open I'm being paid 80% of my wage but still paying 100% bills I'm a single parent worried about the future of my job having a jolly time I'm not

My original industry was closed by the government. It was illegal for them to trade, that meant they had no income, and couldn't pay their staff

Which is a very good reason for furlough. However, I know people who are being furloughed in sectors which can carry on as normal. There's a lot of abuse going on and I am surprised the system wasn't restricted to the sectors which have to close, rather than any at all. For example, it make sense to furlough hairdressers, not so much sense to furlough an insurance broker (unless their specialism is in event insurance I guess!)

@poppycat10

My original industry was closed by the government. It was illegal for them to trade, that meant they had no income, and couldn't pay their staff

Which is a very good reason for furlough. However, I know people who are being furloughed in sectors which can carry on as normal. There's a lot of abuse going on and I am surprised the system wasn't restricted to the sectors which have to close, rather than any at all. For example, it make sense to furlough hairdressers, not so much sense to furlough an insurance broker (unless their specialism is in event insurance I guess!)

Yes, I see your point, and God it must be frustrating to be working and covering extra work, as some other colleagues are furloughed. However some have had to be furloughed due to childcare - a knock on effect, schools and after school clubs as well as a wider circle of people than one 'bubble' (how I managed when DC were smaller) have all been removed and that leaves a choice for many of work and leave your kids at home to fend for themselves, or not go to work. As this is not a decision taken by the parents, to close the available childcare, then those affected are basically in the same boat as those whose industries have closed. Prevented from accessing the childcare they need to keep children safe, and therefore prevented from working. I understand the need to close the childcare, and I know there is childcare available, but in some cases there's not enough room, or simply they are refused for not being a key worker. And I totally agree that the system is being taken advantage of by some, as any system will be that's designed to help people. However I'm inclined to think that as the individual doesn't apply to the government for furlough, the company does, it's a lot of companies that have seen a way to cut costs by only paying half the staff, expecting them to do twice the work and then the government paying the rest, of which they have the option to call back immediately, without training, without the recruitment process etc that they would incur the cost of if they just slashed the workforce by half. People are putting up with it because of the situation we're in, because other industries have collapsed, because so many more people are now unemployed and looking so they know getting another job might not be so easy, if some of the companies doing this pulled a stunt like this they'd lose some of the workforce if not a lot (outside of covid times) it's been an employer's market for some time, but that's even more true now. I don't think any of that is the furloughed workers fault, it's the companies taking advantage and the government for not tying up the loopholes. But then the furloughed would have been out of a job and struggling in this job market, and on benefits. It's a no win situation as far as I can see all ways really.

I work in tourism and have been furloughed on and off for the last year. When we were allowed to operate briefly, we were as busy as usual and are already fully booked for summer, should restrictions allow. I will have a job to return to but the government has closed us down.

Currently, I’m furloughed from my part time job. In normal times I bring home between 220-250 a week. As it stands, it’s 185. If I were to be unemployed, an eligibility calculator implies I’d be receiving£250 a week through benefits. Furlough is saving the government money in that respect.

And to address the OPs point about frolicking - I work 2.5 days a week in normal times. You could well see me frolicking Saturday - Tuesday and Wednesday afternoons but it would have fuck all to do either being furloughed. Mind your own business.

@MotherExtraordinaire*

Erm please explain how a company that works with mass crowds, think festivals etc, could have worked for 7 months last year!!!!!
I’ll call my ex boss and let him know what he missed!!!

The government offered no help to the supply chain in the event industry, the company still had bills to pay!
You really have no idea at all.

@poppycat10

My original industry was closed by the government. It was illegal for them to trade, that meant they had no income, and couldn't pay their staff

Which is a very good reason for furlough. However, I know people who are being furloughed in sectors which can carry on as normal. There's a lot of abuse going on and I am surprised the system wasn't restricted to the sectors which have to close, rather than any at all. For example, it make sense to furlough hairdressers, not so much sense to furlough an insurance broker (unless their specialism is in event insurance I guess!)

There seams to be 2 lots of furlough here those industries that have to shut hairdressers eg but others stockbrokers as you say don’t . Fair comment but I still don’t get the anger directed at the furlough. Maybe people are abusing the furlough but that’s the employer not the employee . People can be furlough for childcare doesn’t mean it will be . Where I work we were back up and running full capacity by mid July when re opened and everyone was told to get back to work . When restrictions were brought in September/ October it had to be re used again that’s what the furlough scheme is there for . I can’t comment on stockbrokers that want to furlough staff because I know nothing about it , but in all honesty it’s not something employees choose , I’ve said this before on previous threads but if you work in a industry that is not effected by the pandemic that’s great but if you have a unscrupulous employer that is still using the furlough scheme for some people but putting the work on others that’s not what it’s for that’s abuse and then you should be directing your anger at the employers not the furlough workers .

@MotherExtraordinaire you are just a twisted bitter toady person.
You would rather millions of people and thousands of businesses go .
I'm sorry you don't have time to go sledging or decorate or whatever.
Maybe you should look at your time management!
I am however grateful for you providing a look into the mind of someone who is only capable of thinking the worse of everyone who is forced into a situation they didn't ask for or want.

I bet you are just pure joy to know in real life.
A solid good friend.
With lots of empathy. A real shoulder to cry on😀
Not someone who is jealous of other peoples l🙄

In the summer I admit to feeling. Jealous. The weather was great, I was working long hours..... but then I gave my head a wobble and was grateful for what I have
I am sure it’s very hard for many
The only thing I would say is that I would like to think that those who are furloughed that had the capacity to do so should volunteer. Obviously plenty may have caring or financial worries that prevent this

I have no issue with people who have been furloughed where they work in sectors such as hospitality, aviation etc. In fact I’m delighted it’s a thing for them.

But. I work in the legal sector. My department has been Full. On. since March. Yet many of our staff were furloughed (at 100%), putting a massive strain on the rest of us (not their fault of course). We have been breaking our necks to cover for them. I have two kids under 6 and a full time job and I’m at breaking point.

It has gradually come to light that the reason they have been furloughed is because they are pretty crap at their jobs and couldn’t be trusted to work from home.

Damn right that makes me angry. Although to be fair if I didn’t have the kids to worry about it probably wouldn’t get to me so much.

No threat of redundancy here by the way. They’ll come back when the furlough scheme comes to an end and live happily ever after.

Remember that the whole point of furlough is to reduce the transmission of the virus. It's all very well saying people on furlough should volunteer but that defeats the object really when the point is that not being at work prevents the transmission in the workplace. A lot of industries have taken the piss with it though and claimed it when they don't need/have to close, that should really have been prevented but obviously too late now.

@AlohaMolly

I work in tourism and have been furloughed on and off for the last year. When we were allowed to operate briefly, we were as busy as usual and are already fully booked for summer, should restrictions allow. I will have a job to return to but the government has closed us down.

Currently, I’m furloughed from my part time job. In normal times I bring home between 220-250 a week. As it stands, it’s 185. If I were to be unemployed, an eligibility calculator implies I’d be receiving£250 a week through benefits. Furlough is saving the government money in that respect.

And to address the OPs point about frolicking - I work 2.5 days a week in normal times. You could well see me frolicking Saturday - Tuesday and Wednesday afternoons but it would have fuck all to do either being furloughed. Mind your own business.

Not quite as simple as 250 v 185 though. You've spoken of just you. However, for say 100 employees in your organisation a large majority would not be eligible for that additional amount due to their household's individual circumstances or they'd be on higher incomes and so would in effect receive less than their furlough incomes. That's the point. When it's extrapolated, the outgoings of the government would be far lower. Plus the redundancy element would mean that they would not have paid for the entire period if indeed a person was eligible.

I appreciate this is not an ideal situation. But the situation is far from ideal. And there will inevitably be some who will have to function on far less financially and lose homes. That's going to happen regardless though. And much of the issue here is the extent that households mortgage themselves to their ceiling level. Rather than true affordability.

The grass is always greener. My partner is on 2 weeks on 2 weeks off furlough. I am always jealous in the first week and pretty glad in the second because he descends into a depressed grumpy house gremlin. Its all shit. Working/ being housebound. All shit lol

*glad to be working not glad he descends to a house gremlin

@MotherExtraordinaire how they hell do you know that in her organisation that all didn’t need to be furlough? If the industry is shut its shut.
You have got a bee in your bonnet that it’s being abused yes by some but not by the industry that have to shut . So go away and stop being so vicious. I feel sorry for you that you are so bitter of people it’s sad .

My husband was furloughed for four weeks back in June and it was very stressful. Whilst I did resent my 10 - 12 hours day for most of the lockdown with barely any leave, I much prefer it to furlough.

I think most people on furlough now are really fed up, some I know have found other work just to keep them sane and there is the worry about losing their jobs.

Those on furlough are likely to be those warnings g minimum wages bar staff, waiters and waitresses etc.
Now they have to live on 80% of what little they earned.
Having a jolly time, sure.
Such a selfish view point OP.

*earning