Forcing vaccination

[Peaceiseveryrhing]

Just read this on the Beeb

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-55718553

Personally, I think it's outrageous that employees may insist on vaccination and airlines preventing travel.

A communistic approach!

@Sillyduckseverywhere

I really can't bring myself to care about people that refuse something that will get us back to some semblance of normality. You can't go on holiday or the cinema? Sucks to be you. I suggest you change your mind. No one is obliged to offer you a service. (Medical exemptions aside of course. I mean proper medical exemptions, not "I'm anxious" )

Very well said.

Participating in society comes with responsibilities as well as rights. Many posters focus on the latter when they should be contemplating the former.

@VenusTiger

It makes me sad and angry that so many people on this platform will simply bend over and take whatever is coming. It is coercion plain and simple. No jab no fly, no jab no cinema: no jab no life. That is disturbing. So many ppl DO NOT NEED a vaccine against a SARs virus - if elderly and vulnerable want to have it to reduce symptoms then that's fine, if young and healthy want to have it for similar reasons, that's fine, but transmission is still possible, so to quote Whitty in March, 'the majority of us won't catch Covid, the majority who do will suffer mild symptoms'. Vaccinate the vulnerable that's it. If we carry on like this, we'll have no immune system left to speak of, T-cell immunity is your best friend.

It is legally impossible to 'force' a medical procedure, which is what a vaccine is. It is against human rights to coerce and threaten those who simply do not need a vaccine, whether it's flu, or SARs-Cov-2 which are both serious illnesses to vulnerable and elderly. I can't believe so many ppl are willing to shove a vaccine into their precious children, when the studies all conclusively say, young and healthy are not at risk.
I've quoted this so many times now: March to Nov 2020 377 people under the age of 65yrs with no underlying health conditions sadly died with Covid.

And in all those times of citing those figures, have you acknowledged that those stats exclude underlying conditions such as mild asthma and diabetes?!!

I’m sure my cleaning lady, who rarely uses an inhaler and my friend, whose teen has recently been diagnosed with type 1 diabetes would be outraged to realise their deaths would be excluded from those stats and thus reduced to collateral damage.

@CrunchyCarrot

I would also support legislation to prevent anyone that had chosen not to be vaccinated from receiving NHS treatment for coronovirus.

This is a dreadful attitude. Anyway, you'd have to apply that to other health situations for fairness. What about smokers? No treatment if they develop lung cancer. Sunbed users? No treatment if they get melanoma. People who eat too much junk food? No treatment for diabetes. Etc.

The habits you cite are not contagious and don't infect others with a deadly and debilitating virus; nor do they endanger frontline workers.

@DinosaurDiana

No doubt someone will come up with a way of forging the evidence, so no point IMO.

Agree this will happen

It may have already been mentioned but it will be the overseas countries who dictate if you need to be vaccinated to enter their country and the airlines won’t allow you in the plane without it. I think airlines are liable to bring you home if you are denied entry.

'Bet you wouldn't apply that argument to something like saysexuality, race, gender?'

These things don't endanger others, though. Refusing vaccinations may.

You already need the yellow fever vaccination to go to certain countries. In the past, many airlines and destination countries insisted on the smallpox vaccine.

Related to gender in a way: many airlines won't allow women to travel if they are over 36 weeks pregnant, because they don't want them to go into labour on the plane.

The habits you cite are not contagious and don't infect others with a deadly and debilitating virus; nor do they endanger frontline workers

Flu is deadly to certain people. HC workers are not forced to have that vaccination and many don’t.

I think the vaccine should be mandatory, but as that wont happen I am really pleased that these things will make more people have it. Then everyones life might get back to some normality.

I've had great fun winding up two conspiracy theorist colleagues recently by telling them that the government will most likely spread the vaccine via chemtrails. 🤣 They both know my sister is quite senior in the MOD so I've been able to make a quite convincing case about my 'inside knowledge' (well, convincing enough for people that believe crap they watch on YouTube).

@Peaceiseveryrhing

Just read this on the Beeb

[[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-55718553]]

Personally, I think it's outrageous that employees may insist on vaccination and airlines preventing travel.

A communistic approach!

Oh yes, international airlines, that famous bastion of communism.

Sigh, another thread scaremongering about 'forced' vaccination. The only thing they might force you to do is face the consequences of your own actions should you decline vaccination.

Thread title is misleading. Scaremongering. No one is forcing anyone. Employer can not force an employee to have the vaccine. The article says this. From an HR / Employment law POV.
OP has already been told this.

Sigh. Coercive action, including removal of access to the ordinary amenities of life, equates to force. It is not a “consequence”, it is a punishment.

Happily I think this would alienate voters from the Tories, and they won’t do it.

*@lightand no drug or vaccine is ever completely safe.
But after something has been used in thousands and thousands of ordinary people (including those that would not be allowed to take part in trials for various reasons) sometimes rare side effects are discovered that could not be expected to be found in a clinical trial of 10,000 people.

Think about it - if a side effect occurs in 1 in 10,000 people, or only in people with a rare pre existing condition, it's unlikely to come up in a trial of 10,000 people.

In most cases however these rare side effects don't actually mean the product is taken off the market - just that the side effect is added to the packaging, or they stop using the product for certain groups of patient.

In the case of a vaccine it's actually unlikely to have any long term effects as it is designed to cause a quick reaction in your immune system. There have been cases where a rare short term effect came to light after licensing. Rotavirus vaccine in children was linked to intussception after it went into general use. I can't remember if that was a genuine link but it the vaccine was withdrawn for a time whilst it was investigated. There are other products that are very widely used and actually have some pretty serious long term side effects, and people still use them. The contraceptive pill is an obvious example. There's a reasonable risk of thromboembolism if it's taken by overweight women, smokers or those over 30. Yet many of these women are still prescribed it

Ibuprofen is another one that is widely taken and is far riskier than any vaccine*

Thank you. It is probably going to end up being about any possible serious long term effects from covid vaccines.

There are other products that are very widely used and actually have some pretty serious long term side effects, and people still use them.

But nobody is forced to use them. Imagine being just one person coerced into having this vaccine, and you’re harmed by a serious side effect. That isn’t okay. Nobody should be forced or coerced into that position.

@Oblomov21
There is a poster, mid thread, who says she is being effectively forced. That if she doesnt have it, the employer will find another way to try and get rid of her.

And I thought frontline NHS staff and care staff had to have it for their job? Or have I got that wrong?

This antivaxx shite needs to be removed IMO

@AlternativePerspective

This antivaxx shite needs to be removed IMO

Yes! Censor any opposing views until all you read are the comments similar to your thinking!

( echo echo )

The thing with vaccination is that it isn't just for your n nefit, but for the whole of society. Lets hope those vulnerable children aren't exposed to a non vaccinated individual who is positive for covid, herd immunity only works when people are less focused on self and consider the wider implications of their 'right' to refuse vaccines. I believe it is the right of the vulnerable to be able to use care services, travel etc safely too.

If you don't want the vaccine then don't have it, but don't expect the rest of society to welcome you with open arms when you are part of the problem and not the soltion to getting back to normal.

@bigvig

If the virus mutates - as do all viruses then having the vaccination will only protect you against one strain and will have to be adapted like the flu jab each year with limited success. For the vast majority of healthy people letting your immune system fight the disease will give you a better level of immunity. There are doubts about whether young girls should have this as it may affect fertility. It may not but the point is it has been rushed out and we don't yet know. Attacking people for having doubts is unreasonable and aggressive. If you've had the jab and you believe it will protect you why be so concerned about others choices. The NHS could be protected better with some decent funding. What sort of country are we living in where people are forced to do something they are uncomfortable with which is of dubious medical necessity.

Have reported. Contains factual inaccuracies. Please disregard if you read it before it's removed.

MN - we are in a pandemic. We don't need anti Vaxer's being given a platform.

I am pro vaccine and work in meficine but i do think coersion to put anything into our bodies is a bad thing.

Medicine