Why should the UK vaccine supply be diverted to Europe?

[lovelemoncurd]

They ordered 3 months later than the UK. They have themselves less time to sort glitches. They have been slow to the table and now they wish to punish to UK for being efficient.

I was a remain voter. I'm starting to change my mind!

Voted Remain here
Good on for us getting vaccines so swiftly, we've "done good" for once!
They can naff off though lol, why should we be punished for being efficient?!

You can bet your bottom dollar that if we were still in the EU we wouldn't have been allowed to approve the vaccine ourselves, it would have had to be a Europe-wide licenced approval, and we wouldn't be anywhere near as far along with the vaccinations as we are now.

They didn't order the stuff - we did. If they put barriers in the way of exports to the UK, then all we have to do is remind them who won two world wars remind them that we don't necessarily have to import all their cars.

Oh, and if they don't want our fish, then we'll keep it, Omega 3 and all.

The way the BBC is reporting on this could not be classed as impartial.

They are still on the side of the EU

The BBC really need to get over Brexit

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-55822602

I think the real issue is that very few journalists (Fergus Walsh is one of the few exceptions) or politicians understand the science of the pandemic or vaccine production. I really really hope that one good thing to come out of this whole mess is an uptake in students wanting to study STEM subjects.

• The EU “contract is very clear: Our commitment is, I am quoting, ‘our best effort,’” he said. It was drawn up this way because AstraZeneca and its partner Oxford University had already signed a deal with the U.K. government for 100 million doses, and was committed to delivering them, while the EU deal for 400 million doses was signed three months later, with the bloc wanting them to be shipped concurrently.

“We said, ‘OK, we're going to do our best, we’re going to try, but we cannot commit contractually because we are three months behind U.K.,'” he said, adding the company knew it was a “super stretch goal."*

Although in legal terms "best efforts" is a very strong commitment. Much stronger than "we'll try". It's not far short of a hard contractual commitment.

I was a Leave voter. I take no pleasure in what's happening as I don't like the idea of anyone dying before they get a chance to be vaccinated, regardless of their citizenship, but I do find this issue helps to explain to friends/husband who taunted me why I chose to vote that way.

I could never articulate it clearly, but essentially my concern was unnecessary levels of bureaucracy, trying to regulate everything in a uniform way for countries with vastly different demographics, and a frustration that the UK would generally 'play fair' whilst other countries would ignore the rules with no penalty. All of these issues seem to be highlighted at the moment.

@lovelemoncurd

The Germans have requested that our supply is diverted but AZ have said that it won't be - as it stands at the moment.

Cheeky f!

Stop trying to blame the Germans for this - it's the EU vaccine minister who thinks our supplies should be diverted.

I wonder what she thinks should happen to all the EU citizens living in the UK including all the British citizens who have EU passports? Do they only count if they live in an EU member state?

No country should be vaccinating more than that until ALL the highest risk group people have been vaccinated in all countries

We should be able to do what we like. Israel and Indonesia are vaccinating younger people anyway, so we're not all doing the same thing.

You can bet your bottom dollar that if it had been the UK who was late to the party and had no vaccines then people (and particularly the BBC) would have said it served us right for Brexit and how wonderful Europe is.

Now it’s the other way round they’re floundering around and offering silly moral arguments like we should forego our vaccines and share nicely with Europe. As if they’d have slung a few vaccines our way if we had cocked up...

@Horizons83 I'm a remain voter, and I couldn't agree more.

AZ negotiated a deal in good faith with the EU, making it clear it was on a "We'll do our best" basis, making it clear that the delay due to EU bureaucracy would increase the risk of issues delaying delivery. Now the EU is acting appallingly in trying to use it's strength to ride roughshod over the rights of earlier contracts.

"It shouldn't be first come first served", they say. Well, why the hell not, if that's what the contracts said? And if it shouldn't be then I assume they will be sharing their Moderna supplies - which we ordered late - with us?

I am utterly disgusted and, were there another referendum, would be seriously considering changing my vote.

@MarciaDidia - he was speaking colloquially I believe, the figures in the legal text for Curevac say "best estimates", which is quoted as being thought to be like Astrazeneca.

And if New Zealand had vaccinated all their population first you can imagine all the posters on here crying, “Why aren’t we like wonderful New Zealand?” No one would be suggesting that they should hold off in order to share with tardier nations.

You can bet your bottom dollar that if it had been the UK who was late to the party and had no vaccines then people (and particularly the BBC) would have said it served us right for Brexit and how wonderful Europe is.

Yes, and you wouldn't have been able to move here for the 'laughing stock' comments, along with 'watching Britain in horror from my (unnamed) country' faux concern.

@IcedPurple

You can bet your bottom dollar that if it had been the UK who was late to the party and had no vaccines then people (and particularly the BBC) would have said it served us right for Brexit and how wonderful Europe is.

Yes, and you wouldn't have been able to move here for the 'laughing stock' comments, along with 'watching Britain in horror from my (unnamed) country' faux concern.

Oh my god so much this.

10 months we’ve had to put U.K. with O/S posters being ‘horrified’ and ‘world laughing at’

And wondrous places where it’s back normal

My foot they wouldn’t be hanging around sticking the knife in for a bit more glee.

@Horizons83

I was a Leave voter. I take no pleasure in what's happening as I don't like the idea of anyone dying before they get a chance to be vaccinated, regardless of their citizenship, but I do find this issue helps to explain to friends/husband who taunted me why I chose to vote that way.

I could never articulate it clearly, but essentially my concern was unnecessary levels of bureaucracy, trying to regulate everything in a uniform way for countries with vastly different demographics, and a frustration that the UK would generally 'play fair' whilst other countries would ignore the rules with no penalty. All of these issues seem to be highlighted at the moment.

Also a Leave voter - well put, that's exactly it. I very much support the idea of the EU - it has all sorts of benefits, as Remainers pointed out - but I voted Leave because of what it is in reality; what it's morphed into - i.e. all of the above.

@MarshaBradyo

10 months we’ve had to put U.K. with O/S posters being ‘horrified’ and ‘world laughing at’

And wondrous places where it’s back normal

My foot they wouldn’t be hanging around sticking the knife in for a bit more glee.

They'd be loving every second of it.

I'll bet a lot of the 'laughing stock' brigade said they were 'ashamed' that Boris Johnson declined to join the failed EU vaccine scheme, even though it's turned out to be absolutely the right decision.

Diverted from European factories? They were never intended for the EU because the EU a) has still not approved the vaccine and b) the UK had already ordered them

This is how I understood it myself, and if correct, the EU may not like it but that doesn't make it wrong

Bearing in mind that doses after the first few million are supposedly being manufactured in the UK, does anyone know if those ordered from the EU have all arrived and been used up yet? I'm just thinking it should be less of a problem if what's needed is actually being made here

Iced yep!

I’m sure I saw posters saying oh great we can order stuff that’s it haha etc

Turns out it’s pretty crucial.

@TooMuchYarn

I don't think it's right that the UK - or any other country - should be allowed to vaccinate more than than their highest priority groups. Approx 30% of the population of the EU/EEA and the UK is either over 60 years old or has one of the underlying conditions associated with COVID-19 risk. No country should be vaccinating more than that until ALL the highest risk group people have been vaccinated in all countries. But that won't happen, the rich countries will vaccinate all they can regardless of what happens in other countries. The UK wanting to do this is just the start.

The UK has contributed £548m to the fund for vaccines for developing nations. The EU is not composed of developing nations. Low income nations are much less susceptible to Covid than middle and high income nations because of a younger population and less internal and international travel.

Has the entire EU increased its Covax contributions enough to at least match the UK yet? It was a very low €500m last time I look.

@MRex

Has the entire EU increased its Covax contributions enough to at least match the UK yet? It was a very low €500m last time I look.

If that’s all they’ve contributed then that’s terrible!

OK. I can't stand BJ and I am a remainer and I was disappointed, at the time, to hear that the UK didn't join the EU vaccination scheme.

But clearly the UK government made quick, fast and good decisions around vaccine procurement and UK vaccine regulators have worked more quickly than their European counterparts.

The ridiculous story about Oxford vaccine only being 8% effective and now the EU stamping their feet about not receiving a vaccine that they haven't even approved yet seems like sour grapes.

Comments from German MEP Peter Liese seem to be upping the rhetoric around blockages of vaccines. Not good nor helpful:

twitter.com/darreneuronews/status/1354483646602817540?s=21

I'm sorry about this alienation, another side of the story (EU country, sorry Google translated).

They (EU) suspect Asteazeneca of having sold the stock of covid-19 vaccines that the company has previously received billions from the EU to produce for EU member states.
'I now ask Asteazeneca to live up to its contractual, societal and moral obligations' EU Health commissioner Stella Kyriakides said.

If this is true, EU paid for the possibility of early production. I don't know the ins and outs, but the last thing the world (especially poor countries) needs is a vaccine war.

Please don't make this an us against them fight, no one will benefit.

So they're "giving" us the vaccine. Vaccine we have paid for, on a profit-making basis. Unlike the AZ vaccine, which is non-profit making.

There's a comment there that this is an absolute gift for Euro-sceptic parties. This remain voter couldn't agree more.