My family have all had the vaccine and are now hanging out

[garlictwist]

My parents both have had the vaccine and my two sisters and their husbands as they are all nhs workers.

I prob won't get it for a long time as I am not in any of the groups.

Now they are all hanging out, talking about how they are going to celebrate my nephews birthday etc and I feel really left out.

Is this how it's going to be from now on?

@lovemirage but those people will also then mix with people not vaccinated so potentially puts them at risk some of who may be high risk as we do not know if vaccine stops you spreading yet.

Again, no evidence can be gathered on the real efficacy of the vaccine on suppressing transmission of the virus without allowing mixing - continuing lockdowns will not allow a true picture to be gained.

I also believe that as elderly and vulnerable people are vaccinated, if they choose to take the “risk” of mixing they can, and nevermind upsetting a few of you who seem to think those elderly and vulnerable should stay indoors indefinitely as you “put your whole lives on hold to protect them”.

Vaccination is allegedly our ticket out of this - so let’s take it.

[quote donewithitalltodayandxmas]@lovemirage but those people will also then mix with people not vaccinated so potentially puts them at risk some of who may be high risk as we do not know if vaccine stops you spreading yet.[/quote]
But unfortunately we won’t know whether it does or doesn’t without allowing it, as we can’t gather the data otherwise.

It’s a sad fact of life, but life is indeed about risk. There isn’t really any other way of knowing how the vaccine works on suppression without testing it.

Again, no evidence can be gathered on the real efficacy of the vaccine on suppressing transmission of the virus without allowing mixing - continuing lockdowns will not allow a true picture to be gained.

Are there scientists pushing to bin lockdowns to get that data?

@Bluntness100 I know the vaccines work, but none of them are claiming 100% prevention of disease (or even serious illness). Pfizer is claiming 95% reduction in death and serious illness, so 1/20 will still be hospitalised or die, and an unknown number will catch it and transmit it (hopefully far fewer than unvaccinated people, but not none).

If you send vaccinated elderly and ECV patients out to mix with infectious people, when rates are running as high as they are, some of them will die. It is irresponsible to do it until rates come down and risk of community transmission is lower. Vaccination will speed that up, but we can’t go back to normal until rates are much lower than they are currently.

@PurpleDaisies

Again, no evidence can be gathered on the real efficacy of the vaccine on suppressing transmission of the virus without allowing mixing - continuing lockdowns will not allow a true picture to be gained.

Are there scientists pushing to bin lockdowns to get that data?

I’d imagine there’s a few, yeah.

When you only hear from Chris Whitty though it’s probably easy to assume there aren’t.

When you only hear from Chris Whitty though it’s probably easy to assume there aren’t.

He’s most certainly not the only scientist I’m listening to.

Ok. Well based on this thread, if the vaccinated can make their decisions on ‘risk’ unilaterally, so can the rest of the population.

Including someone like me who is exceptionally low risk from dying. So I fully expect the previous lockdown frothers on lawbreakers to stfu. Because I too can start making my own decisions based on ‘risk’.

That’s a very dangerous argument to use

Is this not the point of the vaccine so that we can attempt some form of normality

And sod everyone else they might give it to. More selfish covidiots.

Logically there’s absolutely no reason why fully vaccinated people cannot meet with other fully vaccinated people.

And once a larger proportion of the population is vaccinated, things should be opened up. There’s no point in the vaccine if it’s not to resume normality, and quite frankly I think everyone should be risk assessing themselves a little more. If you have had the vaccine and want to see your mum who’s also if the vaccine... go see your mum. I mean ffs what nonsense it is to claim that even when vaccinated we should be continuing like this 🙄

Ta-ra anyway, I’ve really got to go.

@Jaxhog

Is this not the point of the vaccine so that we can attempt some form of normality

And sod everyone else they might give it to. More selfish covidiots.

😂😂😂😂

@sassbott

Ok. Well based on this thread, if the vaccinated can make their decisions on ‘risk’ unilaterally, so can the rest of the population.

Including someone like me who is exceptionally low risk from dying. So I fully expect the previous lockdown frothers on lawbreakers to stfu. Because I too can start making my own decisions based on ‘risk’.

That’s a very dangerous argument to use

I agree with you. I’ll start making my own risk assessment too same and my family are low risk. I also assume everyone here is ok with that, as it’s exactly the same thing as those vaccinated mixing.

There will be loads of sad face stories in the Daily Mail, 'I have been vaccinated and was mixing and I still got a fine, wail,'

[quote Changechangychange]@Bluntness100 I know the vaccines work, but none of them are claiming 100% prevention of disease (or even serious illness). Pfizer is claiming 95% reduction in death and serious illness, so 1/20 will still be hospitalised or die, and an unknown number will catch it and transmit it (hopefully far fewer than unvaccinated people, but not none).

If you send vaccinated elderly and ECV patients out to mix with infectious people, when rates are running as high as they are, some of them will die. It is irresponsible to do it until rates come down and risk of community transmission is lower. Vaccination will speed that up, but we can’t go back to normal until rates are much lower than they are currently.[/quote]
No one is denying this. And no vaccine is one hundred percent. It’s the same with other respiratory illnesses and the elderly and clinically vulnerable. It’s never ever going to be one hundred percent. It simoly isnt.

It’s about reducing the risk substantially. Expecting everyone to stop until it’s one hundred percent gone is ludicrous. And no one is saying send them out to mix with the ineffectious. This thread is about family members all vaccinated socialising together in a bubble. The op has on no way indicates that the family do not take all other precautions and comply.

@Igglepigglesgrubbyblanket

Oh how wonderful for them! I can see why you are upset but if they are all vaccinated they won't catch it from each other. I know the rules say not to mix, but tbh I can see why they would ignore once vaccinated. Ahhh! I'm jealous too!

Sorry this is wrong information. The vaccine does not stop you catching covid one bit, you have the same chance as anyone else to catch it. What it does do is get your body fighting it as soo as it detects it, so you get a milder version or it doesn’t develop. During that time you can still spread it. You can still spread it in the usual way of touch etc. Some people who’ve had the vaccine will still need hospital treatment.

Until you’ve had both vaccines you are not considered vaccinated. Some people won’t mount a response.

Not great understanding there from NHS workers.

@Bluntness100 but it's a made up bubble, that many people can't legally mix at the moment. I'm assuming they don't all stay in their homes at all other times. 4 of them are NHS workers I would be amazed if they all WFH

@TransplantedScouser

I’d personally support a system where by if your vaccinated you have a wrist band and can get your life back.

And I say that as a 44 year old down the pecking order.

We need people to start living again not existing

That would have been a way of protecting the economy. In that case, the government would have needed to vaccinate the working population first rather than retired / elderly people, who can isolate at home.... not talking about care homes.

I can’t see many younger people supporting that scheme and there would be a ton of abuse. The youth are giving up the most when they have the least and need the most resources. Retired people are more likely to have stable housing; if purchased, paid far less for than today’s prices, a pension and often younger family members or failing that meals on wheels to provide food; plus having priority delivery with some supermarkets.

I understand the reasons behind going down the population on an age basis. But I don’t think it’s ok for the 60 plus then to go and have a ball whilst everyone else is staying at home and ruining children’s education to protect the nhs.

[quote ineedaholidaynow]@Bluntness100 but it's a made up bubble, that many people can't legally mix at the moment. I'm assuming they don't all stay in their homes at all other times. 4 of them are NHS workers I would be amazed if they all WFH[/quote]
Of course it’s a made up bubble and we are all fully aware it’s against the rules. And yes the siblings will work and take their normal precautions at work

Where are you going with it? It will not be fully eradicated in the short term. That’s not what the vaccine does. It’s totally unrealistic to aim for 100 percent.

When enough people who are vulnerable to serious illness are vaccinated the restrictions will be lifted. We will all be in the same boat. Able to mix. But still not one hundred percent. There is no suggestion society shuts down till they totall eradicate it

Given that vaccinated people can still carry and pass on the virus, EVERYONE should behave as if we are in lockdown, until the whole country has been vaccinated.

The tables have been turned, haven't they?

At the start of the pandemic, young people put their lives on hold, to protect the old and the vulnerable.

Once the old and the vulnerable have all been vaccinated, will they stay indoors to protect the people who previously protected them?

I genuinely don’t understand why vaccinated people cannot mix amongst themselves

Because none of the vaccines are 100% effective (particularly after one dose) so you can still catch Covid, albeit less seriously than you might otherwise have done. And we don't yet know the likelihood that they will pass Covid onto anyone else. The vaccine has not eradicated their risk of Covid; it has just reduced it!

Both DH and I had been vaccinated - and we still follow the rules. Yes, we feel safer, but we know there is a possibility for the vaccine not to stop the transmission, so we are still very careful

yes lets all mix because thats how they find out if it works

fucking idiots

Is this real? I've had the vaccine as have many of my friends and relatives (NHS workers or in priority groups) and no one is behaving any differently as the first dose doesn't provide enough protection.

Goodness I can’t relate to this.

Relief and joy? Yes.

Saint Boris is desperately trying to avert this envy by instructing his merry men to say "the vaccine isn't very effective" - the government are deliberately underselling the vaccine, so people don't fight over it. They'll probably switch the narrative to "Looooooooooook! The vaccine is working!!!!!!!!" when it suits them.

There's only so long this insane destruction of mental health and the economy can go on for. Sooner or later, we are going to have to learn to live with the virus. Young people are being forced to sacrifice their lives on the altar of Saint Boris's lockdown, and not just in the short term: lockdown is going to have a very long-lasting legacy, lasting years, if not decades. If we're going to talk about "deniers", there are many, many "deniers" of this fact, especially in Her Majesty's government.