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We need to be given an end date

344 replies

Billie18 · 12/01/2021 09:10

Vaccinations being rolled out and there will be a date when the elderly and/or vulnerable will have been vaccinated. It should be possible to announce a date now when this will have happened. On this date all restrictions should be lifted. Why has no date been given?

OP posts:
Imaginetoday · 12/01/2021 16:57

[quote KeepOnKeepingOnAgainandAgain]@Imaginetoday - forgive me for questioning you but what is the difference between this vaccine - with no data to support impact on transmission or data to support length of effectivity (on severity of illness) and other vaccines - say measles?

Do other vaccines mean that you still be infected and infectious but less likely to suffer severe illness? I thought vaccines meant you didn't become infected. Data exists with older vaccines - even if we are ignorant of it - but not so much with novel vaccines.

Is there even RCT that show that people who have been immunised with novel vaccines have less severe illness, shorter hospital stays, lower mortality compared to those who have not been immunised?

Is a theoretical reduction of transmission based solely on less severe illness so less viral load?

Why aren't other prophylactic treatments used where evidence exists?

Are people with greater transmission risks (working outside the home, younger, public facing etc) not being vaccinated because impact on transition is unknown?

I can understand frustration and confusion and the desire for absolutes. Trying to deal with scientific uncertainties and match this to political optimistic truths is a hard place to be. [/quote]
Re question around prophylactic treatment...not sure how you’re defining this?

There are massive hosptial trials ongoing all the way through the epidemic to look at treatments once people are ill. Lots of breakthroughs made including 2 drugs last week typically these have not been new medicines, just new applications of existing drugs that are approved for other illnesses. Some have been non drug treatments such as introducing CPAP. To develop a cure for covid would take years. Better to stop people getting it with vaccines. And vaccines are known to be safest form of medication.

PringlesForBreakfast · 12/01/2021 16:57

There can't be an "end" date. What do you mean by "end" anyway? End to all restrictions or end to the pandemic?

If it's the former, then they simply don't know for sure how this will pan out, so can only have an idea, not a set in stone date. Hence, we're hearing spring time as a starting point of life feeling a little more normal, should things go to plan.

I do understand the longing for more certainty. That wall I keep hitting is certainly getting higher and thicker for me in recentdays, but we all need to be realistic.

As the gov have said, this bit (the roll out) will be more of a sprint, but sprints are notorious with false starts. The overall marathon continues to go on.

lovelylittlepanda · 12/01/2021 16:59

Agree. The "consent" and "compliance" is waning, even amongst the sensible who can see the hospital figures.

The fatigue and complacency are setting in hence the ramped up "enforcement" stuff. Govt now have a very limited time window and they know it.

Another question though, would you believe an end date even if it were announced?

MrsFezziwig · 12/01/2021 17:00

All of which is why the utter faith being placed in the vaccines may have to give way to a more realistic plan for simply living with this thing

I see this opinion parroted a lot and when I have questioned it and asked posters how they propose we should “simply live with it”, I never get a reply. So I’ll try again -@Puzzledandpissedoff how do you propose we simply live with it?

Haggertyjane · 12/01/2021 17:01

Let me consult my crystal ball....

Oh look, the future is so cloudy I can't see

Bloody stupid question

hopeishere · 12/01/2021 17:02

They kept doing this. Normal Christmas etc etc and it but them on the bum so they would be mad to do it again

RedRiverShore1 · 12/01/2021 17:02

It will probably go on for ages, there will be slight liftings and then locked back down again, a life on zoom with home deliveries, I'm glad I'm oldish and had my life

Siepie · 12/01/2021 17:05

For the same reason that colds/flu's don't have an end date?

Are people saying things like this being deliberately obtuse? When was the last time you shut yourself in your house for months to stop somebody else catching a cold or the flu? The OP wasn’t asking when coronavirus would disappear, but when restrictions would be lifted.

I understand why they can’t give a date, but I do think it would be helpful for the government to put out a rough guide to where their thinking currently is, e.g. “when all over X age have been vaccinated and hospitals are under Y% capacity, we will start to lift A,B,C... when every adult has had the chance to be vaccinated we will gradually lift the remaining restrictions” or similar. They may end up having to backtrack, but this government hasn’t been shy of making u turns so far.

MrsFezziwig · 12/01/2021 17:06

I honestly don’t know one single person who prefers the current situation to their previous lives. It’s just a device used by OP and her ilk to disrespect those who are prepared to knuckle down and get on with things without histrionics - that doesn’t mean we don’t want it to end and it’s insulting to say that we do.

Ridcully82 · 12/01/2021 17:08

@ZazieSheHer

Well, they sent a meeting request to the virus on outlook, but it hasn’t got back to them yet.
🤣🤣🤣
Puzzledandpissedoff · 12/01/2021 17:22

How do you propose we simply live with it?

With great difficulty and a lot of heartache no doubt, but a useful first step might be to accept we'll never get rid of it completely and from that the rest follows in time

I don't pretend to have any "ultimate answers", but worry about the colossal faith being put in vaccines and what's going to happen if they don't prove the magic bullet so many seem to expect. Though no anti-vaxer I also remember that no virus except smallpox has ever been eradicated, and honestly feel the conversation could be widened beyond the suggestion that the jabs will save us all

EngineeringFix · 12/01/2021 17:22

@MrsFezziwig Yep. The idea people enjoy lockdown is bizarre and I've only seen it online.

EngineeringFix · 12/01/2021 17:25

Puzzled : Prof Chris Whitty said it was a matter of the virus being controlled to a level society was willing to live with , like flu. So noone is taking of eradication that I have heard.

MarshaBradyo · 12/01/2021 17:26

@EngineeringFix

Puzzled : Prof Chris Whitty said it was a matter of the virus being controlled to a level society was willing to live with , like flu. So noone is taking of eradication that I have heard.
No I hadn’t expected eradication
namechangereq · 12/01/2021 17:27

@Puzzledandpissedoff I don't think anyone thinks once the vaccines are rolled out the risk will be zero and no one will ever again die of Covid.

But it should reduce the risk of the NHS being overwhelmed because everyone does at once.

Some people seem to think that the restrictions are in place to stop us dying. They aren't. The government doesn't care if Nancy, aged 39 and two kids dies. They just can't have us all dying at once.

I think once the NHS is not at risk of being overwhelmed, it will be living normal life and if people die of Covid, bad luck.

We won't eradicate it.

CoffeeandCroissant · 12/01/2021 17:27

mobile.twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1349028472396472322

We need to be given an end date
rwalker · 12/01/2021 17:29

I can't believe anyone intelligent would even ask the question.

Poppyliveshere · 12/01/2021 17:30

🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️🤦🏼‍♀️

Seriouslymole · 12/01/2021 17:35

@rwalker

I can't believe anyone intelligent would even ask the question.
I can't believe anyone intelligent wouldn't ask the question frankly.
MrsFezziwig · 12/01/2021 17:35

How do you propose we simply live with it?

With great difficulty and a lot of heartache no doubt

So no actual proposals then, just waffle.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 12/01/2021 17:35

I agree in principle, namechangereq - and everyone else who said simliar - but I'm not sure you'll ever convince those the "one death's one too many" contingent

I didn't hear it myself but someone mentioned that even Hancock used those words, and if that's so you really do have to wonder what the hell's going on

Torvean32 · 12/01/2021 17:40

In Scotland we were told all over 60s will be vaccinated by the end of April.

Billie18 · 12/01/2021 17:43

@PringlesForBreakfast

There can't be an "end" date. What do you mean by "end" anyway? End to all restrictions or end to the pandemic?

If it's the former, then they simply don't know for sure how this will pan out, so can only have an idea, not a set in stone date. Hence, we're hearing spring time as a starting point of life feeling a little more normal, should things go to plan.

I do understand the longing for more certainty. That wall I keep hitting is certainly getting higher and thicker for me in recentdays, but we all need to be realistic.

As the gov have said, this bit (the roll out) will be more of a sprint, but sprints are notorious with false starts. The overall marathon continues to go on.

End date for restrictions of course. This should be when the majority of those vulnerable to serious illness are protected to the best of our ability by being vaccinated.
OP posts:
Puzzledandpissedoff · 12/01/2021 17:44

Sorry, MrsFezziwig, I cross posted with you

TBF I said quite openly that I don't have "ultimate answers", though I have a few not-very-pleasant thoughts as to how things might look
It seems to me, though, that the conversation can't start while folk still expect the vaccines to solve most things, and while I'm another hoping they work I just wonder if, and for how long that conversation can be put off

mineofuselessinformation · 12/01/2021 17:47

Hold on a sec, OP..... I'll get my crystal ball put. Grin