Tighter restrictions? What else can be "tighter"??

[R2221]

Schools closed, work places closed, nailbars, hairdressers, clothes shops, closed. My high street is dead and a couple of big shops are permanently closing down. We've been totally indoors, going out only to get grocery and exercise.

Oh, gyms are closed, no play dates, birthdays, dinners or even coffee with friends. WHAT ELSE CAN BE DONE TO STOP THE SPREAD??? What would "tighter" restrictions mean? To me, next tighter level means no grocery and exercise :(

My local hospital is totally full. I don't understand why.

@Mistigri

now that's what I call a lockdown

Yes. I find it amusing that you think the U.K. lockdowns have ever been strict. Spain was far stricter than France even.

I don't agree with all the French measures but I (mainly) understand and support the public health thinking behind them. I think it's important to understand that if you place enough restrictions on people's freedoms to gather and move around, and you enforce them, you may be able to keep schools open under some circumstances.

Spain's uber strict lockdown worked so well didn't it? We should all aspire to stop our children breathing fresh air like they did because it was soooooo successful.

This is a respiratory virus and people are advocating things that make everyone even more unhealthy and therefore more susceptible. Madness.

We can close what we like but the main issue is household mixing in breach of the rules. I can’t see how closing Costa is going to have any impact on that.

i passed someone on a walk at the weekend, he was vaping a huge machine and must have blown out a cloud of vape as it landed in the back of my throat and made me choke and cough!
now that was a frightening scenario.
if that was breath rather than vapour, would i know?

@Stressedmummyof4

We are in Scotland, places of worship are already closed with the exception of funeral or marriage. Nurseries are also closed.

I think we have a few more extra restrictions than England but it's not making a great deal of a difference. There is now talk of takeaways being closed too and I'm guessing that after yesterday's fiasco of the Celtic player testing positive after the Dubai trip there's also now talk of football stopping.

I'm unsure if all local authorities are the same but ours stipulates that BOTH parents must be keyworkers and that you have to provide a letter as proof. Also the list of key worker roles has been reassessed over the weekend. Also firm messages online from the council staying that if you are a key worker working from home your child should be at home with you and not in school, they also want to know in advance what days your child should be home/school.

I've seen parents on Facebook over the past week being open about sending their kids when they should really be at home because they have a days off through the week but they're still sending their kids, we don't really stand much of a chance when people constantly look for the loophole.

Scotland's case numbers have levelled off and look to be falling now.

We don't need further draconian crackdowns, we need sensible and coordinated vaccine rollout at this point.

Article in The Times suggests government think supermarkets are where a significant number of people are infected. They want social distancing enforced there which of course is a pie in the sky idea. But I expect they’ll want supermarkets to have fewer people in them so we’ll be going back to queuing outside like we did in the spring.

@BlueBaubles12

We can close what we like but the main issue is household mixing in breach of the rules. I can’t see how closing Costa is going to have any impact on that.

Because people get together to walk to town to buy one then all stand together chatting in the queue

@southeastdweller

Article in The Times suggests government think supermarkets are where a significant number of people are infected. They want social distancing enforced there which of course is a pie in the sky idea. But I expect they’ll want supermarkets to have fewer people in them so we’ll be going back to queuing outside like we did in the spring.

Good. Also stop parents with groups of children running around with no mask going in.

Everyone is saying to shut down everything non essential, some of these companies will have been shut on and off for nearly a year.
Most companies won't survive being shut again and will either go bust or start making lots redundant. Mental health is fucked anyway, most of us struggling day to day without that on top of everything.
People just need to follow the rules that are set now, lots aren't! Don't mix with different house holds and if you have a bubble then just stick to that, don't create lots of different bubbles because you think you can get away with it.

@Nowmum43

Everyone is saying to shut down everything non essential, some of these companies will have been shut on and off for nearly a year. Most companies won't survive being shut again and will either go bust or start making lots redundant. Mental health is fucked anyway, most of us struggling day to day without that on top of everything. People just need to follow the rules that are set now, lots aren't! Don't mix with different house holds and if you have a bubble then just stick to that, don't create lots of different bubbles because you think you can get away with it.

Yes I agree. You see people on here all the time bleating about they and their teens must meet up with people for their mental health. It's- in the main - bullshit. Just do not meet up with anyone.

@Skipsurvey

i passed someone on a walk at the weekend, he was vaping a huge machine and must have blown out a cloud of vape as it landed in the back of my throat and made me choke and cough! now that was a frightening scenario. if that was breath rather than vapour, would i know?

The answer to that is if you're uncomfortable with that, don't go out. Don't ban everyone else from going out.

"I understand that things are ever evolving but we are nearly a year into this and it seems very quiet on facts on where and how transmission actually happens. I would think this would be too priority so that rules could be targeted at the places that actually cause transmission."

I think on a few occasions when people have questioned the logic of a particular measure the response has been '"t's part of a package of measures, if you remove one....." There was some interesting evidence to the select committee a couple of months ago when the CSO was being asked about the evidence for a particular measure (I think dc football) and said that they don't decide or advise on the detail of the measures. The chair said 'ok who does decide that then?', but i don't think we got the answer!

It would be interesting to know the evidence base used when a particular measure is decided on - for example when it was decided to stop outside sport like swimming again (I think that's the case, hard to keep up) what was the evidence relied on that it caused transmission?

Spain's uber strict lockdown worked so well didn't it? We should all aspire to stop our children breathing fresh air like they did because it was soooooo successful.

This is a respiratory virus and people are advocating things that make everyone even more unhealthy and therefore more susceptible. Madness.

I know you were being sarcastic but what are Spain’s numbers like now?

Close all coffee shops , cafes and small businesses near beaches beauty spots , masks to be worn at all times, stop mixing households ( yes people are still doing it 😡

"But I expect they’ll want supermarkets to have fewer people in them so we’ll be going back to queuing outside like we did in the spring."

Is there any evidence on the effect that queueing outside in the rain and cold has on health? (I know there is a theory that it doesn't make you any more vulnerable to viruses, but am not sure what the actual evidence is.)

There seems to be little discussion in the press generally about whether the evidence justifies a particular measure.

I feel like there is so much more they could do before closing nurseries. If nursery closed and work wouldn't furlough me I honestly don't know what I could do. There must be so many people in this situation. Also DS is an only child - not through choice and he would miss the interaction with other kids so much. I have really worried about his mental health over the last year. I think if nurseries close people will end up forming multiple childcare bubbles just to cope which will totally wipe out the benefit of closing them.

And this makes my blood boil!
I’ve not been out of my house for 2 weeks now and we see pictures like this!!!
I’m betting that most of these people have coffee and drinks from a takeout place.

So many are meeting illicitly in homes. The hospitals are full now from the idiots who partied over Christmas 🤦‍♀️

@justanotherneighinparadise

Ok maybe a slight exaggeration saying im seeing everyone doing what they like.
However, i dont know where you live and if you work.

But i live a work in a major city.
Work in a hospital . Patients openly.admitting mixing socially. And some staff too.
Streets outside the hospital busy. Traffic busy

Young men in cars racing( i see it all on my relatively long bus journey). Could be travelling to work but 2 or 3 young men in a sunday, so unlikely.
Takeaway shops in abundance with staff and customers not wearing masks

Groups of teenage girls or lads getting on my bus without masks. All exempt maybe??
Ive done this journey.several times a week since the pandemic began
So i can compare.how busy it is .
Outside of work i go food shopping (if i cant get a delivery).
Take dc and dogs to park daily(walking distance).
I see no family friends.

Maybe im wrong with my observations, but the people i see dont look like are doing essential trips.

@justanotherneighinparadise

Spain's uber strict lockdown worked so well didn't it? We should all aspire to stop our children breathing fresh air like they did because it was soooooo successful.

This is a respiratory virus and people are advocating things that make everyone even more unhealthy and therefore more susceptible. Madness.

I know you were being sarcastic but what are Spain’s numbers like now?

I don't know but it has 0 to do with their first lockdown which had exactly the same effect as ours but with the added bonus of cruelty to children.

[quote Iusedtobecarmen]@justanotherneighinparadise

Ok maybe a slight exaggeration saying im seeing everyone doing what they like.
However, i dont know where you live and if you work.

But i live a work in a major city.
Work in a hospital . Patients openly.admitting mixing socially. And some staff too.
Streets outside the hospital busy. Traffic busy

Young men in cars racing( i see it all on my relatively long bus journey). Could be travelling to work but 2 or 3 young men in a sunday, so unlikely.
Takeaway shops in abundance with staff and customers not wearing masks

Groups of teenage girls or lads getting on my bus without masks. All exempt maybe??
Ive done this journey.several times a week since the pandemic began
So i can compare.how busy it is .
Outside of work i go food shopping (if i cant get a delivery).
Take dc and dogs to park daily(walking distance).
I see no family friends.

Maybe im wrong with my observations, but the people i see dont look like are doing essential trips.[/quote]
That makes sense. You are commuting and working outside the house still and so seeing things that I’m not seeing. I’m in a small village and only leave the house to get food shopping and occasionally (when my children’s school timetable allows) take them out for a walk. I see nothing.

Can people please try to look outside of their bubbles and see not everyone is the same?

How do you propose that works for somebody who lives in the country with little or no internet coverage to do online shopping?!
Not everyone has a shop with a few miles

I think this is the key, there should be more local 'control' for want of a better world.

A small island with no cases should be able to not allow anyone to visit unless they quarantine for, how ever long, you would still need ferries to deliver goods.

There should be laws to compel the likes of Tesco / ASDA to actually help, not just make huge profits so village X gets a Tesco delivery every other Monday, all residents in that village can place orders with no min spend and no delivery fee and no 'sorry no delivery available'.

Key workers who do not live near their place of work should be offered free accommodation near work if they are able to commit to staying there for a set length of time, I know that's not easy with child care but even if it's 6 people not crossing tiers it may be worth it.

Local councils should be able to 'lock down' small areas and restrict access if there are a number of cases in a small area.

where i went yesterday it looked like a pilgrimage

however there were take away coffee and bacon sandwiches and people were leaving their empty coffee cups on the dog poo bin!

"I’ve not been out of my house for 2 weeks now and we see pictures like this!!!"

Is that a problem though (this is the photo of the beach) - people are exercising, no particular evidence in that photo that they're not in their household groups. And you can't really judge the 6' distance from this type of photo, as we have learnt this year! I'm not sure that there's evidence that that type of scene increases transmission particularly. If it does, we need to know, obviously. The new mutant has been around for some time - have tests on transmissibility been carried out by now?

@TrustTheGeneGenie

no i am not advocating banning people from going out, i was pointing out the vapour reached the back of my throat,
therefore keep your distance

Household mixing, a huge issue and totally insurmountable because people won’t comply.

Neighbour across the road had three visitor cars outside earlier in the week. I know her circumstances, there’s no valid reason for it. Perfectly intelligent lady, what would be the point reporting it? To whom?

Closing Costa will make no difference. The unpalatable truth is that some people don’t listen or care, and the NHS will be overwhelmed now in some areas. BBC news yesterday talking about high infection rates in Barking and Dagenham with three men in the background enjoying a convivial fag in a bus shelter. I do rather resent having my freedoms curtailed further and further due to the actions of a minority of idiots; they won’t change their behaviour any further now.