To expect to be able to choose not to have the vaccine without being made to feel uncomfortable? *edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

[Drogonssmile]

Risking a flaming here:

I work in the NHS not patient facing. Our Trust has said all non frontline staff are likely to be offered the vaccine next week. (1000 staff have already been done which is brilliant!)

I'm a fit and healthy 39 year old with no underlying health conditions. I am not an anti vaxxer however I am concerned about the lack of long term research that has understandably not been able to be done on the vaccine and have made an informed decision that I probably won't have it. I'd prefer my dose to go to someone more vulnerable. I believe this should be my choice.
My colleague is 62 and is all for having the vaccine which is great. I said I probably wouldn't as it doesn't affect transmission only the severity of the illness. Now she isn't speaking to me.
AIBU?

(Also given the amount of setbacks and govt lies/omissions in the last 10 months I wouldn't be at all surprised if the vaccine isn't the silver bullet we've been told to expect. The way things are going I can see is in the same situation in 12 months time).

@PolarExpressislate

I'm frontline NHS and ECV and an not having a rushed through vaccine. I've given enough injections and done enough training over the years to know this is not right and extremely questionable.

Please take the time to look into this some more, particularly if you're ECV.

I honestly cannot believe the bigotry on here.

Here are some papers pointing out the presence of sites which may have potential for molecular mimicry of covid-19.

The disease is increasingly showing itself to be autoimmune in its most serious life-threatening form. People who already have a tendency for autoimmunity, like myself, should consider whether taking any covid-19 vaccine is wise. These aren't my ideas, there are many papers by scientists covering this. e.g.

www.bmj.com/content/371/bmj.m4347/rr-6

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7499017/

www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.11.12.344424v1.full

I think to each their own and nobody will be forced, but it is a selfish decision. We don’t know about transmission yet, but with other past vaccines it is likely lean towards that it will at least reduce transmission if not prevent it. The other thing is, fit and healthy people can get very ill too and need hospital care and there is the potential for long Covid. Both these will cause a higher uptake in resources that are needed else where and if could be prevented by vaccination, this would make a huge difference if the majority get it(including you). I think you are entitled to refuse, but people are also entitled to feel how they feel about you making that decision when it could potentially have an impact on them or their loved ones who maybe genuinely can’t get the vaccine (might have health reasons or have to wait on it).

YANBU
Your work colleague sounds very childish. Ido hope her ‘not speaking’ doesn’t affect her ability to do her job properly.

It should be a personal choice and not be discussed in the work place. Everyone on here is a scientist and deems the vaccine a godsend that’ll transform our lives. YABU to believe you wouldn’t get a roasting!

@Yummymummy2020

I think to each their own and nobody will be forced, but it is a selfish decision. We don’t know about transmission yet, but with other past vaccines it is likely lean towards that it will at least reduce transmission if not prevent it. The other thing is, fit and healthy people can get very ill too and need hospital care and there is the potential for long Covid. Both these will cause a higher uptake in resources that are needed else where and if could be prevented by vaccination, this would make a huge difference if the majority get it(including you). I think you are entitled to refuse, but people are also entitled to feel how they feel about you making that decision when it could potentially have an impact on them or their loved ones who maybe genuinely can’t get the vaccine (might have health reasons or have to wait on it).

Since when were people not selfish? Particularly when considering their own and their families health. If you genuinely believe it presents a relative risk to yourself vs. not having it, why are you not permitted to follow that logic? For the greater good? Let's do away with differential salaries then, for the greater good.

@SRYnegative I don’t think a person getting a different salary is comparable to a public health issue at the magnitude of a pandemic. For the record, I have no issue with people being on different pay scales. And I also agree, people are selfish, hence why I stated it is what I would personally consider a selfish choice but to each their own, which is saying the op is allowed to follow that logic if he or she so chooses, as we all are. I think if during a pandemic someone puts out that they will willingly refuse the vaccine, they will likely get a negative response from many as a result of doing that whether it’s considered their right to refuse or not. Everyone has to make the choice for themselves, and perhaps the colleague shouldn’t have reacted by sulking, but I do agree with the poster who said it’s not a matter to be discussed at work, at least not if you don’t want a potential fall out.

Not unreasonable at all. Your body... It doesn't stop the spread so people are talking utter bollocks.

You don't know this. None does and lots of people think it does stop the spread. Scientifically, logically it would.

Only you can decide if you want the vaccine or not, your colleague is being pathetic and childish though. She doesn't have to agree with your decision by any means but to give you the silent treatment because of it is absurd. She needs to grow up and act professionally.
Personally I'd jump at the chance, my DH said he won't have it. I think he's wrong he thinks I'm wrong, but we aren't going to fall out about it or convince each other who's right we'll respect each others decision and carry on although if that fucker catches covid after declining a vaccine he needn't think im playing nurse -maid to him when he's too ill to get out of bed

Now the government seems to think they can mix the different types of vaccines or delay the second vaccine by a few months . This is all against the advice of the manufacturers. YANBU

I think I would wait a year or so to actually see if it's effective.

This post has triggered so many people it's actually a bit sad

I think I would wait a year or so to actually see if its effective

So stick with life as we have now for another year before we decide to act, great plan 👍 and that's the reality if everyone thinks the same as this

The way I see it, you're either going to get a new virus (with no studies on long term effects) OR a vaccine (with no studies on long term effects). I would go for the man-made vaccine over a bat-made virus any day!

@wherewildthingsare

Now the government seems to think they can mix the different types of vaccines

The government has already said this is fake news and asked the NYJ to rectify the article. Would people please stop repeating this?

I would go for the man-made vaccine over a bat-made virus any day!

I know this is a serious subject but this really made me laugh

@SRYnegative

presence of sites which may have potential for molecular mimicry of covid-19

Thank you for the links.

Exactly, most people are cautious as they have a specific concern - in my case it's autoimmunity, for others it may be allergies or TTC for instance, they are not rejecting them for no reason

It's likely that, as more vaccine types become available or as more is known regarding these specific issues, those who are hesitant now will get vaccinated.

But being bullied and gleefully told one will become an outcast of society is not on.

[quote trulydelicious]@SRYnegative

presence of sites which may have potential for molecular mimicry of covid-19

Thank you for the links.

Exactly, most people are cautious as they have a specific concern - in my case it's autoimmunity, for others it may be allergies or TTC for instance, they are not rejecting them for no reason

It's likely that, as more vaccine types become available or as more is known regarding these specific issues, those who are hesitant now will get vaccinated.

But being bullied and gleefully told one will become an outcast of society is not on.[/quote]
Agreed

Unfortunately there certainly seems to be a group of people who have really shown a nasty side. As you say, bullying others if they dare to not agree with them or legitimately question anything to do with lockdowns, vaccines etc or have any concerns.

I just don’t know if these people are using their fear as their reason to treat others like this but as you rightly say, it’s not on.
Everyone has their own views, and no matter if you agree with somebody else’s view of not there is no reason to bully, name all, etc

@wherewildthingsare

Now the government seems to think they can mix the different types of vaccines or delay the second vaccine by a few months . This is all against the advice of the manufacturers. YANBU

I think I would wait a year or so to actually see if it's effective.

That is demonstrably untrue. Stop spreading lies of lazy journalists!

Agreed @Timbucktime

I'm really concerned with how fast this vaccine has been pushed through. I'm going to do my research before deciding

Are you now? With the microbiology lab in your basement and your advanced degrees in the relevant sciences?

Why do people who barely got a C in GCSE maths think they can "do their own research" on such things? Generally it actually means "I'll look at youtube videos until someone confirms my bias"

@IceIceBebe

I'm really concerned with how fast this vaccine has been pushed through. I'm going to do my research before deciding

Are you now? With the microbiology lab in your basement and your advanced degrees in the relevant sciences?

Why do people who barely got a C in GCSE maths think they can "do their own research" on such things? Generally it actually means "I'll look at youtube videos until someone confirms my bias"

I agree. The scientists involved in the vaccine aren't humans who could have made a mistake. They are definitely 100% right in everything they do and we should trust them entirely with our health, no questions asked. Anything to avoid a virus that, if you get it, you are almost guaranteed to survive.

Makes total sense.

@Darcy2

The way I see it, you're either going to get a new virus (with no studies on long term effects) OR a vaccine (with no studies on long term effects). I would go for the man-made vaccine over a bat-made virus any day!

Well quite.

I agree. The scientists involved in the vaccine aren't humans who could have made a mistake. They are definitely 100% right in everything they do and we should trust them entirely with our health, no questions asked. Anything to avoid a virus that, if you get it, you are almost guaranteed to survive. They are humans who work within tightly controlled procedures, checks and measures. Both vaccines available in the UK are based on well known and widely used carriers, there's a bulk of infomration on them. None of the checks and measures were missed. Independent bodies check and double check the data. Nothing was skimped.

Makes total sense. It really didn't! Because you are ignoring almost every salient fact other than the one you like: covid isn't all that deadly!

I agree. The scientists involved in the vaccine aren't humans who could have made a mistake. They are definitely 100% right in everything they do and we should trust them entirely with our health, no questions asked. Anything to avoid a virus that, if you get it, you are almost guaranteed to survive

THAT'S what you took from my post? Way to prove my point!! You in particular are complete incapable of doing your own research.....

I'm not almost guranteed to survive, should I get it, but thanks for caring about those less healthy than you

@CuriousaboutSamphire

I agree. The scientists involved in the vaccine aren't humans who could have made a mistake. They are definitely 100% right in everything they do and we should trust them entirely with our health, no questions asked. Anything to avoid a virus that, if you get it, you are almost guaranteed to survive. They are humans who work within tightly controlled procedures, checks and measures. Both vaccines available in the UK are based on well known and widely used carriers, there's a bulk of infomration on them. None of the checks and measures were missed. Independent bodies check and double check the data. Nothing was skimped.

Makes total sense. It really didn't! Because you are ignoring almost every salient fact other than the one you like: covid isn't all that deadly!

One of my previous jobs was writing about medical errors.

Maybe that's why I really really don't understand why people are so quick to just say 'yes inject me with this new substance when no one knows the long term outcome.'

I'm not anti-vax at all, but there is no way on earth I would trust a vaccine rushed through in the way this was. One of the vaccine trials was fucked up because they gave the wrong dose. It was an honest mistake, it didn't kill anyone but it's such a basic fucking error it shows you what really happens when people are working under enormous pressure - they miss things, they slip up, unintended things happen.

There is every chance the vaccine is just fine. The thing is that we don't know. If you're willing to take the gamble, fill your boots. There is no evidence whatsoever that for me, personally, that gamble is worth it. I have pretty much zero chance of dying from covid so even a 0.01% chance of negative outcomes from the vaccine is too much. What would be worse is to accept that negative outcome and still get covid, which is also a possibility. Too many variables, too much uncertainty.