To expect to be able to choose not to have the vaccine without being made to feel uncomfortable? *edited by MNHQ at OP's request*

[Drogonssmile]

Risking a flaming here:

I work in the NHS not patient facing. Our Trust has said all non frontline staff are likely to be offered the vaccine next week. (1000 staff have already been done which is brilliant!)

I'm a fit and healthy 39 year old with no underlying health conditions. I am not an anti vaxxer however I am concerned about the lack of long term research that has understandably not been able to be done on the vaccine and have made an informed decision that I probably won't have it. I'd prefer my dose to go to someone more vulnerable. I believe this should be my choice.
My colleague is 62 and is all for having the vaccine which is great. I said I probably wouldn't as it doesn't affect transmission only the severity of the illness. Now she isn't speaking to me.
AIBU?

(Also given the amount of setbacks and govt lies/omissions in the last 10 months I wouldn't be at all surprised if the vaccine isn't the silver bullet we've been told to expect. The way things are going I can see is in the same situation in 12 months time).

Take a bow 😀.

Ah well. As one who didn't call you names but tried to explain the legalities as well as social mores I'll just accept that chastisement.

I hope your meeting with your boss went well.

Thanks Curious - that makes sense

I don't think there has been all that much 'frothing at the mouth', at least not as much as is being claimed by the OP and others supporting her view. Okay, there have been a few heated posts on both sides of the argument (as is typical of AIBU).

Mostly we're just trying to get our point across. It isn't just about you. It's about other people you might transmit the virus to. Even if you get it mildly or asymptomatically, the person you transmit it to might not be so fortunate; they might end up hospitalised or die, or end up with long Covid. It's also about protecting the NHS from being overwhelmed.

It's the 'I'm all right, Jack' attitude which causes feelings to run high and makes some of the responses heated, which shouldn't really come as a surprise.

Anyway, surely you knew what to expect when posting a thread like this on the Coronavirus board?

@Ken1976

My daughter, a front line nurse, had her jab yesterday. Was given the opportunity to refuse . She asked if anyone of the staff had refused after given all the statistics and was told one person . She wasn't judged because she refused so why would you be?

I assume you mean she wasn’t judged by your daughter!? Because both she and you couldn’t possibly know what others thought, unless there was a medical reason she couldn’t be vaccinated.

I’ve surprised myself, I have had a much more negative reaction to someone refusing it due to ignorance than I thought I would. I think it’s becayse we all want out of this mess. But I’m not alone As it seems so is nearly everyone else, other than a small minority who think the same as the op.

I think there is going to be some significant issues ahead for people who elect not to be vaccinated. Because it’s an ultimate act of selfishness that can hurt so many people.

@ThornAmongstRoses

The attitudes to people who don’t want the vaccine )which is completely their choice) is disgusting.

your not wrong there , would all fit in living in north korea very well , really really worrying to suddenly realise there are so many fucking wastes of space out there frothing like rabid dogs because somebody had dared post they dont want this vaccine

I've admitted my mistakes and taken most of it on the chin but there comes a point when smug posters such as yourself take a bow when being congratulated on spouting the usual mainstream shite make me despair

Ok then op. You have the floor, you tell us how we are going to get out of this mess? If it’s not vaccinations. And can you also explain why you seem so delighted everyone else is getting it? You even call it “brilliant” then suggest your dose is given to someone vulnerable. Which seems a bit callous seeming you think it’s not safe.

Because it’s an ultimate act of selfishness that can hurt so many people

From what I understand, health workers are being vaccinated for their own protection, not for the benefit of the rest of us. They have done so much for us over this last year, it's a bit much to call them selfish if they don't want to be first in line for the vaccine.

The benefit for the rest of us will come from our individual vaccines.

It protects staffing levels in the NHS, it potentially protects their patients from onward transmission - it's not a reward for service.

@Coyoacan

Because it’s an ultimate act of selfishness that can hurt so many people

From what I understand, health workers are being vaccinated for their own protection, not for the benefit of the rest of us. They have done so much for us over this last year, it's a bit much to call them selfish if they don't want to be first in line for the vaccine.

The benefit for the rest of us will come from our individual vaccines.

Did the op say she was a health worker? I’d assume not based on her lack of basic information.

The overwhelming majority of epidemiologists think it will reduce transmission. Absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence. This is why we vaccinate HCPs and children against the flu.

I think your stance is selfish the most likely outcome if you catch COVID is 2 weeks off work and transmission to those you live with. Meaning more days of work and/ or education lost. The most likely outcome of vaccination ? Protection from the disease.

What are you concerned about if you are happy to vaccinate against other contagious diseases ?

@Bluntness100 Yes, the OP did say she worked for the NHS but not patient facing.

@hopefulhalf

The overwhelming majority of epidemiologists think it will reduce transmission. Absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence. This is why we vaccinate HCPs and children against the flu.

I think your stance is selfish the most likely outcome if you catch COVID is 2 weeks off work and transmission to those you live with. Meaning more days of work and/ or education lost. The most likely outcome of vaccination ? Protection from the disease.

What are you concerned about if you are happy to vaccinate against other contagious diseases ?

That's brilliant. Please let me know where it says the overwhelming majority of epidemiologists believe the vaccine will reduce transmission because I'd like to read that. Thank you.

[quote Drogonssmile]**@Spidey66* before you have an orgasm over @CuriousaboutSamphire*

I am not an anti vaxxer. Neither am I overweight, smoke or drink. Can you claim the same? [/quote]
No, I can't. I've already said I'm a fat cow. However, I'm working on that....and the last time I checked being fat is not highly contagious.

I've got mild arthritis in my knees as a result of being fat, but that doesn't require any intervention. I don't even take painkillers for it, and im well aware that for it to go completely (or at least not get worse) i need to get my weight down. I've also got gallstones, which is more common in fat people, but neither arthritis or gallstones is infectious and only affects me. I'm on the waiting list for surgery (keyhole surgery, so in and out of hospital same day, so hardly a drain on resources). However, that is likely to be delayed by some time because of the pandemic, which will be longer if those who can have the vaccine don't.

"Anti vaxxers are putting their health at risk and the health at others at risk. That's what's so selfish."

..........

These are the same people who are screaming pro-abortion because it's a woman's body and her choice.

@Drogonssmile

Did your boss have any answers for you? I'm interested in what the stance is from an employer. Thanks.

This summary from Nature says that there are early indications that the Oxford vaccine reduces transmission.

[quote DumplingsAndStew]@Drogonssmile

Did your boss have any answers for you? I'm interested in what the stance is from an employer. Thanks.[/quote]
@DumplingsAndStew so am I. Unfortunately she moved the meeting until Thursday. I will update as necessary.

@Egghead68

This summary from Nature says that there are early indications that the Oxford vaccine reduces transmission.

Brill. I might have that one then.

These are the same people who are screaming pro-abortion because it's a woman's body and her choice

False equivalence. As you well know.

The op is welcome to do what she likes with her body. Anti-vaxxers can do as they like with theirs. That doesn't mean that that I think they aren't selfish or cowardly or stupid, depending on their particular argument.

And while we are off topic, it's pro-choice, not pro-abortion. No one is handing out leaflets saying you should get an abortion.

I'm not surprised there is a large overlap between people who are pro choice and people who are pro vaccine. Vaccine uptake and pro choice attitudes both rise as levels of education do.

@TillysMum02

So you will pay out of your own pocket for the treatment you will need when you catch covid then?

Do you pay out of your own pocket for cancer treatment due to smoking? For transplants as a result of alcoholism? Aids drugs as a result of risky sexual behaviour?

When you do you can begin to remotely suggest this is the way to go.

Unless of course all of our NI NHS contributions are to be refunded so we can plough into private cover?

@unmarkedbythat

I'm not surprised there is a large overlap between people who are pro choice and people who are pro vaccine. Vaccine uptake and pro choice attitudes both rise as levels of education do.

What a prejudiced generalisation.

Are you both pro vaccine, choice and highly educated as well as highly smug?

When does a well documented correlation become a gross generalisation?

There are a few intelligent contributions to the thread but the level of vitriol coming from many is disgusting.

The OP is not being unreasonable, it is the fundamental right of every human being to have autonomy over what they inject or imbibe in relation to their own bodies. if you take away that right you take away one of the most fundamental rights and qualities over what constitutes being human.

The main argument over people taking the vaccine is to protect the NHS - quite ironic that many who are screaming like demented banshees regarding any cynicism over a vaccine are either drinkers or obese which are two factors that contribute to more hospital admissions than covid ever will for the under 60s and even over.

The average age of death from covid is 82, the idea that young healthy people should be bullied into taking a vaccine which may / may not have long term effects on fertility/ possible other side effects is not just absurd from a clinical perspective but incredibly selfish from those repeatedly banging the vaccine drum not respecting free will/choice for a sentient, intelligent person to weigh up their own risks.

The people who often advocate others injecting themselves without weighing up all the risks labelling those that don't share their views as " selfish , ignorant" don't normally have the intelligence or perspective to assess a disease that has an average age of death above life expectancy. Allow people to make their own decisions without abuse which from many seems to involve banging their heads purple with apoplectic rage about to combust like an oversized blueberry too intrinsically stupid to see why younger healthy people may not wish to take a vaccine for a disease that poses very little risk to them.

Many elderly people wish to live what remaining years they have left without the continual doom and misery of covid. An 85 year old is statistically far more likely to die of cancer or heart disease than covid where many of the deaths from the dreaded covid are with covid not because of it. A 90 year old that dies " with heart surgery in 2019 and terminal cancer that tests positive of covid is classified as a covid death - there is a distinct difference between dying with and because of a disease.

Ignore the stupidity OP, I work in the NHS also and have done so for 25 years and wouldn't go anywhere near the vaccine.. time people realised their own blinkered views of " people being selfish not taking the vaccine " don't represent everyone which includes many of my colleagues who are surgeons, nurses and people with a grasp of medicine not social media addicts screaming about the daily mail. For every " expert recommending the vaccine " you will find another that doesn't in a similar fashion to the lockdown nonsense foisted on society

God! So many claims, so little evidence.

And so unecessarily mean about blueberries too!