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The elephant in the room which is why these measures won’t work.....

206 replies

TransplantedScouser · 05/01/2021 11:24

It’s not shops spreading covid or garden centres or people going on walks........

It’s also largely not down to offices or workplaces or even pubs and restaurants.

Two things :

Schools because children are known infection vectors

And people visiting friends and family

If the government said we’ll keep open the economy but you can’t see your friends and family in private settings then it would probably have a bigger effect

Sadly the latter is impossible to police and you get people saying “why can I go to the pub but not see my mother in her house”

And it’s because friends and family do not socially distance when there is not someone making them. At least in public there are monitors to come extent in the form of external people and staff.

It’s people like my 76 year old mum giving her friend a lift to the supermarket once a week so they are in the same car for over half an hour

Or having my aunt and uncle over to visit - well we sit on separate chairs - yes, in a small living room with the windows closed because you are old and feel cold

Or my friends kids running up to give us a hug when we pass them on the street.

Closing the economy down is a smoke screen because what actually needs to be done is impossible to police

OP posts:
EeeehElsie · 05/01/2021 12:57

How do those who've caught it know where they've caught it? Presumably they've been places other than the pub or work/had deliveries etc. How can you be so certain?

nuitdesetoiles · 05/01/2021 13:02

Thank you for naming it OP. The fact the rest of us are living in some weird kind of purgatory because elderly relatives and their extended families feel it's their "right" to mix is getting extremely frustrating. We're now seeing the results of the Xmas mixing with increased cases and admissions.

Heated WhatsApp exchange with a friend yesterday as she felt I was being judgemental about her choice to use her elderly DM as childcare for her school age DC's. It's behaviours that that are keeping us locked up. She doesn't need that childcare, she could outsource it elsewhere and she could see her dm safely not in her house.

missyB1 · 05/01/2021 13:03

And what about nurseries bring open to every Tom Dick and Harry? As if under 5s couldn’t possibly be asymptomatic spreaders?!

LegoAndLolDolls · 05/01/2021 13:04

I'm just not seeing friends and family mixing IRL.

Not in person, not on FB. People are largely following the rules IRL

It's a virus. It has no brain and no moral stance. The reason it wobt just disappear is nature and evolution of a thing that has been perfected to survive longer than the human race has been around.

We want desperately to think we are in charge here, we're not.

To get it to completely go away and break transmission chains everyone needs to stay home for say 3 weeks or a month. Everyone. So one sees a Dr. No one buys food. No one leaves or entres the ok ever until 80% of the UK has been vaccinated.

Have a heart attack that month? Your death is for the greater good! Starve? Greater good, etc.

It's not palitable is it? We have to live with it and learn from it as it's not going to be the last global pandemic.

Plus all the people who want a China style set up, you do realise that a lot of you would have "disapeared" by now for slateing the states response?

TwentyTwentyOne · 05/01/2021 13:04

Three women and two children with one trolley at my local Aldi yesterday.

Not just Aldi. It's everywhere. I saw a mum and her 3DC, with the granny and then another woman with a pushchair with them. I couldn't get down the aisle.

I also went somewhere last night to top up and there were 4, 20 something men buying portable heaters for last night as it seemed they were going camping together.

Many people are just not listening and refusing to stay in and stay away from each other.

TillysMum02 · 05/01/2021 13:04

2 colleagues one with covid one with symptoms.... both caught from boyfriends..... who don’t live with them. We have always given full pay for isolating before....do these 2 deserve full pay when they have broken rules and caught it by mixing?

Have a colleague who appears to have multiple bubbles. One with her mum, one with a friend, one with a different family. How do employers manage that? Blatant disregard for rules.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 05/01/2021 13:04

Closing the economy down is a smoke screen because what actually needs to be done is impossible to police

Absolutely spot on, and sorry for repeating this yet again, but unless the vaccines prove a silver bullet this is exactly why we need a plan for simply living with it

TillysMum02 · 05/01/2021 13:06

Mum and gran and small daughter out shopping yesterday in our store

Kid aged about 2 had brought toy pushchair to push around with her doll. Holding everyone up, bumping into everyone. It’s just not on! ( kid was cute but still!)

Mabel24 · 05/01/2021 13:07

While professional sports are continuing and the DM is full of photos of 'celebrities' fannying about on beaches in far flung places, why should all the little people be expected to comply?

Seems to me that lockdowns don't work unless it's done like NZ did - ie close down the country. No-one in, no-one out and all flights cancelled (not that i want the NZ approach btw, just pointing out that the pretendy UK lockdown is never going to work, and guess who will be blamed?).

I could be fined for leaving my local authority area, but live near a major airport and flights are arriving all the time with no checks.

Why not try a different approach? The vulnerable shield and the rest of us get back to work, learning and living.

PicsInRed · 05/01/2021 13:08

@TheKeatingFive

We could weld people in their houses? How about that?
I liked the one in China where iirc they rolled hay bales across the carpark opening to an apartment complex then sprayed water in it so it froze solid. As a world beater, we must surely be able to best that for sheer ingenuity? Special mention to forceably carting the infected away in solid metal boxes. Let's get our thinking caps on. We can do it!
LemmysAceCard · 05/01/2021 13:08

A friend of DP's has ranted on facebook, he does a manual job and his wife is a carer so they cant stay at home, i think he heard someone moaning about him not working from home - not sure, so its all over facebook, he is getting applauded as he is having to go out and work and could get covid etc

Didnt mention in his rantings that until pubs were shut was there mingling constantly and just a few days ago despite being in tier 4 went to a birthday party in a house with loads of people.

But no, he will get covid as he has to go out to work. Prick.

storminabuttercup · 05/01/2021 13:17

Lots of people I know who get annoyed at people 'breaking the rules' also do so themselves. 3 different siblings meeting with parents but it's at different times and there are old so that's ok, or 'bubbling' with 2 households but they do the shopping for one so that's ok, or popping into different friends for cups of tea for 'mental health reasons'

I'm not saying don't see anyone but for it all to work people need to be really careful and not justify actions with lame excuses. I'm also not dismissing people have MH reasons to see people but the ones I'm talking about meet 2 or 3 different people, not how it's supposed to be.

What's the answer though? Like you say can't be policed

LindaEllen · 05/01/2021 13:18

I'm not sure what the point of this post is, because you're NOT allowed to mix in a private setting, and you SHOULDN'T be giving people lifts to the hospital.

The government can't hold your hand and stop you doing stupid things. You need to use more of your common sense.

BuntysTwinkle · 05/01/2021 13:20

It was said at the start of the pandemic - there are too many special cases and exceptions in this country who expect the rules to bend to accommodate them.

No, we don't want to be unthinking automatons, but for a country where many people seem to think an infectious virus couldn't happen to them, lottery ticket sales are still extremely healthy! Maybe it shows that we are a country of optimists after all...

PickAChew · 05/01/2021 13:24

The size of most living rooms does make it pretty damned impossible to stay 2m from an elephant.

NannyGythaOgg · 05/01/2021 13:27

@LegoAndLolDolls

I'm just not seeing friends and family mixing IRL.

Not in person, not on FB. People are largely following the rules IRL

It's a virus. It has no brain and no moral stance. The reason it wobt just disappear is nature and evolution of a thing that has been perfected to survive longer than the human race has been around.

We want desperately to think we are in charge here, we're not.

To get it to completely go away and break transmission chains everyone needs to stay home for say 3 weeks or a month. Everyone. So one sees a Dr. No one buys food. No one leaves or entres the ok ever until 80% of the UK has been vaccinated.

Have a heart attack that month? Your death is for the greater good! Starve? Greater good, etc.

It's not palitable is it? We have to live with it and learn from it as it's not going to be the last global pandemic.

Plus all the people who want a China style set up, you do realise that a lot of you would have "disapeared" by now for slateing the states response?

100% agree.

(And the elephant in the room is the number that get infected in hospital and care homes)

@Puzzledandpissedoff
Absolutely spot on, and sorry for repeating this yet again, but unless the vaccines prove a silver bullet this is exactly why we need a plan for simply living with it

this too

TransplantedScouser · 05/01/2021 13:29

My point is we would all be in a better positions if we kept the economy open as much possible but shut down schools and stopped people seeing friends and family in private houses.

But if they did that, people would be screaming why should jo blogs be able to go get a pint when their kid can't go to school and they can't hug their mother.

OP posts:
Purplethrow · 05/01/2021 13:29

My work place is staffed by mainly young men , many of whom are constantly going on tinder dates , they have no regard for anyone but themselves.

BuntysTwinkle · 05/01/2021 13:31

I follow a British-Korean couple on YouTube. They left the UK for Korea, with one of their reasons being that people weren't taking the pandemic seriously enough. Both of them had made disapproving videos on it (now deleted), they did seem to be following all protocol.

Within 36 hours of arriving in Korea they caused a national scandal by inviting her family and friends to their apartment complex to give her birthday gifts and cakes at the door. Their case has just been passed to prosecutors...

HarrietOh · 05/01/2021 13:33

@TillysMum02

2 colleagues one with covid one with symptoms.... both caught from boyfriends..... who don’t live with them. We have always given full pay for isolating before....do these 2 deserve full pay when they have broken rules and caught it by mixing?

Have a colleague who appears to have multiple bubbles. One with her mum, one with a friend, one with a different family. How do employers manage that? Blatant disregard for rules.

How dare people be with their partners! I don't live with my partner either, I should be punished.
SchadenfreudePersonified · 05/01/2021 13:36

I fully agree with you.

Not mixing (in our homes) with friends and family is the hardest thing to do - but also probably the most likely to spread the virus.

DeciduousPerennial · 05/01/2021 13:38

Unless they put the army on the streets, what exactly do you want?

KitKatastrophe · 05/01/2021 13:38

@Remmy123

My vulnerable mum got it from a pub. Prior to that she had been looking after my toddler inside the house with secondary school kids.
How do you know she got it from the pub and not from (probably asymptomatic) teens or toddlers? If she's so vulnerable then maybe she shouldnt have gone to the pub.
CakeRattleandRoll · 05/01/2021 13:43

Because we have so few cases, the evening news in Australia states how every new case that day caught their infection. Ignoring those travellers in hotel quarantine who have tested positive after arrival, I would say at least half the cases of community transmission seem to be from restaurants/cafes/shops etc.

emmathedilemma · 05/01/2021 13:44

We haven't been allowed to mix households inside (apart from extended household) for months and the numbers have still gone up despite pubs etc also having been closed.
I do agree with @MessAllOver about the "bubbles" though, my neighbour has been picked up (she has her own car) by 3 different people in the last week or so!

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